Neo-Darwinian evolution is in trouble INSIDE the scientific community

[Ronald]

Yes, you have been lied to. But you don't want to discuss that. The problem is that over the history of the Earth that the Bible has not been available to too many people. Yes, it was strongly presented in Europe and spread by the sword from there, but what happens to the billions of people that never heard the story?

You throw out a figure like billions, its easy for evolutionists to do that. We have no idea of how many never heard of Jesus. But I tell everyone who makes that excuse that they shouldn't be we worried about dead people they don't know, they should be concerned about their own soul, their eternity. Besides, God will judge a person by what they knew. And btw, Romans 1 makes it clear that man is without excuse given what has been seen and revealed to him, visible and invisible, all the attributes of God, and His Creation.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Cool! There's a nice little bright spot near my old home/university. It is hard to tell if it is immediately close to my home, but indeed I remember my days in unnergrad where our paleontology class was tasked with going out to the local quarry (as previous classes were) and go get fossils and do a proper paleontological analysis.

Most people just pulled up brachiopods, but I found a cladodont level sharks tooth from the Mesozoic in a piles of shale! It was pretty cool!

Nice, there was nothing too exciting where I grew up. Mostly rolling hills in glacial tills and a lake. Though there was an outcrop of very very pure sand in a couple of ravines on the farm I grew up on. I brought some to my eighth grade geology teacher and asked him what it was, and he had no clue. Perhaps if he had done a little thinking he would have realized that it was the St. Peter Sandstone. He once took us to another outcrop of it, a erosional remnant.

St. Peter Sandstone, at least locally, is extremely poorly cemented. A crust forms on exposed surfaces, but to sample it one needs plastic bags. Once through the crust a shovel is used. We went to a field trip to an outcrop of it called "Castle Rock" the eponym for the township that it is found in. It was well on its way to eroding away to nothing. The Platteville Limestone cap that enabled it to survive since the last glaciation was gone and it was quickly eroding way. The remnant is gone now. Here are some pictures of it from the late 1800's and early 1900's:

Rats, only half of that one copied. It is probably 3-D if one has an old stereoscopic viewer.

Though man probably sped up its demise, the extremely poorly cemented sandstone guaranteed a short life for that formation.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You throw out a figure like billions, its easy for evolutionists to do that. We have no idea of how many never heard I'd Jesus. But I tell everyone who makes that excuse that they shouldn't be we worried about dead people they don't know, they should be concerned about their own soul, their eternity. Besides, God will judge a person by what they knew. And btw, Romans 1 makes it clear that man is without excuse given what has been seen and revealed to him, visible and invisible, all the attributes of God, and His Creation.

One could easily make a rough estimate. Why do you think my numbers are not reasonable?

The problem with your beliefs are that there are just too many flaws in them.

 

[Ronald]

One could easily make a rough estimate. Why do you think my numbers are not reasonable?

The problem with your beliefs are that there are just too many flaws in them.

Basically, you are staying that Jesus had flaws! Can you share with everyone, the many flaws of Jesus, because He is who I believe in , everything He did and taught. Of which do you consider flaws?

 

[Speedwell]

Basically, you are staying that Jesus had flaws! Can you share with everyone, the many flaws of Jesus, because He is who I believe in , everything He did and taught. Of which do you consider flaws?

Your beliefs are Jesus?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Basically, you are staying that Jesus had flaws! Can you share with everyone, the many flaws of Jesus, because He is who I believe in , everything He did and taught. Of which do you consider flaws?

Of course Jesus had flaws. If you take his words literally he had quite a few of them. The mustard seed is not the smallest of seeds, snake handlers do die, faith healing is a fraud.

But actually I was talking about the Bible as a whole. Conflating Jesus and the Bible would be an error on your part.

 

[Ronald]

Your beliefs are Jesus?

The Bible is ALL about Jesus. I believe in My Lord and Savior, His words, His sacrifice and being raised from the dead. All that is important is reconciliation with God through Him. As for His return, eschatological events and such, I have one of many views about it, but that is not certain. There are things we can be certain of, the rest we'll have to wait and see.

 

[Ronald]

Of course Jesus had flaws. If you take his words literally he had quite a few of them. The mustard seed is not the smallest of seeds, snake handlers do die, faith healing is a fraud.

But actually I was talking about the Bible as a whole. Conflating Jesus and the Bible would be an error on your part.

There you go again. Jesus is the AUTHOR, THE CREATOR. I think Jesus was using figurative language, with a conman plant they were familiar with. The point was, a small mustard seed yields an abundance. He could have said sperm which is smaller, but that sometimes only yields narrow minded knockleheads.

 

[Subduction Zone]

There you go again. Jesus is the AUTHOR, THE CREATOR. I think Jesus was using figurative language, with a conman plant they were familiar with. The point was, a small mustard seed yields an abundance. He could have said sperm which is smaller, but that sometimes only yields narrow minded knockleheads.

Wrong again. When you make that claim you clam that Jesus is terribly flawed. The Bible is a work of man, and because of that is filled with scientific errors, moral errors, self contradictions and more. You are making a rather blasphemous claim because you are putting the flaws of the Bible onto Jesus.

 

[Ronald]

Wrong again. When you make that claim you clam that Jesus is terribly flawed. The Bible is a work of man, and because of that is filled with scientific errors, moral errors, self contradictions and more. You are making a rather blasphemous claim because you are putting the flaws of the Bible onto Jesus.

The only blasphemy here is your view that God doesn't exist and the Bible is filled with lies, myths and that YOUR mind has gone to the edge of the universe, inside and out of what life is all about, with reason, science and the creative powers and intellect of the magnificent mechanism called natural selecton and its followers.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The only blasphemy here is your view that God doesn't exist and the Bible is filled with lies, myths and that YOUR mind has gone to the edge of the universe, inside and out of what life is all about, with reason, science and the creative powers and intellect of the magnificent mechanism called natural selecton and its followers.

The Bible is not "filled with" lies and myths, but there are quite a few errors, myths, bad history, bad morals, and other mistakes in it. You keep making claims that are blasphemous. If you could think logically you would see your errors. Not only that there is no Biblical support for your beliefs that the Bible is the "word of God". It never makes that claim for itself. In fact it is all but impossible for it to do so.

If your God can't lie then Genesis is only a series of morality tales. It is not to be taken literally.

So, can your God lie?

 

[Noxot]

would not Gods lie be this universe? and it would also be his truth.

 

[Ronald]

The Bible is not "filled with" lies and myths, but there are quite a few errors, myths, bad history, bad morals, and other mistakes in it. You keep making claims that are blasphemous. If you could think logically you would see your errors. Not only that there is no Biblical support for your beliefs that the Bible is the "word of God". It never makes that claim for itself. In fact it is all but impossible for it to do so.

If your God can't lie then Genesis is only a series of morality tales. It is not to be taken literally.

So, can your God lie?

No, Satan is the Father of lies ... but of course you think he doesn't exist either. He has you right where he wants you. Living in denial and pride leads to destruction.
There is a huge chasm between us; I can't bridge the gap. Moving on towards eternity.

 

[bhsmte]

No, Satan is the Father of lies ... but of course you think he doesn't exist either. He has you right where he wants you. Living in denial and pride leads to destruction.
There is a huge chasm between us; I can't bridge the gap. Moving on towards eternity.

Opinion.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No, Satan is the Father of lies ... but of course you think he doesn't exist either. He has you right where he wants you. Living in denial and pride leads to destruction.
There is a huge chasm between us; I can't bridge the gap. Moving on towards eternity.

Too bad that your Bible is almost indistinguishable from any other religious text. If you want to claim that Satan is real the burden of proof is upon you. You are right, there are all sorts of unsupported claims that I do not believe in. I don't believe in the Loch Ness Monster. I don't believe in the Yeti. Why should anyone believe in Satan?

 

[Ronald]

Too bad that your Bible is almost indistinguishable from any other religious text. If you want to claim that Satan is real the burden of proof is upon you. You are right, there are all sorts of unsupported claims that I do not believe in. I don't believe in the Loch Ness Monster. I don't believe in the Yeti. Why should anyone believe in Satan?

Do you believe evil exists? Evil is not some thing. It's not physical, it has no mass, it is a relationship between a person and a thing or another person(s). A knife in the hand of a skilled surgeon usually is meant for good, but in the hands of Jack the Ripper, is evil. We know the difference between good and evil, well most of us. We know what we ought to do, but this voice inside us lures us, tempts us to do something else. We wrestle with this inner voice (an apparent argument with ourselves) and we choose. God is there telling us we ought to go this way and we know we should but sometimes want to go the other way. Now you would prefer to think all these thoughts and ideas are coming from your own mind, or maybe voices from the past, something your parents taught you or learned from a book. Sometimes it is. But there are invisible beings influencing your moves. When you do the wrong thing, there are repercussions, things go bad and you realize you should have gone with your first thought. Intuition some call it or the sub-consciuos. But you are not alone in your thoughts and your actions.But maybe you think evil is like a mutation. But it is not beneficial to the person. So why has nature selected it, why haven't we evolved towards our goodness? I suppose we need another million years?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Do you believe evil exists? Evil is not some thing. It's not physical, it has no mass, it is a relationship between a person and a thing or another person(s). A knife in the hand of a skilled surgeon usually is meant for good, but in the hands of Jack the Ripper, is evil. We know the difference between good and evil, well most of us. We know what we ought to do, but this voice inside us lures us, tempts us to do something else. We wrestle with this inner voice (an apparent arguement with ourselves) and we choose. God is there telling us we ought to go this way and we know we should but somethings want to go the other way. Now you would prefer to think all these thoughts and ideas are coming from your own mind, or maybe voices from the past, something your parents taught you. Sometimes it is. But there are invisible beings influencing your moves. When you do the wrong thing, there are repercussions, things go bad and you realize you should have gone with your first thought. Intuition some call it or the sub-consciuos. You are not alone in your thoughts and your actions. Evil is like a mutation that is not beneficial to the person. So why has nature selected it, why haven't we evolved towards our goodness? I suppose we need another million years?

Sure, evil exists. We do not need a mythical being to explain evil. And yes, some people are severely mentally ill. That is no evidence for a God or for Satan either.

Self interest is a positive trait. Natural selection is not perfect. Excessive self interest is eventually a negative trait, but it can't be totally eliminated because there are positive aspects about it.

What seem to be "negative traits" can survive for long periods of time because in the right environment they are positive traits. Take sickle cell anemia for example. It seems like an extremely negative trait. But in populations where malaria is endemic it is a positive trait. The trait is only life threatening (and not necessarily fatal) if one has two sets of the gene, one from each parent. If a child has only one sickle cell gene he or she will be a carrier and not suffer from the syndrome. But with only one gene one is much more likely to survive a malaria outbreak. I can run through the math for you, but there will be a lower death rate in populations where the sickle cell trait exists than in populations where it does not exist in areas of endemic malaria. Fewer deaths is positive trait and the gene is passed on.

In areas where malaria is not a problem the gene is selected against. It eventually disappears from he population.

Your simplified view of evolution cannot be used to refute it.

 

[AV1611VET]

Sure, evil exists. We do not need a mythical being to explain evil.

Really?

Is adultery a sin? is fornication a sin?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Really?

Is adultery a sin? is fornication a sin?

"Sin" assumes a god usually. Is adultery wrong? Almost always. "Fornication" is not wrong. One merely has a duty to be careful and honest.

Put it this way, you have no business prying into the sex lives of others. Including your own offspring once they are adults. Offering advice is fine. But that is about it.

 

[AV1611VET]

"Sin" assumes a god usually.

So does "evil".