My very first Episcopalian service

[Fish and Bread]

As far as "where are all the young adults?" question goes, that's been my bone to pick with the denomination for years. Not many Episcopal churches go out of their way to make people between 19-35 feel comfortable, and it's a real shame.

I think a lot of folks address this issue in the wrong way. Many of the suggestions I see along the lines of dumbing down our rituals, traditions, and conception of God seem counterproductive at best. I think people are more likely to be drawn to the complex and culture-rich than a Christianity stripped bare of it's more compelling themes and liturgies. People also talk about limiting communion, but that to me is one of the most central drawing points of Christianity. Making ourselves more like the world in our appearance simply makes people wonder why they'd go to church and not... whatever else young people do (I'm young, but not really in touch with the culture, admittedly).

One thing I actually think would bring in more young folks are more frequently held and better advertised compoline and taize services. You may laugh, but those services are definitely relaxing, mystical, and otherworldly; which I think are often major drawing cards for young people (Contrary to popular assumptions).

John

 

[scraparcs]

I do wonder sometimes what would draw younger adults, and I agree that there is something to the whole connection of self with the greater Christian community across space and time that is compelling. Somehow, though, it seems to me that this could be a problem across religions, across denominations, and not just part of the Anglican world.

I am tired of dumbing down services for the younger crowd. We're young, not stupid.

 

[AveMaria]

I'm part of a parish that has a fairly health 20/30s ministry, and the majority of our 20/30 somethings gravitate towards the taize and complines services, the Rite I service, and workshops on topics such as contemplative prayer. (Unless they have children, some of the young parents attend what we call the 'Zoo Mass' which is very child-focused).

I think the rediscovery of Christian Mysticism is going to be a key factor in drawing the 20-30s back to church.

 

[Finella]

I agree with all of you on how to attract young adults -- I have attended Episcopal services that were supposedly brought into existence purely to attract the 20-30 somethings, and it consisted of nothing but praise music, a long sermon-like thing with the shallowest theology I've ever heard, and viturally no liturgy. I nearly walked out, I couldn't stand it. Indeed, we aren't dumb, and we don't want easy theological answers. What keeps me in the Episcopal Church is the freedom to explore my faith in the context of the lovely timeless liturgy - the sense that I am walking the road that so many people have traveled before, wondering the same things.

/rant

 

[lunamoth]

Hi lel, lunamoth (from C + F ). I grew up in the Episcopal Church, drifted away for many years, and just returned last year about this time. Feels like being home. I do not do the sign of the cross, although maybe some day I will when I feel comfortable about it. I also would like to bow or genuflect (whatever it's called ) to the cross as I see some do but right now it still feels awkward.


When I was young I remember the information I got in Sunday school as being rather, umm, dry and boring. I wish I knew a good way to avoid the same reactions from my children as they go through Sunday school so that perhaps unlike me they would stay with church in young adulthood. I hope no one takes this a wrong way, but it seems to me that sometimes in the Episcopal church we avoid the more passionate and mystery aspects of Christianity. Oh, I don't really know exactly what I'm talking about but I know that now I feel a richness in my relationship with Christ that I never did as a youth, although I remember a simpler, beautiful version of this same feeling from when I was very young. Maybe most of us just need to go out and experience the world without God for a while to realize how much we need Him.

Having said all that, the church I'm in now is much much bigger than the one I grew up in and there are more teens and young adults, although the 20-somethings are less evident. I guess the answer to my own question above might be to get involved in youth teaching.
Oh, don't mind me. Peace to you and glad you enjoyed your first visit to the Episcopal Church.

lunamoth

 

[scraparcs]

Hi lunamoth! Welcome home!

General question: what's the difference between a narthex and a foyer?

 

[gtsecc]

extra scoops of incense

 

[Brian Augustyn]

General question: what's the difference between a narthex and a foyer?

In ecclesiastical terms, 'narthex' is the foyer of a church in the same way that the 'nave' is its auditorium.

In our small gothic-revival church, our narthex is about 8X8 feet, barely room enough for the greeter and you as you enter. It's more of a narth-ette, actually.

Brian

 

[Inside Edge]

One thing I actually think would bring in more young folks are more frequently held and better advertised compoline and taize services.

In the churches of my diocese, where these services are available (and at a reasonable time), those churches have a far larger and more involved young-adult membership, and those services are the fastest growing of all. Furthermore, they are the most common services to draw non-Christians (who most often end up with the rest of us on Sunday morning, at some point).

I think the rediscovery of Christian Mysticism is going to be a key factor in drawing the 20-30s back to church.

I think so too, and evidence within my diocese supports this theory.

 

[scraparcs]

I think this might just be a good place to put all my newbie questions about the Episcopalian church, lest I take a few others off topic!

Anyway, so Confirmation happens in one's teens and the like, I gather. I gather someone also goes through it before officially joining an Episcopalian church, or does that matter? Are there specific Confirmation classes for adults, like the Roman Catholic RCIA?

Rite I/Rite II: what's the difference aside from using "thee and thy" in Rite I instead of "you and yours"?

Off to check out another service. I've figured that "church shopping" goes more quickly doing two services on one Sunday morning.

 

[Fish and Bread]

Anyway, so Confirmation happens in one's teens and the like, I gather. I gather someone also goes through it before officially joining an Episcopalian church, or does that matter?

Adults join the Episcopal Church by being confirmed unless they have already been confirmed in a denomination that has confirmations we recognize as being essentially the same thing (Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Old Catholics, and Evangelical Lutherans meet this criteria), in which case they would instead be received.

Are there specific Confirmation classes for adults, like the Roman Catholic RCIA?

Ordinarily, yes. It is usually not the year long process that occurs in Roman Catholicism, though. My parish has four meetings for adults wishing to be confirmed or received.

Rite I/Rite II: what's the difference aside from using "thee and thy" in Rite I instead of "you and yours"?

Rite I is a bit more more focused on God's greatness and our unworthiness, seeking repentence, and so forth than Rite II is. It's also more traditional and slightly more Protestant (Christ the one mediator between God and mankind is in Rite I, for example) in the way things are phrased, beyond just the basic language transformations, in some cases the actual meaning that is being conveyed. I don't feel there's a change in theology between Rite I and Rite II, but there is a different theological emphasis. My parish actually switches it's Rite II services to Rite I services during Lent, for example, because the emphasis of the theology of that season and it's basic compatibility with Rite I.

John

 

[scraparcs]

I have another question, and I suspect the answer is what I think it is, but I want to make sure there's not some other generally accepted Anglican/Episcopalian interpretation for this.

The service I went to today featured some of the clergy with sashes on with rainbow stripes. I guessed that they were showing solidarity with homosexual parishioners (or some other type of support for homosexuals). Is that probably the case? (For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure this parish is affirming/welcoming/whatever the word is around Episcopalianism.)

 

[PaladinValer]

I honestly have no clue. I do remember however, a long time ago when I was still in high school, that we went to an Easter service at a PCUSA parish, and the minister wore such a stole (that's the correct word for what you are describing, by the way ). I never asked if it meant anything special.

 

[pmcleanj]

Traditional Anglican stoles are monochromatic: violet in Advent or Lent, white in Christmas or Easter, green in Epiphany and Trinity, and red for Passiontide and Pentecost. Or plain black for low-church clergy. They are worn over both shoulders by priests, and over one shoulder by deacons.

Ten years ago rainbows were a funky symbol of the Noahic covenant; used by ecumenists and pluralists to declare that God's promise is for all humanity, not just Christians and certainly not just Anglicans. Liturgical dancers, banner-makers, and other non-conformist worship artists used the motif occasionally in their work. So it might be a hold-over of that symbolism.

Or it might be a show of sympathy with the Roman Catholic rainbow sash movement. But that would be strange, too, because the rainbow sash movement focusses on admission by members wearing scarves, to Holy Communion. And since we're banned from their tables, and don't ban baptized Christians from our tables, it seems like a strange kind of solidarity.

I'd be inclined to ask.

 

[scraparcs]

Well, this parish was open communion, by which I mean open to everyone, not just baptized believers. So that's probably not it.

I suppose I shall ask next time. Thanks!

PS: All these new words! I'm getting them written down. (Let's see: eucharist, vestry, warden, narthex, stole, acolyte, homily...sometimes I wonder what language is being spoken!)

 

[PaladinValer]

How about an Anglican dictionary? http://www.holycross.net/anonline.htm

 

[scraparcs]

How about an Anglican dictionary? http://www.holycross.net/anonline.htm

Thank you, thank you, thank you! Now, anyone want to do vocabulary quizzes with me?

One thing I'm finding a few weeks into this, now that I'm seeing kind of how things go, is that this is so different from the Baptist denomination I attended for years that it's like another religion. To be blunt, I'm starting to become fatigued. I like to have some knowledge base about a religion going into it. I guess being a total neophyte will sure teach me to rely on God!

I didn't realize just how different things are in a liturgical church. I can't shove it into a Baptist framework no matter how hard I try, and it's almost like my Baptist upbringing is nearly irrelevant.

This too shall pass. I'm just worn out with learning another language and culture when I didn't expect to be doing so.

**********

The church I've attended the past few Sundays is quite interesting in many ways. It's rather obvious that the church is well within the liberal wing of the Episcopalian church. The people are rather nice, and to some extent, that's really important. I'm just still uneasy with the fact that even though theologically/politically/etc. I am slightly left-leaning, it bothers me to hear that in church! For now I tell myself that that's old prejudices popping up. I'm not used to perceiving myself on the slightly more traditionalist/conservative side of a congregation. I think it will be valuable seeing things from the other side, however. Whether or not I make this my home parish, I think seeing this parish for a few months might be educational.

**********

Sorry for the journal-like nature of my replies to this thread! To some extent I wish I could make this a journal, but it's just too Anglican-themed to really go there. Hopefully soon I'll get over my fears and contact the rector or something; the one at this latest church seems rather accessible.

Happy week!

 

[Fish and Bread]

Sorry for the journal-like nature of my replies to this thread! To some extent I wish I could make this a journal, but it's just too Anglican-themed to really go there.

I'd be interested in reading it. The world needs more Anglican themed journals!

Hopefully soon I'll get over my fears and contact the rector or something; the one at this latest church seems rather accessible.

My rector actually contacted me. He noticed me attending services for a few months and said something like "So when are we going to have a meeting?".

John

 

[ixoye87]

I also attend my second high service during Maunday thursday. I went to the cathedral 2 years ago, before that I was in a methodist church. The youth service at the cathedral is more contemporary, more like praise and worship, followed by cell, somewhat like sunday school. I attended my first anglican service at the church in my school, my math teacher invited us for his daughter's baptism, but I wasn't used to the robes thing and all the liturgy then,I love it now!!! But during my first anglican service, it was hard for me to understand what was going on, and I couldn't sing the hymns, coz it was all in mandarin (my school is an anglican mission school setup by missionaries from China). Now, I'm thinking of going for confirmation class at the cathedral, coz though I'm baptized, my teacher said I can't receive communion until I'm confirmed.

 

[Historicus]

Hello Everyone!
I also recently attended my first Anglican service. It was in the Advent season, and was wonderful! I also was a member of a Baptist Church, and found the Liturgy and Sacraments so Wonderful! The Episcopal Church is a wonderful place to worship our risen Lord! And how can I forget the wonderful Book of Common Prayer... I have fell in love with it! The prayers are so uplifting, and powerful... they are certainly inspired by God! I hope to learn more about the Anglican Church, and all of Christianity.

Christ's Love and Peace +