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Need some advice on a different kind of struggle

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zstryder

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Hi all,

This is my first post on this forum. I apologize beforehand as this will be a lengthy post, but my thanks go out to anyone and everyone who takes the time to read through it.

I guess I'll start with my background - my mother is agnostic, and my father is a straight-edge atheist. I was raised in a lifestyle absent of religion, with the belief that everything that happens to me is a direct result of my own hard work. That is, I should never have to pray for food because we worked hard to put that food on the table, or that I should never have to pray for good grades because if I study then I will get good grades. Religion never really occured to me as something that I really needed in my life.

Fast forward to college - I had my first experience with Christianity thanks to my friends, as they dragged me out to join a student fellowship. Surprisingly, I enjoyed it because the atmosphere was very relaxing, and many if not most of my newfound friends here at college were also a part of this fellowship. It was awkward at first, but I got to know the pastor in charge of the fellowship - he was a nice guy, if a bit conservative, but he made me feel comfortable. I got comfortable enough that I would actually sing praise and pray along with my friends, even though it felt empty and even silly sometimes. But, it was fun, and I enjoyed it, because in someway it made my heart and soul feel at ease. At times, we would also argue about the existence of a God - us being engineers, these debates were very scientific, and the battles always ended in stalemate. I have come to the conclusion that believing in God is simply a leap of blind faith. You either believe it, or you don't. There's no way to prove or disprove the existence of a higher being. All this happened my freshman year.

My sophomore year, my classes took over my life, and I kind of stopped attending the Friday night large groups and the Sunday services as well. I would go intermittently, but never on a consistent basis. Remember that up until this point, attending the fellowship was really more of a social/relaxing sort of thing than something I felt I needed in my life. My junior year, one of my closest friends passed away in a car accident. He was a recent Christian convert (maybe 'saved' as of only a year or two earlier), but prior to his departure he left a disturbingly "happy" entry on his weblog:

"Really appreciate the little things in life... just chilling on weekends with friends... getting a random email or a phone call... a smile while walking to class... playing on the guitar... talking to mom and dad... hitting up your lil sister randomly while shes out at the mall with her friends... just these little things... makes life so much more precious. Thank you Lord... Thank you for the memories... the good laughs... thank you for each day and the even better times to come... Thank you for the cross Lord. .... =)"

It's almost as if he knew his time had come. When he left, I had broken down pretty badly.. I almost wanted to drop out of school for that semester because my grades had slipped terribly and I wasn't in the greatest emotional state. I started going to church again and going to service to seek comfort in God, but again my classes caught up to me and after a couple of months I learned to cope with my friend's death and knew I had to move on, because that's how he would have wanted it. I had seeked Him out, but to no avail. Again, I came back to relying on myself.

I have since graduated, and have a job. I have a long term girlfriend who is actually Catholic (Mass is quite a different experience than the fellowship services I attended in the past). I am thinking she may be "the one" and as such there are things I am slightly worried about. Her parents are rather lax and don't mind that she marries somebody non-Catholic, but after speaking with her I know my girlfriend would want our kids to go to church. I am not at all against this - I believe that religion is a great asset to society in terms of moral and ethical values - the problem here is that I don't want to simply go to church just to be there.

Through my college years with the fellowship I have often prayed in hopes of a response from up above, but I've never gotten anything back but echoes of my own prayers. It's been a 6-7 year journey, and it's starting to get rather frustrating. I think the biggest hurdle I have is simply believing. I'm not an atheist... I just don't know what to believe in. At the same time, I'm a very emotionally stable person. I don't get stressed easily, I've never felt lost (with my life or otherwise), or overwhlemed (except when my friend passed away), nor have I ever really felt like I needed to completely rely on somebody else. I feel like, by myself, I am capable of getting through life, and as I type this I feel like I could die without ever knowing Christ, and I'd be okay with it. But I don't want to, because I want to be able to share this love for Christ and God with my potential wife, and with my potential kids as well.

One of the hardest things is how Christianity dumps my world upside down. I grew up believing everything around me was a result of my own actions. Now to believe that all of this was planned, and ordained by some higher power... seems almost ludicrous to me. And it's not that I don't want to believe... but I just can't bring myself to believe. My first and most impactable 18 years of my life was religion-less - to suddenly have that come into my life and show me otherwise, is just ridiculously hard.

When people tell me "you should just believe, and continue going to church" it doesn't do much for me. I know the story, I know how it works, I've gone to church and I've prayed, but I'm not getting any sort of sign or response that shows me that I need Him in my life. In fact, now that I think about it, the only reason I'm even concerned about this is because I'm doing it for my girlfriend, and my future kids. Is that wrong?

I've been told this journey could take forever - possibly even up to the day I die. I don't want that to happen, and I don't think I could continue going to church for that long unless I something inside me snaps soon.

Am I approaching this in the wrong way, or is there something else I've missed entirely?

Again, I apologize for this ridiculously lengthy post, but I needed to vent somewhere, and hopefully you guys can give me some new insight. :)
 

Johnnz

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Hi,

Christian belief must have a reasonable basis for many people before they can accept it. As an engineer you have learned to think.

There is abundant literature available from Christian bookshops. You need to read some academically sound presentations of the intellectual and factual bases for Christian belief.

Chuck Colson and Ravi Zacharias have written good books, but there are many others.

John
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zstryder

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Johnnz said:
Hi,

Christian belief must have a reasonable basis for many people before they can accept it. As an engineer you have learned to think.

There is abundant literature available from Christian bookshops. You need to read some academically sound presentations of the intellectual and factual bases for Christian belief.

Chuck Colson and Ravi Zacharias have written good books, but there are many others.

John
NZ
Hi John,

I think you may be on to something. If I can find a reason or a need for Christianity in my life, then it might help my journey in accepting it more fully. I have read Mere Christianity by CS Lewis, but didn't find it terribly enlightening.

Is there anyone else who might have other ideas and/or suggestions for particular book titles?

Alex
 
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Daughter of His

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Hey Zstryder,

It really is more difficult for scientific minds to accept the existence of God without proof or logic.

You could ask God to help you KNOW HE IS, to help you to believe. Once you really know, you will understand that apparently blind faith. And you are right, many times that is exactly what it is. My hope is that He touches you in a way you cannot think is coicidence or imagination.

I so understand because my Dad grew up with a Moslim Mother and an Athiest Dad. He believed in nothing. As death became apparent, my Dad confessed Jesus Christ as his personal savior and was bapitized. I think of the awesome Christian my Dad would have been since he was a man of great integrity on his own. I thank God, still, years later that my Dad is now with the Lord. But my point is not to just know God's extistence as fire insurance but there is the best friend, confidant, comforter, protector, advisor, (and the list goes on) availableto you. Growing up, we would have loved to have our Dad be with us in church and attend church functions.

Well, now I need to stop rambling, but you see, you made me think of where I came from. My best advice would be to ask God to help you know him. Best of everything to you. Hope you "hang around" and ask any questions you may have. May God Bless you!!
 
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crossrunner

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Start with the Bible. Read the gospel of John first then the book of Romans.
I pray that you will find Who you seek.

Isaiah 12
2 Surely God is my salvation;
I will trust and not be afraid.
The LORD , the LORD , is my strength and my song;
he has become my salvation."

Mark 11
24Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

John 1
12Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God--

John 3
15that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.[1]
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[2] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.

God bless you in your spiritual journey.
 
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Matt_H

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Okay, lets try again. Hurrah for engineers! I'm in first year engineering.

In retrospect, this is a very long post. Please read it very carefully and very thoroughly. I tried to lay it out as clearly as I could.

Hmm... You don't want to go to church simply to be there? That's great! Neither do I. So why do I go to church then, you may ask? While I do go to sing songs of worship and to pray and to be with other believers, the primary reason why I go to build and strengthen my relationship with God, by hearing from other people what they have learned about Him and by studying the bible.

So you ask, is there a need for Christianity in your life? I think I would like to ask you the question in response, is there a need for Christ in your life? If you are at all unsure, or if the question is unclear at this point, do not worry, I still have more to say. :) It may become clear soon.

Questions are good. I can guarantee you'll find the answers in the bible, probably through other people's experience with it. So, I ask you to ask yourself another question. What is the purpose of your life?

Some people would say that their purpose is to make as much money or build their career or earn as many diplomas or be as good at sports as possible. These things are of no value whatsoever after you die. Is your purpose to raise a good family, or to help third world countries? While many people do these things, and they help improve people's live on earth, what good are they in the end? What happens after everyone you impacted is gone? What happens when you are gone? Are you sure?

This is why I need Christ in my life: to find a purpose to living. To find a purpose for going to church. To find a purpose to get up and work every day. What is this purpose? To help build God's kingdom by serving Him, worshipping Him, coming to know Him better and helping to bring others to know Him better, among other things. Absolutely nothing, not bankrupcy, not disability, not even death can take away what is invested in these things. And I must say, having such purposes in life brings unspeakable joy, peace, and hope! It is sad that your friend died, but in his life he was filled with this hope. The message of his that you posted is overflowing with the hope and peace that comes from knowing that your salavtion is assured! Nothing else on earth can come close to the measure of this purpose.

I have another question for you. Do you feel that you have a personal relationship with God? This relationship is what makes it possible to find such purpose in life. God wants you to know Him personally. But theres something that prevents this from being possible. People are sinful. Every single one of us. The bible says that "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." Would you agree, that none of us are perfect? Another question: how then, could it be possible for God, a perfect being, to have any sort of relationship with us, if we are imperfect?

Some people try to build this relationship on their own, through religion, good deeds, meditation or simply living a good life. But it is inevitable that we all fail at some time! We are separated from God by our sin, and since God is just, He cannot simply pretend that we're not guilty or that sin really isn't all that bad. It seems we're in a bit of a predicament here. There's absolutely nothing that we can do to have a relationship with God that is a result of our own efforts. Going to church, doing good works, etc, can all be good things, but they cannot make up for the fact that, at one point or another, we mess up.

This is why Jesus came. He did not come only to teach about good morals or to teach about treating your neighbor well. In fact, those things were not even his main message. The reason he came is to live an absolutely perfect, sinless life, and then to die in our place, and then to be raised from the dead. What this means is, when Jesus died, he took the penalty for every single sin ever committed by anyone who chooses to put their faith in him. This is what makes it possible to have a relationship with God even though we are sinful. When Jesus died, He bridged the gap that separates man from God, that prevents us from having a relationship with Him. When He rose from the dead, he confirmed his victory and made it possible for us to have hope. Only by accepting this fact is it possible to have a relationship with God.

Now this is what your friend realized: he is not perfect, he is a sinner, and nothing he could do would ever make up for that. Your friend accepted that Jesus died to take the penalty for his sin so that he may have a personal relationship with God. Your friend accepted God's invitation to enjoy a meaninful, purposeful life with the assurance that because of Jesus's sacrifice for us, we may enjoy eternal life with Him.

Let's revist the questions I asked you earlier. Perhaps you can better answer them now. Do you have a desire to know God personally? Would you agree that you are not perfect? Do you have a need for Christ in your life?

If you feel that you do, it is possible to start your relationship with God at any time. Pray to Him that you admit you want to know Him personally, but you are not perfect. Pray that you accept that Jesus died in your place, taking the penalty for your sins. Pray that you do want to find the purpose in your life that is only possible through knowing Him. If this sounds like it is the desire of your heart, pray right now! Jesus promised that if you accept him into your life you will begin a meaningful, lifelong relationship with God!

I do hope this has helped you in some way.
 
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zstryder

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Everyone, thanks for the responses!

To answer Matt_H's questions: "Is there a need for Christ in my life?"

I would have to say I don't know. I know Christ died for all of our sins so that we can build a relationship with God so that we may enter His kingdom. And unless I accept Christ as my savior, I know I am going to hell (to my understanding). The problem with this is that growing up in such an agnostic environment, I have no fear of going to hell..? :eek:

I have no idea what heaven and hell are supposed to be like. Unfortunately for me, that fear doesn't work in my favor (I'm not sure if I can bring myself to believe in heaven/hell for the same reasons I stated earlier) - plus, I would rather believe in Him because I want to, as opposed to believing in Him because I am fearful of hell. I know that I can never find "proof" that he exists, because to find proof would be to defeat God's will for us to choose our own path. Because if proof existed, then why wouldn't we believe? Nobody would want to go to hell if we knew He did exist and everything in the Bible was real.

But I think you may have answered the question for me in your post. I'm not sure I have a greater purpose in life. I think for me, I really just want to have a really close knit family and center my life around my wife and kids. I don't have big dreams of grandeur or leading a rich lifestyle... the joy in my life comes from my family and friends, and spending what time I can with them. Maybe through Christianity I can find a higher purpose than that. Right now, I don't know what will happen when I die. Maybe I just disappear? Sadly, that doesn't seem to scare me either... :confused:

And to answer your next question, I don't know if I have a personal relationship with God. I would like to think I do, because I have tried many times to reach out to Him, but I've never been shown a sign, nor have I heard a response... so I'm not sure how to answer your question. For me, it has been a one sided relationship for the past 7 years, which is why it becomes frustrating. To strike an analogy, I would never chase a girl for 7 years if she didn't show any reciprocation. Of course, I'm not saying that a girl can be compared to God at all, but rather the idea of chasing something that I don't know exists, can become frustrating.

I do agree I am not perfect, and I do agree I have "sinned." This I know - what I don't know, is if spending all this time, effort, and emotion into building a relationship with God will result in anything. So far I have been rewarded with a feeling of emptiness, silliness, and frustration, which is not the best feeling in the world.
 
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zstryder

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Daughter of His said:
My hope is that He touches you in a way you cannot think is coicidence or imagination.
Thank you,

This is exactly what I have been hoping to happen someday. I'm not saying that it has to be super easy and that I should be able to snap and become a believer just like that, but I need to be shown a sign or something to will show me that I'm not just talking to myself when I pray. This would be the greatest thing anyone could do for me now, because that first step, is by far the hardest step, especially for someone in my situation. I think once that first step is completed, the rest should be easy peasy in comparison... :)
 
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Ceris

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Greetings zstryder, and welcome to Christian Forums!

I can see from your posts that you are earnestly seeking God, and that is a wonderful thing. It is nice to see members like you who come here asking sincere questions rather than some who "ask" questions only to try and debate with Christians in the Outreach forum.

To answer one of your original questions: No it is not wrong that you are concerned about this because you're doing it for your girlfriend and future kids. Truthfully, I believe is shows how much you care for your girlfriend and for you future kids that you are asking such sincere questions for their sake.

One of the things that seems to be concerning you is proof, or a sign, or something to show you that you are not just talking to thin air when you praying to God. To be honest with you, there have only been 3 or 4 times in my life where I have had a distinct answer from God. The answers that he has given me have never really been awe-inspiring revelations, or blinding shafts of light from the sky, or a heavenly voice from the clouds. Rather, he has shown me in these few occassions what he wants me to do through giving me a distinct sense of "Go here" or "Do this". I say this not to discourage you or to let you down, but to be honest with you. As Daughter of His said, My prayer is that He touches you in some way that you will know that He is there and listening.

A book I reccomend to you, and you can take this reccomendation or leave it, is The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. It is a relatively inexpensive book and it deals with the evidence for Christ's existance, his death, his ressurection, and the reliability of the Gospels. I have found the book quite helpful at times while others have found it to be ok. The book does have a Christian bias to it (obviously), but nevertheless it is something that I reccommend to you. It might provide you with some of the evidence for Christ that you seek.

God Bless,
Ceris
 
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Paul_Wright_luvr

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hi, im not sure if ill be a lot of help but ill try. here is my story, it is short and boring.

have you ever heard of AWANA? it stands for Aproved Workmen Are Not Ashamed. i have been in AWANA since i was 3. this means that since i was three i have been memorizing verses and ive know all the books of the Bible since i was 6. one day, when i was 3, my mom was reading my older brother and me a story in his AWANA book and at the end it asked if we were a Christian. i wasnt and mom mom asked me if i wsnted to become one and i said yes, so i prayed to God and asked Him to become my Savior. i am still in AWANA and learning new things about the Bible.

but just recently i have been doubting God. i think, what if Christianity is all just made up. Buhdists believe that their realigion is true but Christians believe that it isn't. then i imeadiatly feel guilty since i have pledged my life to God and Christianity. then i get the same feeling again. my parents and i constantly get into fights and most nights i fall asleep crying and praying to God to help my relationship with them get better. but so far it hasnt. this makes me think of the verse that says 'Seek and you will find, look and it will be given to you, knock and the door will open' i go, i have been seeking, looking and knocking, havnt i? but i really havent, not in my most inner soul. i dont know if this is your problem, but search your soul and know what you want. i sounds to me like you want to become a Christian for all the right reasons, but you just need to be convinced. think of your friend. im sure he died in piece and im sure he would want to see you recieve the gift that he did.
 
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Bain_Adaneth

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Paul,
It's okay, I did feel that way too. But since we're humans we always have to doubt, so find out more by reading into the Bible more deeply, it's very very different from memorization. keep on trusting Him, and build that faith by trusting in Him. That's how he'll show Himself to you. pm me if you have more questions. Thankyou for posting..
 
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Stinker

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My sophomore year, my classes took over my life, and I kind of stopped attending the Friday night large groups and the Sunday services as well. I would go intermittently, but never on a consistent basis. Remember that up until this point, attending the fellowship was really more of a social/relaxing sort of thing than something I felt I needed in my life. My junior year, one of my closest friends passed away in a car accident. He was a recent Christian convert (maybe 'saved' as of only a year or two earlier), but prior to his departure he left a disturbingly "happy" entry on his weblog:

"Really appreciate the little things in life... just chilling on weekends with friends... getting a random email or a phone call... a smile while walking to class... playing on the guitar... talking to mom and dad... hitting up your lil sister randomly while shes out at the mall with her friends... just these little things... makes life so much more precious. Thank you Lord... Thank you for the memories... the good laughs... thank you for each day and the even better times to come... Thank you for the cross Lord. .... =)"

It's almost as if he knew his time had come. When he left, I had broken down pretty badly.. I almost wanted to drop out of school for that semester because my grades had slipped terribly and I wasn't in the greatest emotional state. I started going to church again and going to service to seek comfort in God, but again my classes caught up to me and after a couple of months I learned to cope with my friend's death and knew I had to move on, because that's how he would have wanted it. I had seeked Him out, but to no avail. Again, I came back to relying on myself.

I have since graduated, and have a job. I have a long term girlfriend who is actually Catholic (Mass is quite a different experience than the fellowship services I attended in the past). I am thinking she may be "the one" and as such there are things I am slightly worried about. Her parents are rather lax and don't mind that she marries somebody non-Catholic, but after speaking with her I know my girlfriend would want our kids to go to church. I am not at all against this - I believe that religion is a great asset to society in terms of moral and ethical values - the problem here is that I don't want to simply go to church just to be there.




I don't either! Many, many, people do though. No matter how good the worship services are on Sunday morning, if one is almost to the point of real fellowship total dehydration, those services will not suffice. Many churches of today consider 'fellowship' to be no less than a Hi! & Goodbye! handshake, to a once a month 'Home Group' get together. These things are a disobedience to the command to FELLOWSHIP in the New Testament. What you experienced in your college years is what is supposed to be found in the church, but is not in nearly every case. The only fellowship I know of that is compared to the the one you had in college, is found in the now de-fanged International Church of Christ. They only established one church in each major city and they have real fellowship with each other apart from the Sunday morning worship service.

Was this the group you experienced in college?
 
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