My Word Challenge

[Tiberius]

AV, please define the word "Old", in the context of, "I asked Mrs Smith how old she was."

Then explain how it relates to the meaning of old as in "I investigated to see how old the Earth is."

 

[AV1611VET]

AV, please define the word "Old", in the context of, "I asked Mrs Smith how old she was."

Old = how many times she has gone around the sun.

Then explain how it relates to the meaning of old as in "I investigated to see how old the Earth is."

You investigated as to how many times Earth has gone around the sun.

 

[qualitas occulta]

AV, you're clearly wrong. The sun goes around the Earth--didn't you attend grade school? I can't believe the education system nowadays doesn't teach Ptolemy.

 

[AV1611VET]

AV, you're clearly wrong. The sun goes around the Earth--didn't you attend grade school? I can't believe the education system nowadays doesn't teach Ptolemy.

} Sorry -- my bad!

 

[Tiberius]

Old = how many times she has gone around the sun.

You investigated as to how many times Earth has gone around the sun.

Why do you depend on a variable? If I lived on Mars instead of Earth, would I not be as old, even if I had existed for the same number of days?

 

[AV1611VET]

Why do you depend on a variable? If I lived on Mars instead of Earth, would I not be as old, even if I had existed for the same number of days?

Indeed you would be as old, but you would have to specify.

I'm 57 years old, but on Mars, I would be 30 years old.

 

[razeontherock]

AV, please define the word "Old", in the context of, "I asked Mrs Smith how old she was."

Must. resist. joke of asking her how old her imbedded implants are

 

[Tiberius]

Indeed you would be as old, but you would have to specify.

I'm 57 years old, but on Mars, I would be 30 years old.

So how could I be just as old if I have gone around the sun a different number of times? Your definition, as provided in the second post, clearly specifies that "old" is just a measure of how many times it has gone around the sun. If you lived on Mars, you would have gone around the sun less times, thus you would not be as old.

Clearly a nonsensical statement.

So your definition for "Old" is pretty much useless. It's just another word for "Years". A word for which we already have a perfectly good word.

Now, next question.

Please define age.

 

[AV1611VET]

So your definition for "Old" is pretty much useless. It's just another word for "Years".

Now, next question.

Please define age.

Your line of questioning can take a hike.

Embedded age = maturity without history.

End of story --

 

[qualitas occulta]

Tiberius, i'm not sure how much is really gained by arguing with someone whose motto is "SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE".

He can probably defeat any of your arguments with powerful non-science magic, so it's best to leave the sorcerers to their own domain.


Just for the record, AT. Let's say that you were diagnosed with some end-stage cancer on Earth, after which you would have 30 days to live.

Let's say that you were diagnosed with the same cancer on Mars. You would then, ceteris paribus, have 57 Mars-days to live. Would you have spent more or less time in each of the planets?

 

[Tiberius]

Your line of questioning can take a hike.

Embedded age = maturity without history.

End of story --

My line of question should present no problem to you if embedded age makes sense.

However, I suspect that you have realised that you are now at a point where you have no logical answer, so you try to answer a specific question with your general statement.

Until you define "age", the phrase "embedded age" is meaningless. What is being embedded? You use the vague term "age", but do not tell us what it is.

Of course, you are required to keep the definition of age meaningless and vague so that whenever someone shows that a particular interpretation of it is wrong, you can say, "Oh, but that's not what age means!"

You must get a lot of exercise, shifting the goalposts like that so often.

But anyway...

Please define maturity for me.

 

[Naraoia]

Must. resist. joke of asking her how old her imbedded implants are

Resistance fail

 

[AV1611VET]

Until you define "age", the phrase "embedded age" is meaningless. What is being embedded? You use the vague term "age", but do not tell us what it is.

Maybe I have already?

Age refers to how long something as been in existence.

Without even looking --- I can tell you it is definition #4.

Excuse me --- yes, it does have to do with real age.

Ask any atheist who has known me for awhile.

I can tell you w/o even looking --- since I've said it so many times --- that it is definition #4 on answers.com.

I have a thread on this, but I'll ask it here, instead of QV'ing it:

Can God create an object --- tomorrow --- such that it falls apart with age the next day?

And I can tell you, without looking, that it is definition #4 I'm using.

ETA: Looks like I was wrong -- it has 7 definitions; and #4 is the one I use:

1. The length of time that one has existed; duration of life: 23 years of age.
2. The time of life when a person becomes qualified to assume certain civil and personal rights and responsibilities, usually at 18 or 21 years; legal age: under age; of age.
3. One of the stages of life: the age of adolescence; at an awkward age.
4. The state of being old; old age: hair white with age.
5. often Age
   1. A period in the history of humankind marked by a distinctive characteristic or achievement: the Stone Age; the computer age.
   2. A period in the history of the earth, usually shorter than an epoch: the Ice Age.
   3. A period of time marked by the presence or influence of a dominant figure: the Elizabethan Age.
6. 1. The period of history during which a person lives: a product of his age.
   2. A generation: ages yet unborn.
7. ages Informal. An extended period of time: left ages ago.

 

[qualitas occulta]

Appealing to an internet dictionary for a philosophical argument usually fails, and tends to be a sign of a lack of creativity and intellect.

A case in point would be "value". It's used very differently in philosophic, economic, ethical, semiotic, colloquial, etc. terms.

I'm not sure if you're serious with God creating things to fall apart with age the next day thing, but humans certainly can--see Jean Tinguely's self-destructing sculpture Homage to New York. If you wish to be accurate to the spirit of "age", we can add a temporal aspect to the installation and have it destroy itself to the tune of a timer.

 

[Tiberius]

Maybe I have already?

NOW WE ARE GETTING SOMEWHERE!!!

So, you define "age" to mean, "The state of being old".

And you defined "old" as meaning...

Old = how many times she has gone around the sun.

RIGHT!

So, if God created the universe with embedded age, you are saying that he embedded more trips around the sun in it.

So, you say the earth has actually made only about 6015 trips around the sun, but God "embedded" several billion more trips around the sun.

But how can the Earth have trips embedded in it if it never made those trips? Does it merely have the appearance of having made those trips?

And anyway, doesn't the use of "trips around the sun" become meaningless when talking of the age of the universe? How can you say the universe has made a certain number of trips around the sun? Do you think the universe revolves around the sun? And how could it be true anyway when the embedded age of the sun is LESS than the embedded age of the universe?

Anyway, I'm still waiting for you to define "maturity" for me.

 

[AV1611VET]

So, if God created the universe with embedded age, you are saying that he embedded more trips around the sun in it.

No -- you're confusing yourself.

You're retconning Mrs. Smith back to the creation week.

If you had asked me how old Eve was, I would say I think she is 20 or 30, but has never gone around the sun.

Stop thinking of age as a verb, and think of it as a noun -- like a pocket watch.

Then think of God as giving this 'pocket watch' to His creation.

 

[qualitas occulta]

If you had asked me how old Eve was, I would say I think she is 20 or 30, but has never gone around the sun.

I would say she was as old as however long it took for the rib to form into a woman. However, she would look like the equivalent of a 20-30 old female.

If I would construct a human being through artificial means fully-formed as an adult, you wouldn't say that I "embedded" its age onto it (although I suppose you could if you wanted to be poetically figurative). Rather, you would say that from the moment that person would be considered a human, then that's however much time (in terms of age) that person would've been.

There is no need for clumsy pseudo-metaphysical concepts like "embedded age" to give an explanation for such things that could otherwise be explained normally.

 

[razeontherock]

Yah, except she really was a mature woman in the story. That =/= an infant.

 

[AV1611VET]

I would say she was as old as however long it took for the rib to form into a woman.

So would I.

I would say Eve is one day old existentially; and 20-30 years old physically.

However, she would look like the equivalent of a 20-30 old female.

She would 'look like it' because she is.

This is what sets creationism apart from any natural explanation an Internet scientist can come up with.

There is no need for clumsy pseudo-metaphysical concepts like "embedded age" to give an explanation for such things that could otherwise be explained normally.

Am I reading this correctly?

You're expecting this to be 'explained normally'?

Even you said this:

I would say she was as old as however long it took for the rib to form into a woman.

Now you want a 'normal explanation'?

 

[AV1611VET]

Yah, except she really was a mature woman in the story. That =/= an infant.

Yup -- as Adam Clarke so aptly puts it:

It appears that God created every thing, not only perfect as it respects its nature, but also in a state of maturity, so that every vegetable production appeared at once in full growth; and this was necessary that man, when he came into being, might find every thing ready for his use.