Near perfect existence

[Chriliman]

You've gone and failed to answer my question again. At this point, it's hard for me to imagine that you're not avoiding it on purpose.

I'm not asking "what causes an earthquake" which is the question you tried to answer here. We know what causes earthquakes...and if you believe that god created the earth, then you can only conclude that he created it in a way that allows earthquakes to happen.

The question is why didn't he create it in a way that earthquakes don't happen? Think of it like this....

You know how every time it floods in a place that has an open sulfur mine...the waters turn into sulfuric acid and burn everyone who lives in those places horribly? No?

You probably never heard of that because that's not how water and sulfur work. Had god decided to make water and sulfur work that way....you would hear about things like that....but he didn't, so you don't.

Well it the world could be a place without earthquakes...and the very idea of the ground shaking until buildings collapse would be a joke. That isn't how the world works though...there are earthquakes and they do kill people sometimes.

Why would a perfect god make the earth so that it has earthquakes?

The only answer I can give is that earthquakes are a result of how the earth was designed to sustain life. If the earth didn't have a hot core then there would be no earthquakes, but there also would possibly be no life.

Sorry if this isn't the answer you're looking for.

 

[Chriliman]

Can you demonstrate this?

And, going by what many people's opinions are of your personal logic, maybe it was Satan that caused the path's to cross.

Satan only causes death and sin. He can never cause anything good to happen, only God can do that.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Ah, but the answer to why God created earthquakes would reasonably not be a simple thing to explain, which is why I suggested studying seismology.

I'm pretty sure Ana the Ist is a girl, but I could be wrong

You're wrong.

You're wrong about the answer to my question being complicated too...it's not. There are several logical answers...

1. God made a mistake, and isn't perfect. (This answer also happens to explain a lot of other aspects of christian beliefs)
2. God isn't "good/benevolent/etc". This also explains many of the contradictions in christian theology.
3. God doesn't exist. This answer happens to explain the most in regards to christian theology.
4. God didn't create the earth. This answer leaves a lot more questions.

Those are just the logical answers I came up with on a moment's notice...there could be more. I don't think you'll find a logical answer within christianity though.

 

[bhsmte]

Satan only causes death and sin. He can never cause anything good to happen, only God can do that.

Who is to say the path's crossing was a good thing?

 

[Chriliman]

Explain why there's a 'why' though.

I can't that's why it takes faith. It's more of a 'who' for me and that 'who' is Jesus

 

[Chriliman]

Who is to say the path's crossing was a good thing?

Just depends how you look at it I guess.

 

[bhsmte]

Just depends how you look at it I guess.

You bet.

 

[Chriliman]

You're wrong.

You're wrong about the answer to my question being complicated too...it's not. There are several logical answers...

1. God made a mistake, and isn't perfect. (This answer also happens to explain a lot of other aspects of christian beliefs)
2. God isn't "good/benevolent/etc". This also explains many of the contradictions in christian theology.
3. God doesn't exist. This answer happens to explain the most in regards to christian theology.
4. God didn't create the earth. This answer leaves a lot more questions.

Those are just the logical answers I came up with on a moment's notice...there could be more. I don't think you'll find a logical answer within christianity though.

It seems the only reason for your logic is to attempt to disprove Christianity. If that's your goal, I can't stop you, however, your goals do not affect what is true. Neither do my goals, which is why I must have faith in truth.

 

[GrimKingGrim]

It seems the only reason for your logic is to attempt to disprove Christianity. If that's your goal, I can't stop you, however, your goals do not affect what is true. Neither do my goals, which is why I must have faith in truth.

No I believe it's to get you to admit there is no way to reconcile your belief and common logic

 

[Ana the Ist]

If my beliefs about what is true turns out to be true, I will be rewarded with everlasting life(life that is far better than current life). If my beliefs about what is true turns out to be false and God does not exist, I will simply vanish into nothingness when I die. I much prefer everlasting life with a perfect God over vanishing into nothingness(although I can understand why an atheists would prefer this, over judgement, but what comes after judgement is forgiveness you just have to ask).

It seems atheists are motivated by something that is opposed to God and they are more than willing to follow their own thoughts about what it means to be objective even if it leads them to determining that objectivity is pointless. Objectivity is pointless if we just cease to exist when we die. I don't see how an atheist can justify their opposition to God, when its their justification that becomes meaningless when they die. All atheists should deeply ask themselves "What is my true motivation?" It seems the true motivation is to watch Christian stumble and fall and for what? So you can be right? Seems like very self righteous behavior.

My motivation is to try and help you understand my beliefs so you can share in the hope and joy I find in Jesus Christ.

My motivation is truth.

 

[Chriliman]

My motivation is truth.

It's definitely true that you're motivated. If truth is all that matters to you, then you will find the truth

 

[Ana the Ist]

No I believe it's to get you to admit there is no way to reconcile your belief and common logic

I wish. All this time I would've settled for him just getting the question.

 

[Ana the Ist]

It's definitely true that you're motivated. If truth is all that matters to you, then you will find the truth

What do you think it means to be objective in seeking the truth?

 

[Chriliman]

I wish. All this time I would've settled for him just getting the question.

I'm still waiting for an answer to the question I ask you, which is why you brought God into an objective conversation about perfection. I just want an honest answer, I'm not trying to trip you up.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I'm still waiting for an answer to the question I ask you, which is why you brought God into an objective conversation about perfection. I just want an honest answer, I'm not trying to trip you up.

Honestly, I thought you were trying to make a point about the "perfection" of god in some roundabout way. I didn't buy into the whole set-up...and I still don't.

 

[quatona]

The only answer I can give is that earthquakes are a result of how the earth was designed to sustain life. If the earth didn't have a hot core then there would be no earthquakes, but there also would possibly be no life.

Sorry if this isn't the answer you're looking for.

I conclude natural laws pre-existed your God, and your God was unable to create a world that sustains life without there being earthquakes?

 

[Chriliman]

Honestly, I thought you were trying to make a point about the "perfection" of god in some roundabout way. I didn't buy into the whole set-up...and I still don't.

That's why I set it up so you can try it yourself. Start a thread about what a perfect society would be like and see who brings God in first. Obviously use a new website where no one would have seen this thread.

 

[Ana the Ist]

That's why I set it up so you can try it yourself. Start a thread about what a perfect society would be like and see who brings God in first. Obviously use a new website where no one would have seen this thread.

Nah...I don't see what that would prove. The fact that you "forgot" to invite theists and had another poster helping you towards some other point is evidence enough.

 

[Chriliman]

Nah...I don't see what that would prove. The fact that you "forgot" to invite theists and had another poster helping you towards some other point is evidence enough.

Your word against mine, I guess often times that's what it comes down to. What Peaceful said had no affect on the fact that you brought God into an objective conversation about perfection. I have no idea who Peaceful even is and you have no reason to assume I set up what they said, thus it is a false assumption. Your free to make false assumptions just don't expect to figure out whats true by doing so.

The only way for you to figure out the objective truth is to conduct a similar thread and see who brings God into the conversation first. If its an atheist then you can safely assume I'm telling the truth. Any other assumption is not based on honest objective observation.

 

[Freodin]

Any other assumption is not based on honest objective observation.

And that is extremely important, isn't it?

Except for all the other assumption you make without honest objective observations.

Come on, Chriliman, we all have seen through your bluster long ago. The only one who still thinks you are honest is yourself. (And I am not sure about that.)