My Oriental Orthodox Friends!

[davidlazarus]

Blessings Anglian,

Thank you for your kind words, perhaps it is just the excellent example set down here by people such as yourself that have set a high standard of Christian love, fellowship and dialogue, and of cause by the aid of the Lord to guide us in how He would have us interact with one another.

As for the British Orthodox Church website, I am very interested and will be sure to go there and have a look.

Lately I have just begun doing a little study on the Coptic influence in the British isles, in particular, Ireland and found much Coptic influence from the early monks that went there prior to Rome establishing their rule through Augustine of Canterbury and Patrick, evidenced by such things as the celtic cross being almost identical to the Coptic cross and the surprising number of coptic names of places in Ireland dating back to the early years.

Thanks for the site address, if the Lord is willing, I'll be speaking to you there as well.

Peace and love to you

David

 

[Anglian]

Dear David,

Thank you for your kind words; it is so good to see the Christian spirit here.

If you go to the BOC site and look up past issues of the Glastonbury Review (our magazine) you'll find an article about the Coptic connection and Ireland. There is indeed a long an honourable connection.

Peace and blessings in Christ,

Anglian

 

[zhilan]

Dear Tom.

I look forward to hearing more about your Church.

We found, and continue to find, the Copts so wonderfully loving and receptive to us as British Orthodox Christians. Unlike some Orthodox there was no fuss about language or culture, that great and good man Pope Shenouda saw at once that what mattered was whether we were Orthodox, and that that was all that mattered. Satisfied with that, we came under his jurisdiction, our Metropolitan became a member of the Holy Synod and we continue to grow in the Spirit.

May it be an omen for you.

In peace,

Anglian

That's so cool. I was reading about Pope Shenouda when he was visiting America several weeks back and he is truly an amazing man. I suspect he may be a living Saint.

 

[Anglian]

Dear Zhilan,

Thank you for your kind words about His Holiness. He is indeed one of the great Christian leaders of our (and any other) time. He is coming to the UK in two weeks time, and the excitement is already evident in the Coptic community.

In Christ,

Anglian

 

[MetropolitanSamuel]

Good morning brothers and sisters ...

I am Metropolitan +Samuel of The American Orthodox Catholic Church ... and yes indeed, Tom is one of the Seminarians of this Jurisdiction. What he speaks is absloutely the truth. We are working to become recognized by one of the Oriental Orthodox patriarchs. I pray this may occur this summer, as a friend of this Jurisdiction who is a Priest with the Orthodox Church of India will be speaking to his Council on interchurch relations about recognition.

Knowing what you all know about The American Orthodox Catholic Church ... this question comes to mind. Would the Patriarch of Alexandria, HH Shenouda, recognize such a Jurisdiction as the AOCC? I do not ask anyone speak for him, but it is just a general question.

In God's Peace ...

Metropolitan +Samuel

 

[MetropolitanSamuel]

Dear Anglian ...

I read your post wherein you mentioned comuunion with an american church. The American Orthodox Catholic Church would welcome such a communion. Also ... I have contacted HH Pope Shenouda. I pray he responds to me.

Metropolitan +Samuel

 

[ReadingForOrders]

Dear David, dear Tom,

I have been away from the Forum this week, and it is edifying and wonderful to come back and find this example of Christian love and guidance at work here.

It is good to see you back my friend and indeed I have enjoyed the discussion here.

If Tom will go to the British Orthodox Church website at this link
http://www.britishorthodox.org/fellowship.php
and then click on join on line, he'll find the way to come to our British orthodox forum; I don't know if you, David, would also be interested, but we are always happy to have new people with us.

I have done so. It is a very interesting site.

The BOC Fellowship is for those who are either Oriental Orthodox or are interested in knowing more about us; it is an eirenic and prayerful forum where we try to share our experiences on the journey to theosis.

It is always good to have a traveling companion isn't it?

Peace be with you both,

Anglian[/quote]

And with you as well my friend!


Tom

 

[ReadingForOrders]

Good morning brothers and sisters ...

I am Metropolitan +Samuel of The American Orthodox Catholic Church ... and yes indeed, Tom is one of the Seminarians of this Jurisdiction. What he speaks is absloutely the truth. We are working to become recognized by one of the Oriental Orthodox patriarchs. I pray this may occur this summer, as a friend of this Jurisdiction who is a Priest with the Orthodox Church of India will be speaking to his Council on interchurch relations about recognition.

Knowing what you all know about The American Orthodox Catholic Church ... this question comes to mind. Would the Patriarch of Alexandria, HH Shenouda, recognize such a Jurisdiction as the AOCC? I do not ask anyone speak for him, but it is just a general question.

In God's Peace ...

Metropolitan +Samuel

How wonderful to log on and find your post today your Grace!
As you can see by this thread I have received a wonderful reception here.
Obviously at this point any other questions about our little body should be addressed to you. I hope that my answers so far have been accurate and truthful.

Again Welcome!

Tom

 

[Anglian]

Your Grace, Dear Tom,

What a pleasure to have you both here.

Obviously only Pope Shenouda can answer your Grace's most important question; but we in the British Orthodox Church can bear witness to his wise handling of such enquiries.

Our own Metropolitan, Abba Seraphim, has much experience that may prove useful at some point. I do hope - and pray - that your own talks will have a good outcome. The joy of being in communion with the rest of the Oriental Orthodox family needs to be felt to be appreciated.

We are honoured to have your Grace with us here.

In peace,

Anglian

 

[MetropolitanSamuel]

My brother in Christ Anglian and Dear Tom ...

The welcome I have felt from all of you has honored me. I never felt this with the eastern churches. I am happy to fellowship with you and hopefully we can learn and grow together.

Yes Tom ... you have been accurate and truthful. I thank you for opening the door to this dialogue.

May God bless you all.

 

[copticorthodoxy]

Good morning brothers and sisters ...

I am Metropolitan +Samuel of The American Orthodox Catholic Church ... and yes indeed, Tom is one of the Seminarians of this Jurisdiction. What he speaks is absloutely the truth. We are working to become recognized by one of the Oriental Orthodox patriarchs. I pray this may occur this summer, as a friend of this Jurisdiction who is a Priest with the Orthodox Church of India will be speaking to his Council on interchurch relations about recognition.

Knowing what you all know about The American Orthodox Catholic Church ... this question comes to mind. Would the Patriarch of Alexandria, HH Shenouda, recognize such a Jurisdiction as the AOCC? I do not ask anyone speak for him, but it is just a general question.

In God's Peace ...

Metropolitan +Samuel

Welcome in the Orthodox forum

you are Metropolitan so you were a monk ?? is there monasteries in your church ?

 

[Anglian]

Your Grace,

Thank you for your kind words. The British Orthodox have found in their dealings with the Copts nothing but the most Christian spirit of love and understanding.

As you will see from our website, our apostolic descent was through a French bishop, Jules Ferrette who was consecrated in the Syrian (as it then was) Orthodox Church. But over the years the connection between us and the Syrian Church was lost, although we never forgot it.

So often, in discussions with some Orthodox Churches questions of ethnicity and language seem to predominate; not with the Copts. Immensely (and rightly) proud of their ancient lineage and language, they have shown us true Christian love. What His Holiness Pope Shenouda III wanted to know was were we Orthodox in our theology and Christology? Once he was satisfied on these things, then the rest was plain sailing.

He is quite happy not only for us to use our own language, but also for us to use the ancient Liturgy of St. James - which is a tribute to our Syriac origins. We use an English translation of the Coptic Agbeya and all our services are in English. His Holiness recognises, as did his apostolic predecessors, that evangelisation has to take place in the language of the people.

Thus we have our own beloved Metropolitan, Abba Seraphim, as a member of the Holy Synod, and excellent relations with the Copts in Egypt and the UK.

One of the things I have noticed is the difference between a Church which has been on the receiving end of persecution for a millennium and a half, and those Churches which have had an imperial past; identification with the Suffering Servant has produced a spirit of love and understanding.

My prayers and with you and your Church,

In peace,

Anglian

 

[MetropolitanSamuel]

Anglian and all ...

I spoke to the Holy Synod of The American orthodox Catholic Church to clarify our stance as a Jurisdiction. While we understand and accept the fact that the every truth and teaching necessary to the true Orthodox Christian faith is found in the first three councils of the Church, we also accept the "Rehashings" of those same truths in the remaining councils. We also accept the fact that the last 4 councils were not truly ecumenical. Again ... it is the teachings that are important to us. I believe our Orthodoxy is far closer to that of the Oriental Churches.

For the sale of our posterity however, because the roots of The American Orthodox Catholic Church come from the Church of Russia, (the Ethiopian lineage was transmitted to me and the current manifestation of the AOCC by Archbishop Worley), we hold to eastern Orthodoxy. I am sure there are some of you who are familiar with Archbishop Aftimios Ofiesh, the one who began The American Orthodox Catholic Church. We are his spiritual sons.

That having been said however, we wish to make the AOCC a place of welcome for all those of the Orthodox Christian faith, whether they be eastern or oriental. That was the wish of our beloved Archbishop Walter Myron Propheta of Blessed memory.

We do not seek brotherhood and friendship with the eastern Jurisdictions because of their belief they are the only true bastions of orthodoxy. We seek this brotherhood with all of you in the Oriental Churches. rest assured you all will find welcome with the American Orthodox Catholic Church.

Let us strive to recognize one another and the validity of our lineages and ministries.

Metropolitan +Samuel

 

[MetropolitanSamuel]

Dear Copticorthodoxy ...

In response to your question ... I am not a Monk. Actually, I am a former Roman Catholic and convert to orthodoxy. I wish I had the time to become a Monk. I hold down full time secular employment, and have other responsibilities that are sometimes very time consumming. I am celibate, however.

We are currently in the process of rebuilding the monastic presence that was once in The American Orthodox Catholic Church. We have a few Nuns at present, and are in the process of bringing in over 100 Monks and Nuns.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Putting Pope Shenouda into my prayers so he is fully able to discern everything.

I hope this is good news.

God Bless.

 

[Anglian]

Dear Warrior Angel,

Many thanks for your typically kind and thoughtful post; what a good example you are to all of us here and on the OBOB board (by the way, love your new 'character' and hope you are getting warmer now!).

Dear Metropolitan Samuel,

We do, indeed, all come to Orthodoxy in the way He guides and leads us.

Our view of the later Church Councils is that on the whole we don't have a problem with them (on the whole) but that since we weren't invited, they are not 'ecumenical' in the sense as accepted by the whole Church. Of course, those who would wish to exclude us from the Church because we failed to accept some of the distinctly dubious language of Chalcedon, will regard that as of no account, which is their privilege, so to say.

We take a more eirenic view, and are glad that at II Constantinople the Chalcedonians clarified some of the dubious language and decisions of Chalcedon. We remain in talks about mutual recognition, and it would be good to see the Orthodox family reunited. But history, time and circumstance have put many obstacles in the way of that, and we shall, no doubt, have to await the same processes before we can do the will of Him who commanded us to be one in love.

In peace,

Anglian

 

[MetropolitanSamuel]

Anglian ...

Sounds to me like we are indeed on the same page. If you and others would be interested, I have 13 principles of Orthodoxy as put forth by our founding Holy Father Archbishop Aftimios Ofiesh, (who actually was once a Cleric in the Syrian Orthodox Patriarchate of Antioch and came to America to minister with Archbishop Raphael Hawaweeny in the American Syrian Mission).

Also ... The American Orthodox Catholic Church, in the 1960's and early 1970's included Oriental Orthodoxy ... via The Ethiopian Orthodox Coptic Church of North and South America shepherded by Metropolitan Gabre Mikael. It was Gabre Mikael who was primary consecrator for my primary consecrator, Archbishop David Worley, known when he was with the EOCC as Abuna Jeremiah.

 

[zhilan]

Dear Zhilan,

Thank you for your kind words about His Holiness. He is indeed one of the great Christian leaders of our (and any other) time. He is coming to the UK in two weeks time, and the excitement is already evident in the Coptic community.

In Christ,

Anglian

One thing that really blew me away was how he has expanded the Coptic Church under his leadership. I remember reading some amazing figures about how, for example, when he became pope there were very few Coptic Churches outsides of Egypt and now you can find them everywhere.

 

[Anglian]

Your Grace,

It does indeed sound as though we are on the same page. If you were happy to share with us your 13 principles that would be of great interest.

In Christ,

Anglian

Anglian ...

Sounds to me like we are indeed on the same page. If you and others would be interested, I have 13 principles of Orthodoxy as put forth by our founding Holy Father Archbishop Aftimios Ofiesh, (who actually was once a Cleric in the Syrian Orthodox Patriarchate of Antioch and came to America to minister with Archbishop Raphael Hawaweeny in the American Syrian Mission).

Also ... The American Orthodox Catholic Church, in the 1960's and early 1970's included Oriental Orthodoxy ... via The Ethiopian Orthodox Coptic Church of North and South America shepherded by Metropolitan Gabre Mikael. It was Gabre Mikael who was primary consecrator for my primary consecrator, Archbishop David Worley, known when he was with the EOCC as Abuna Jeremiah.

 

[lionroar0]

This thread has been very uplifting personally.

Your grace welcome to CF. I hope that you will be a continual presence here.

Peace