MYTH OF GERMAN CULPABILITY

Supreme_Arbiter

Activating brain cells
Feb 14, 2004
150
2
48
I live on the edge of oicumena
✟7,792.00
Faith
Atheist
One of the great mysteries of life is that despite the evidence to the contrary millions of otherwise intelligent people still believe that Germany was the all powerful aggressor during the 2nd World War. Nothing better than these myths illustrate the mind-bending power of propaganda. The provable facts suggest that Germany was the victim and not the perpetrator of naked neighboring aggression. The subsequent allied military triumph was followed by the triumph of the propagandists whose pressing need was to depict the victor nations as being the victim.

THE BRUTISH EMPIRE:

"Germany is too strong. We must destroy her."
- Winston Churchill, Nov. 1936.

"In no country has the historical blackout been more intense and effective than in Great Britain. Here it has been ingeniously christened The Iron Curtain of Discreet Silence. Virtually nothing has been written to reveal the truth about British responsibility for the Second World War and its disastrous results.” - Harry Elmer Barnes. American Historian

"The war was not just a matter of the elimination of Fascism in Germany, but rather of obtaining German sales markets." - Winston Churchill. March, 1946.

"Britain was taking advantage of the situation to go to war against Germany because the Reich had become too strong and had upset the European balance." - Ralph F. Keeling, Institute of American Economics

"I emphasized that the defeat of Germany and Japan and their elimination from world trade would give Britain a tremendous opportunity to swell her foreign commerce in both volume and profit." - Samuel Untermeyer, The Public Years, p.347.

On September 2nd 1939 a delegate of the Labour Party met with the British Foreign Minister Halifax in the lobby of Parliament. 'Do you still have hope?' he asked. 'If you mean hope for war,' answered Halifax, 'then your hope will be fulfilled tomorrow. 'God be thanked!' replied the representative of the British Labour Party. - Professor Michael Freund.

"In Britain, Lord Halifax was reported as being 'redeemed'. He ordered beer. We laughed and joked." - H. Roth. Are We Being Lied To?

"In April, 1939, (four months before the outbreak of war) Ambassador William C. Bullitt, whom I had known for twenty years, called me to the American Embassy in Paris. The American Ambassador told me that war had been decided upon. He did not say, nor did I ask, by whom. He let me infer it. ... When I said that in the end Germany would be driven into the arms of Soviet Russia and Bolshevism, the Ambassador replied: "‘what of it? There will not be enough Germans left when the war is over to be worth bolshevising." - - Karl von Wiegand, April, 23rd, 1944, Chicago Herald American

"I felt sorry for the German people. We were planning - and we had the force to carry out our plans - to obliterate a once mighty nation." - Admiral Daniel Leahy; U.S Ambassador ˆ

MYTH 1. THE GERMAN NATION IS AN AGGRESSIVE NATION

The facts prove otherwise. A Study of War by Prof. Quincy Wright, shows that in the period from 1480 to 1940 there were 278 wars involving European countries whose percentage participation was as follows:

ENGLAND 28%
FRANCE 26%
SPAIN 23%
RUSSIA 22%
AUSTRIA 19%
TURKEY 15%
POLAND 11%
SWEDEN 9%
ITALY 9%
NETHERLANDS 8%
GERMANY (INCLUDING PRUSSIA) 8%
DENMARK 7%

Likewise, Pitirim Sorokin, Vol.111, Part.11, Social and Cultural Dynamics, shows that from the 12th Century to 1925 the percentage of years in which leading European powers have been at war is as follows. (p.352).

COUNTRY PERCENTAGE OF YEARS AT WAR

SPAIN 67%
POLAND 58%
ENGLAND 56%
FRANCE 50%
RUSSIA 46%
HOLLAND 44%
ITALY 36%
GERMANY 28%

Sorokin concludes therefore, "that Germany has had the smallest and Spain the largest percent of years at war." Of leading modern European states, England, France and Russia show clearly twice the aggressive tendencies of Germany.

From the years 1815 to 1907 the record stands as follows:

BRITAIN 10 wars
RUSSIA 7 wars
FRANCE 5 wars
AUSTRIA 3 wars
PRUSSIA-GERMANY 3 wars

GERMANY DID NOT WANT WAR

"I believe now that Hitler and the German people did not want war. But we declared war on Germany, intent on destroying it, in accordance with our principle of balance of power, and we were encouraged by the 'Americans' around Roosevelt. We ignored Hitler's pleadings not to enter into war. Now we are forced to realize that Hitler was right." - Attorney General, Sir. Hartley Shawcross, March,16th, 1984

"The last thing Hitler wanted was to produce another great war." - Sir. Basil Liddell Hart

"I see no reason why this war must go on. I am grieved to think of the sacrifices which it will claim. I would like to avert them." - Adolf Hitler, July, 1940.

Winston Churchill agrees: "We entered the war of our own free will, without ourselves being directly assaulted." - Guild Hall Speech, July 1943.

MYTH.2 THE GERMAN ARMED FORCES
OUTNUMBERED THEIR NEIGHBOURS

POLAND

30 Active Divisions
10 Reserve Divisions
12 Large Cavalry Brigades
Poland had nearly 2,500,000 trained men available for mobilisations.

FRANCE

110 Divisions
65 were active divisions
Including 5 cavalry divisions, two mechanised divisions, one armoured division, the rest being infantry. On the German borders stood the French command stood 85 Divisions and could mobilise 5,000,000-armed troops. These were supported backed by five British divisions.

BRITAIN

Britain’s relatively small but high quality Regular Army was supported by the Territorial Army consisting of 26 Divisions with plans well in hand to boost this to 55 divisions. This of course was in turn supported by the then world’s largest conscription army holding an empire ‘upon which the sun never set.’

The British Empire consisted also of the former German ‘empire’ of New Guinea, Nauru, Western Samoa, South West Africa, Quattar, Palestine, Transjordan, Tanganyika, Iraq, Togoland and the Cameroons. These territories stolen from Germany added another 1,061,755 square miles to the British Empire, the equivalent of 35 Scotlands

GERMANY

Against these formidable forces Germany was able to mobilise just ninety-eight divisions of which only fifty-two were active (including Austrian divisions). Of the remaining 46 divisions only 10 were fit for action on mobilisation and even in these the bulk of them were raw recruits who had been serving for less than one month.

The other 36 divisions consisted mainly of Great War veterans over the age of forty who were unfamiliar with modern weapons and up to date military techniques.

THE BALANCE SHEET

On the balance sheets it can be seen that the Poles and French alone, not counting Britain and its Empire, had the equivalent of 130 divisions against a total of 98 German divisions of with 1/3rd were virtually untrained men.

In terms of trained soldiers the Germans were at an even bigger disadvantage. (Note at the outbreak of war over 50% of the German armed forces was horse drawn).

WAR IN THE AIR

"The superiority of the Luftwaffe has been greatly exaggerated to create the impression that Britain was the underdog; a David fighting Goliath. In the run up to the Battle of Britain (August 10th 194) the Luftwaffe had 929 fighters available; mostly single-engine Messerschmitt 109s. Of these 227 were twin-engine long-range Me110s which had a top speed of 350mph. Although it had a faster rate of climb it was inferior when turning or manoeuvring.

The ME109’s range restricted its field of operation. Their real fields of operation – out and back – was a little over 100 miles, a flight time of barely 95 minutes and a tactical flight time of just 75 minutes. This was a sever handicap when it is considered that whereas the Luftwaffe pilots were operating scores of miles from their base, British pilots were often within sight of their own. This handicap was made more critical by the fact that downed RAF pilots could be rescued whilst Luftwaffe pilots were of course – if they were lucky – imprisoned.

The twin-engine ME110 was a slow flyer able to cruise at a little less than 300mph and was easily outpaced by the RAF’s Spitfires. It was also ‘sluggish in acceleration and difficult to manoeuvre.’

The greatest handicap for the Germans however was there primitive radio equipment. Unlike the British versions it was poor in air-to-air operation and could not be controlled by the ground.

On the British side a total surpassing 650 fighter aircraft had been amassed by mid-July, mostly Hurricanes and Spitfires although including nearly 100 of the older types. During that whole year Britain produced 4,238 fighters compared with a derisory 3,000 manufactured by Germany.

In terms of armaments the noted British military historian, B.H Liddell Hart noted: "What is quite clear, and became evident at the start, was that the German bombers were too poorly armed to be able to beat off the British fighters without a fighter escort of their own.” – History of the Second World War.


GERMANY AND OTHER FREE COUNTRIES ATTACKED

Poland carried out the first acts of aggression. In March 1939 Poland, already occupying German territory ‘acquired’ in 1919 invaded Czechoslovakia. During the months running up to the outbreak of war Polish armed forces repeatedly violated German borders. On August 31st 1939 Polish irregular armed forces launched a full scale attack on the German border town of Gleiwitz.

Within hours Germany retaliated resulting in Britain and France’s declarations of war on the German nation on 3rd Sept 1939. In Britain’s case this declaration of war was constitutionally illegal. It was not as it should have been ratified by parliament.

Despite her borders being constantly attacked by the numerically superior armies of France and England, and economically strangled by world finance, Germany refused to be drawn, negotiated for peace and turned the other cheek for ten months.

Only when it accurately learned that England intended to broaden the western front by occupying the Low Countries and Norway, thus surrounding and threatening Germany’s entire borders, did Germany carry out a pre-emptive strike.

Germany’s defensive counter attack was launched on 10th May 1940. This resulted in the rout of 330,000 British and French troops by a significantly smaller army. It was one of the worst debacles in military history. (The British press called it ‘a miracle).

Russia invaded Finland on Nov 30th 1939. Britain (not for the first time) and France invaded Norway's neutrality on 8th April 1940. To avoid attack via the Baltic Sea Germany counter-attacked. In the small battles that followed (Trondheim) 2,000 German troops routed 13,000 British troops. They were evacuated on 1st May. To save face Churchill disembarked 20,000 British troops at Narvik. They were driven out by 2,000 Austrian Alpine troops.

Canada declared war on Germany 10th Sept 1939. In June 1940 Soviet Russia invaded Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania and Rumania. In June 1940, Britain declared war on Finland, Rumania and Hungary whilst also occupying defenseless Iceland. All of these acts of aggression in gross violation of international law and previously signed treaties.

On May 10th 1940 in brazen defiance of international law Britain occupied Iceland. Icelanders regarded the British armed forces as an occupying force.

On 7th Dec 1941 a British backed coup overthrew the Yugoslav government. On 27th March 1941 British troops enter Greece. On 6th April 1941 Germany retaliated and Britain retreated again. In June 1940 Britain prepares to invade neutral Portugal.

The United States, supposedly neutral, consistently attacks German shipping and arrests or otherwise kidnaps German citizens, even those living in South American countries. In August 1941. Germany retaliated.

In 1940 alone Britain, supposedly standing alone and at bay, added 1.6 MILLION SQUARE MILES TO ITS WORLD EMPIRE occupying Italian and French colonies; Syria, Iraq and Persia. Britain’s foremost military historian, A.J.P. Taylor conceded: "There can be no doubt that he (Hitler) broadened the war in 1941 only on preventive grounds.”

Footnote on casualties: In terms of casualties the United Kingdom came in at number nine. Russia came first (official figures at 13.6 million, Germany 3.5, China 1.3, Japan 1.3, Romania 350,000, United States 252,000, Italy 279,000, UK 264,000, France 213,000, Hungary 200,000, Poland 123,000, Greece 88,000, Finland 82,000, Canada 37,000, India 24,000, Australia 23,000, Belgium 12,000, Czechoslovakia 10,000, Bulgaria 10,000, New Zealand 10,000 (another country threatened by Germany no doubt!), Netherlands 8,000, South Africa 6,000, Norway 3,000, Denmark 1,800, Brazil 943.

:scratch:
 

praying

Snazzy Title Goes Here
Site Supporter
Jan 9, 2004
32,635
1,608
67
New Jersey
✟86,040.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Democrat
Supreme_Arbiter said:
One of the great mysteries of life is that despite the evidence to the contrary millions of otherwise intelligent people still believe that Germany was the all powerful aggressor during the 2nd World War. Nothing better than these myths illustrate the mind-bending power of propaganda. The provable facts suggest that Germany was the victim and not the perpetrator of naked neighboring aggression. The subsequent allied military triumph was followed by the triumph of the propagandists whose pressing need was to depict the victor nations as being the victim.

THE BRUTISH EMPIRE:

"Germany is too strong. We must destroy her."
- Winston Churchill, Nov. 1936.

"In no country has the historical blackout been more intense and effective than in Great Britain. Here it has been ingeniously christened The Iron Curtain of Discreet Silence. Virtually nothing has been written to reveal the truth about British responsibility for the Second World War and its disastrous results.” - Harry Elmer Barnes. American Historian

"The war was not just a matter of the elimination of Fascism in Germany, but rather of obtaining German sales markets." - Winston Churchill. March, 1946.

"Britain was taking advantage of the situation to go to war against Germany because the Reich had become too strong and had upset the European balance." - Ralph F. Keeling, Institute of American Economics

"I emphasized that the defeat of Germany and Japan and their elimination from world trade would give Britain a tremendous opportunity to swell her foreign commerce in both volume and profit." - Samuel Untermeyer, The Public Years, p.347.

On September 2nd 1939 a delegate of the Labour Party met with the British Foreign Minister Halifax in the lobby of Parliament. 'Do you still have hope?' he asked. 'If you mean hope for war,' answered Halifax, 'then your hope will be fulfilled tomorrow. 'God be thanked!' replied the representative of the British Labour Party. - Professor Michael Freund.

"In Britain, Lord Halifax was reported as being 'redeemed'. He ordered beer. We laughed and joked." - H. Roth. Are We Being Lied To?

"In April, 1939, (four months before the outbreak of war) Ambassador William C. Bullitt, whom I had known for twenty years, called me to the American Embassy in Paris. The American Ambassador told me that war had been decided upon. He did not say, nor did I ask, by whom. He let me infer it. ... When I said that in the end Germany would be driven into the arms of Soviet Russia and Bolshevism, the Ambassador replied: "‘what of it? There will not be enough Germans left when the war is over to be worth bolshevising." - - Karl von Wiegand, April, 23rd, 1944, Chicago Herald American

"I felt sorry for the German people. We were planning - and we had the force to carry out our plans - to obliterate a once mighty nation." - Admiral Daniel Leahy; U.S Ambassador ˆ

MYTH 1. THE GERMAN NATION IS AN AGGRESSIVE NATION

The facts prove otherwise. A Study of War by Prof. Quincy Wright, shows that in the period from 1480 to 1940 there were 278 wars involving European countries whose percentage participation was as follows:

ENGLAND 28%
FRANCE 26%
SPAIN 23%
RUSSIA 22%
AUSTRIA 19%
TURKEY 15%
POLAND 11%
SWEDEN 9%
ITALY 9%
NETHERLANDS 8%
GERMANY (INCLUDING PRUSSIA) 8%
DENMARK 7%

Likewise, Pitirim Sorokin, Vol.111, Part.11, Social and Cultural Dynamics, shows that from the 12th Century to 1925 the percentage of years in which leading European powers have been at war is as follows. (p.352).

COUNTRY PERCENTAGE OF YEARS AT WAR

SPAIN 67%
POLAND 58%
ENGLAND 56%
FRANCE 50%
RUSSIA 46%
HOLLAND 44%
ITALY 36%
GERMANY 28%

Sorokin concludes therefore, "that Germany has had the smallest and Spain the largest percent of years at war." Of leading modern European states, England, France and Russia show clearly twice the aggressive tendencies of Germany.

From the years 1815 to 1907 the record stands as follows:

BRITAIN 10 wars
RUSSIA 7 wars
FRANCE 5 wars
AUSTRIA 3 wars
PRUSSIA-GERMANY 3 wars

GERMANY DID NOT WANT WAR

"I believe now that Hitler and the German people did not want war. But we declared war on Germany, intent on destroying it, in accordance with our principle of balance of power, and we were encouraged by the 'Americans' around Roosevelt. We ignored Hitler's pleadings not to enter into war. Now we are forced to realize that Hitler was right." - Attorney General, Sir. Hartley Shawcross, March,16th, 1984

"The last thing Hitler wanted was to produce another great war." - Sir. Basil Liddell Hart

"I see no reason why this war must go on. I am grieved to think of the sacrifices which it will claim. I would like to avert them." - Adolf Hitler, July, 1940.

Winston Churchill agrees: "We entered the war of our own free will, without ourselves being directly assaulted." - Guild Hall Speech, July 1943.

MYTH.2 THE GERMAN ARMED FORCES
OUTNUMBERED THEIR NEIGHBOURS

POLAND

30 Active Divisions
10 Reserve Divisions
12 Large Cavalry Brigades
Poland had nearly 2,500,000 trained men available for mobilisations.

FRANCE

110 Divisions
65 were active divisions
Including 5 cavalry divisions, two mechanised divisions, one armoured division, the rest being infantry. On the German borders stood the French command stood 85 Divisions and could mobilise 5,000,000-armed troops. These were supported backed by five British divisions.

BRITAIN

Britain’s relatively small but high quality Regular Army was supported by the Territorial Army consisting of 26 Divisions with plans well in hand to boost this to 55 divisions. This of course was in turn supported by the then world’s largest conscription army holding an empire ‘upon which the sun never set.’

The British Empire consisted also of the former German ‘empire’ of New Guinea, Nauru, Western Samoa, South West Africa, Quattar, Palestine, Transjordan, Tanganyika, Iraq, Togoland and the Cameroons. These territories stolen from Germany added another 1,061,755 square miles to the British Empire, the equivalent of 35 Scotlands

GERMANY

Against these formidable forces Germany was able to mobilise just ninety-eight divisions of which only fifty-two were active (including Austrian divisions). Of the remaining 46 divisions only 10 were fit for action on mobilisation and even in these the bulk of them were raw recruits who had been serving for less than one month.

The other 36 divisions consisted mainly of Great War veterans over the age of forty who were unfamiliar with modern weapons and up to date military techniques.

THE BALANCE SHEET

On the balance sheets it can be seen that the Poles and French alone, not counting Britain and its Empire, had the equivalent of 130 divisions against a total of 98 German divisions of with 1/3rd were virtually untrained men.

In terms of trained soldiers the Germans were at an even bigger disadvantage. (Note at the outbreak of war over 50% of the German armed forces was horse drawn).

WAR IN THE AIR

"The superiority of the Luftwaffe has been greatly exaggerated to create the impression that Britain was the underdog; a David fighting Goliath. In the run up to the Battle of Britain (August 10th 194) the Luftwaffe had 929 fighters available; mostly single-engine Messerschmitt 109s. Of these 227 were twin-engine long-range Me110s which had a top speed of 350mph. Although it had a faster rate of climb it was inferior when turning or manoeuvring.

The ME109’s range restricted its field of operation. Their real fields of operation – out and back – was a little over 100 miles, a flight time of barely 95 minutes and a tactical flight time of just 75 minutes. This was a sever handicap when it is considered that whereas the Luftwaffe pilots were operating scores of miles from their base, British pilots were often within sight of their own. This handicap was made more critical by the fact that downed RAF pilots could be rescued whilst Luftwaffe pilots were of course – if they were lucky – imprisoned.

The twin-engine ME110 was a slow flyer able to cruise at a little less than 300mph and was easily outpaced by the RAF’s Spitfires. It was also ‘sluggish in acceleration and difficult to manoeuvre.’

The greatest handicap for the Germans however was there primitive radio equipment. Unlike the British versions it was poor in air-to-air operation and could not be controlled by the ground.

On the British side a total surpassing 650 fighter aircraft had been amassed by mid-July, mostly Hurricanes and Spitfires although including nearly 100 of the older types. During that whole year Britain produced 4,238 fighters compared with a derisory 3,000 manufactured by Germany.

In terms of armaments the noted British military historian, B.H Liddell Hart noted: "What is quite clear, and became evident at the start, was that the German bombers were too poorly armed to be able to beat off the British fighters without a fighter escort of their own.” – History of the Second World War.


GERMANY AND OTHER FREE COUNTRIES ATTACKED

Poland carried out the first acts of aggression. In March 1939 Poland, already occupying German territory ‘acquired’ in 1919 invaded Czechoslovakia. During the months running up to the outbreak of war Polish armed forces repeatedly violated German borders. On August 31st 1939 Polish irregular armed forces launched a full scale attack on the German border town of Gleiwitz.

Within hours Germany retaliated resulting in Britain and France’s declarations of war on the German nation on 3rd Sept 1939. In Britain’s case this declaration of war was constitutionally illegal. It was not as it should have been ratified by parliament.

Despite her borders being constantly attacked by the numerically superior armies of France and England, and economically strangled by world finance, Germany refused to be drawn, negotiated for peace and turned the other cheek for ten months.

Only when it accurately learned that England intended to broaden the western front by occupying the Low Countries and Norway, thus surrounding and threatening Germany’s entire borders, did Germany carry out a pre-emptive strike.

Germany’s defensive counter attack was launched on 10th May 1940. This resulted in the rout of 330,000 British and French troops by a significantly smaller army. It was one of the worst debacles in military history. (The British press called it ‘a miracle).

Russia invaded Finland on Nov 30th 1939. Britain (not for the first time) and France invaded Norway's neutrality on 8th April 1940. To avoid attack via the Baltic Sea Germany counter-attacked. In the small battles that followed (Trondheim) 2,000 German troops routed 13,000 British troops. They were evacuated on 1st May. To save face Churchill disembarked 20,000 British troops at Narvik. They were driven out by 2,000 Austrian Alpine troops.

Canada declared war on Germany 10th Sept 1939. In June 1940 Soviet Russia invaded Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania and Rumania. In June 1940, Britain declared war on Finland, Rumania and Hungary whilst also occupying defenseless Iceland. All of these acts of aggression in gross violation of international law and previously signed treaties.

On May 10th 1940 in brazen defiance of international law Britain occupied Iceland. Icelanders regarded the British armed forces as an occupying force.

On 7th Dec 1941 a British backed coup overthrew the Yugoslav government. On 27th March 1941 British troops enter Greece. On 6th April 1941 Germany retaliated and Britain retreated again. In June 1940 Britain prepares to invade neutral Portugal.

The United States, supposedly neutral, consistently attacks German shipping and arrests or otherwise kidnaps German citizens, even those living in South American countries. In August 1941. Germany retaliated.

In 1940 alone Britain, supposedly standing alone and at bay, added 1.6 MILLION SQUARE MILES TO ITS WORLD EMPIRE occupying Italian and French colonies; Syria, Iraq and Persia. Britain’s foremost military historian, A.J.P. Taylor conceded: "There can be no doubt that he (Hitler) broadened the war in 1941 only on preventive grounds.”

Footnote on casualties: In terms of casualties the United Kingdom came in at number nine. Russia came first (official figures at 13.6 million, Germany 3.5, China 1.3, Japan 1.3, Romania 350,000, United States 252,000, Italy 279,000, UK 264,000, France 213,000, Hungary 200,000, Poland 123,000, Greece 88,000, Finland 82,000, Canada 37,000, India 24,000, Australia 23,000, Belgium 12,000, Czechoslovakia 10,000, Bulgaria 10,000, New Zealand 10,000 (another country threatened by Germany no doubt!), Netherlands 8,000, South Africa 6,000, Norway 3,000, Denmark 1,800, Brazil 943.

:scratch:

Okay and what is your point? IN 20 words or less andhopefully in black font, that blue is hard on the eyes.
 
Upvote 0

Borealis

Catholic Homeschool Dad
Dec 8, 2003
6,906
621
53
Barrie, Ontario
✟10,009.00
Faith
Catholic
Politics
CA-Conservatives
You know, there comes a point where you have to just shake your head and admit that the person you're talking with is a complete idiot. I've reached that point.

Supreme_Arbiter, congratulations; you are the first person I have ever put on my 'Ignore' list on any message board. You are obviously no Catholic; you're clearly a Nazi sympathizer, and a complete anti-Semite. So with that in mind, take your hateful message somewhere else, because I'm not listening anymore.
 
Upvote 0
Well.....I am sorry that all these historical illiterates are ganging up on you SA. I read the first part but this is far too long. You must compress the information or divide it into smaller sections if you wish for anybody to read it. All I will coment on at the moment is that if you trace the origins of WWII back far enough it comes to WWI. So, with that said the countries who acctually started WWII (in a sense) is the League of Nations and the USA.

To BOREALIS: You should not speak of what you do not know. It only makes you sound like a fool. Also, you have become the first person to be added to mt "ignore" list.

To EvolvEarth: Why do you consider those whom seek the truth of events "historical revisionists". Can you say w/o a doubt that what is written is true? I could write that you are a deformed, mentally deficient, pervert but does that make it true?
 
Upvote 0

praying

Snazzy Title Goes Here
Site Supporter
Jan 9, 2004
32,635
1,608
67
New Jersey
✟86,040.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Democrat
NiemandheißtBoshaftigkeit said:
Well.....I am sorry that all these historical illiterates are ganging up on you SA. I read the first part but this is far too long. You must compress the information or divide it into smaller sections if you wish for anybody to read it. All I will coment on at the moment is that if you trace the origins of WWII back far enough it comes to WWI. So, with that said the countries who acctually started WWII (in a sense) is the League of Nations and the USA.

To BOREALIS: You should not speak of what you do not know. It only makes you sound like a fool. Also, you have become the first person to be added to mt "ignore" list.

To EvolvEarth: Why do you consider those whom seek the truth of events "historical revisionists". Can you say w/o a doubt that what is written is true? I could write that you are a deformed, mentally deficient, pervert but does that make it true?

The one hsitorical fact that is unquestionable is what Germany was doing while waging the war, the systematic extermiantion of a race.
 
Upvote 0

Agrippa

Well-Known Member
Jan 15, 2004
842
24
39
✟1,097.00
Faith
Catholic
Politics
US-Others
Well, that's the biggest piece of shi...er...propaganda I've ever read.

The Brutish Empire

This part discusses the 'fact' the Great Britain wanted the war to maintain its economic dominance. HA! Britain desperately wanted to avoid the war. The First World War had crippled her empire and she knew a second would destroy it. As the historical record shows, the war did destroy the British empire.

MYTH 1. THE GERMAN NATION IS AN AGGRESSIVE NATION

I'm quite skeptical of these figures, considering the fact that Germany as a nation has existed for only ~130 years. If you want to count the thousands of principalities, Germany would be shown in a very different light.

GERMANY DID NOT WANT WAR

The quotes of this section were taken out-of-context. For example:

"The last thing Hitler wanted was to produce another great war." - Sir. Basil Liddell Hart

No, Hitler didn't want a great war. He wanted a number of limited wars.

"I see no reason why this war must go on. I am grieved to think of the sacrifices which it will claim. I would like to avert them." - Adolf Hitler, July, 1940.

This was addressed to Great Britain. Of couse Hitler didn't want the war to go on! He had France and Poland and had no chance whatsoever of taking Great Britain in an invasion. Notice he doesn't offer to let Poland and France go free. Or Denmark, Norway, Belgium, Holland, Luxembourg, Czechoslovakia, or Austria either.

MYTH.2 THE GERMAN ARMED FORCES OUTNUMBERED THEIR NEIGHBOURS

What does that have to do with German culpability?

Poland carried out the first acts of aggression. In March 1939 Poland, already occupying German territory ‘acquired’ in 1919 invaded Czechoslovakia.

Poland obtained that territory due to the Versailles Treaty. What right does Germany have to it? Why does the Polish seizure of Czech land (which occurred as Germany was annexing the rest of it) justify a German invasion of Poland?

During the months running up to the outbreak of war Polish armed forces repeatedly violated German borders. On August 31st 1939 Polish irregular armed forces launched a full scale attack on the German border town of Gleiwitz.

Bull. That so-called attack on Gleiwitz was undertaken by the SS to give Hitler a justification for his invasion of Poland!

Within hours Germany retaliated resulting in Britain and France’s declarations of war on the German nation on 3rd Sept 1939. In Britain’s case this declaration of war was constitutionally illegal. It was not as it should have been ratified by parliament.

It's funny that Germany was able to retaliate with a full-scale invasion just hours after a small 'Polish' attack.

Despite her borders being constantly attacked by the numerically superior armies of France and England, and economically strangled by world finance, Germany refused to be drawn, negotiated for peace and turned the other cheek for ten months.

Yeah, this author's an idiot. The British and French did nothing against Germany for the first couple of months except supply Germany with its wartime needs of toilet paper by dropping leaflets. It's called the Phony War for a reason. As for turning the other cheek for ten months, ten months after Sept. is July. So the invasions of Denmark, Norway, France, Luxembourg, Belgium, and Holland never happened.

Only when it accurately learned that England intended to broaden the western front by occupying the Low Countries and Norway, thus surrounding and threatening Germany’s entire borders, did Germany carry out a pre-emptive strike.

Well, the author continues to display his (lack of) intelligence. The Low Countries were doing everything in their power to seem neutral. Even after the Belgians captured German plans to invade the Low Countries it did not allow the French to make plans to co-ordinate a defense in the event of an invansion.

Germany’s defensive counter attack was launched on 10th May 1940. This resulted in the rout of 330,000 British and French troops by a significantly smaller army. It was one of the worst debacles in military history. (The British press called it ‘a miracle).

Well, that's the only time I've seen the Ardennes offensive called a 'defensive counter attack'. Oh, FYI, the 'miracle' relates to Dunkirk, not the battle as a whole. Additionally, the numbers are way off.

I'll get to the rest in a minute. I'm going to post this before the Demon Murphy strikes and my browser crashes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: faerieevaH
Upvote 0

Agrippa

Well-Known Member
Jan 15, 2004
842
24
39
✟1,097.00
Faith
Catholic
Politics
US-Others
This is a piece of ****, take two.

Russia invaded Finland on Nov 30th 1939.

So?

Britain (not for the first time) and France invaded Norway's neutrality on 8th April 1940. To avoid attack via the Baltic Sea Germany counter-attacked.

The British invaded Norwegian neutrality by placing mines. Germany invaded Norwegian neutrality by taking Norway over. There's a little difference btwn the two.

Canada declared war on Germany 10th Sept 1939.

So?

In June 1940 Soviet Russia invaded Latvia, Estonia, Lithuania and Rumania.

So? And the USSR didn't invade Romania; they just took a part of it, specifically, Bessarabia.

In June 1940, Britain declared war on Finland, Rumania and Hungary whilst also occupying defenseless Iceland.

Do you know why the British declared war? Because Finland, Romania, and Hungary were attacking GB's newest ally, the USSR. Do you know why GB occupied Iceland? Because Germany was occupying the its owner, Denmark.

On May 10th 1940 in brazen defiance of international law Britain occupied Iceland. Icelanders regarded the British armed forces as an occupying force.

So, Germany's invasion of Denmark was in accordance with international law then?

On 7th Dec 1941 a British backed coup overthrew the Yugoslav government.

Someone needs to double check their dates.

On 27th March 1941 British troops enter Greece.

They were invited. Why? Because for some strange reason, Greece feared German aggression. I don't know where they ever got that idea.

In 1940 alone Britain, supposedly standing alone and at bay, added 1.6 MILLION SQUARE MILES TO ITS WORLD EMPIRE occupying Italian and French colonies; Syria, Iraq and Persia.

I'm doubting whether this author has ever read a book on the Second World War. Iraq was under British domination and it revolted. Persia was invaded in 1941, not 1940, to secure a supply line to the USSR. Britain was at war with Italy and Vichy France when it occupied their colonies.

So, in conclusion, whoever wrote this (I'm not sure if it was SA or not) is an idiot and is ignorant of World War Two.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Borealis

Catholic Homeschool Dad
Dec 8, 2003
6,906
621
53
Barrie, Ontario
✟10,009.00
Faith
Catholic
Politics
CA-Conservatives
NiemandheißtBoshaftigkeit said:
To BOREALIS: You should not speak of what you do not know. It only makes you sound like a fool. Also, you have become the first person to be added to mt "ignore" list.

:cry: A Nazi sympathizer doesn't want to hear from me anymore because I don't believe that Germany was run by misunderstood humanitarians from 1933-1945. Oh, I'm so hurt and mortified. How will I ever survive this humiliation? :rolleyes:

I do know of what I speak; I always make very certain that I know what I'm talking about. So you may ignore me all you like, Whateveryournamemeans; the rest of the world will hear the truth, because they're not afraid of it.
 
Upvote 0
Borealis, if you honestly didnt understand the context of my statement you are an idiot.

"You are obviously no Catholic; you're clearly a Nazi sympathizer, and a complete anti-Semite. So with that in mind, take your hateful message somewhere else, because I'm not listening anymore."

This statement is what you know nothing about. How would you know whether or not SA is a Catholic, a NAZI sympathizer, or an anti-semite? You wouldnt. You can only speculate. Also, I also know the historical facts of this matter. I have studied the European Theater of WWII fairly extensivly. I can even differenciat between a Pz. IV type H and a Pz. IV type J. Can you say the same? I even know when the first swastika appeared on German coinage. Can you say the same?
 
Upvote 0

Supreme_Arbiter

Activating brain cells
Feb 14, 2004
150
2
48
I live on the edge of oicumena
✟7,792.00
Faith
Atheist
Borealis is completely brainwashed person who claims to be a "historian". It is a waste of time arguing with him - bugger just gets hysterical, he should've been born a woman. Being a housewife would fit him much better than being a "historian".
 
Upvote 0

tulc

loves "SO'S YER MOM!! posts!
May 18, 2002
49,401
18,801
68
✟271,570.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Borealis is completely brainwashed person who claims to be a "historian".
Why does two such obviously superior Aryans want to waste their time with a bunch of people so brainwashed we'll never accept that Hitler was a victim of British & French aggression?
I do have one question: which of you is the sockpuppet?
tulc
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

ChrisB

Well-Known Member
Jan 28, 2004
898
166
66
✟16,919.00
Faith
Protestant
Amongst all the other half-truths, lies and distortions in the OP I noticed this gem

Supreme_Arbiter said:
The British Empire consisted also of the former German ‘empire’ of New Guinea, Nauru, Western Samoa, South West Africa, Quattar, Palestine, Transjordan, Tanganyika, Iraq, Togoland and the Cameroons. These territories stolen from Germany added another 1,061,755 square miles to the British Empire, the equivalent of 35 Scotlands

Whoever wrote this knows nothing about history -Qatar had never been part of the German Empire - the British and Turks had contested influence over the country for many years until it finally became a British protectorate. Palestine, Transjordan and Iraq were all part of the Ottoman Empire - at no time were they part of the German Empire.
 
Upvote 0

Borealis

Catholic Homeschool Dad
Dec 8, 2003
6,906
621
53
Barrie, Ontario
✟10,009.00
Faith
Catholic
Politics
CA-Conservatives
NiemandheißtBoshaftigkeit said:
Borealis, if you honestly didnt understand the context of my statement you are an idiot.

"You are obviously no Catholic; you're clearly a Nazi sympathizer, and a complete anti-Semite. So with that in mind, take your hateful message somewhere else, because I'm not listening anymore."

This statement is what you know nothing about. How would you know whether or not SA is a Catholic, a NAZI sympathizer, or an anti-semite? You wouldnt. You can only speculate. Also, I also know the historical facts of this matter. I have studied the European Theater of WWII fairly extensivly. I can even differenciat between a Pz. IV type H and a Pz. IV type J. Can you say the same? I even know when the first swastika appeared on German coinage. Can you say the same?

Hmm...and here I thought I was on your 'ignore' list.

As for my statement, I've read enough of SA's garbage on this board to know that if it looks like a goose, talks like a goose, and steps like a goose...

Congratulations on knowing minutae about German military hardware and coinage during World War II. What that has to do with the causes of the Second World War escapes me; perhaps your highly-superior Aryan brain can clarify that.

When I was 16 I knew a lot about military hardware too, having grown up on several military bases. I can tell you information about the Voodoo interceptors, the names and numbers of the Canadian Air Force squadrons of the early 1980s, and the meanings of different alerts and signals on the bases where I grew up.

However, that has less than nothing to do with what the government was doing with those planes, squadrons and signals, does it? I'm well aware of German revisionist history. Germans, especially shortly after the war, were very, VERY uncomfortable about what had just happened in their country. And, like so many people throughout history, attempted to deny the truth because it was too horrible to accept. So they rewrote their history, making Germany look like an innocent victim of the rest of the imperialist nations. Unfortunately for you, as the Allies overran Germany they found large amounts of documentation that proves Germany's culpability in the occupations of Czechoslovakia, the invasions of Poland and France (which was nothing more than Hitler's desire for revenge for the Versailles Treaty), and the organized and industrial slaughter of millions and millions of innocent people.

Sticking your head in the sand and pretending something didn't happen won't change the fact that it did.
 
Upvote 0

Lillithspeak

The Umbrella
Aug 26, 2003
1,532
120
77
Vermont
✟9,786.00
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Others
NiemandheißtBoshaftigkeit said:
Borealis, if you honestly didnt understand the context of my statement you are an idiot.

"You are obviously no Catholic; you're clearly a Nazi sympathizer, and a complete anti-Semite. So with that in mind, take your hateful message somewhere else, because I'm not listening anymore."

This statement is what you know nothing about. How would you know whether or not SA is a Catholic, a NAZI sympathizer, or an anti-semite? You wouldnt. You can only speculate. Also, I also know the historical facts of this matter. I have studied the European Theater of WWII fairly extensivly. I can even differenciat between a Pz. IV type H and a Pz. IV type J. Can you say the same? I even know when the first swastika appeared on German coinage. Can you say the same?
Well, we're all just incredibly impressed with you, not however, as impressed as you are yourself. You and Arbiter are obvious in your beliefs, go away. You are here for one purpose, and here is our answer: :troll:
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Kelly

Dungeon Master
Mar 20, 2003
7,032
419
55
USA
Visit site
✟24,334.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Supreme_Arbiter said:
Borealis is completely brainwashed person who claims to be a "historian". It is a waste of time arguing with him - bugger just gets hysterical, he should've been born a woman. Being a housewife would fit him much better than being a "historian".
I almost did a spit take with my morning coffee. I feel like I'm on the Atkins diet, two servings of tripe (your original post now this response).
 
Upvote 0