My Judgment Day Defence Strategy

[doubtingmerle]

Recently a poster commented on my Judgment Day Defence Strategy. That concept is a little odd to me, since I sincerely doubt that life after death is even possible. I therfore never expect to need to defend my life at a future judgement day in the afterlife. But suppose to my shock I someday find myself in that position. My defence might sound something like this:

I did my best to live a worthy life. I had no way of knowing what God or any other transcendent being asked of me, but I did know this:

1. I am human.
2. I am surrounded by other humans.
3. There is something very good about being human.
4. Humans have emotional and physical needs that are best fulfilled by working in cooperation with others.
​

Therefore, I have done the best I could to work in cooperation with others, caring for their emotional and physical needs, and working together with them to promote the best for all of us.
​

Do you have a better Judgment Day Defence Strategy?

​

 

[Faulty]

The problem with that defense is that you'll be judged as compared to the rightousness of God Himself, and not compared to any other man.

James 2:10 tells us that is we ever break any part of the Law, then we are accountable for all of it.

Living a "worthy" life won't even be part of the salvation equation.

My defense will be this...

1. I have sinned according to the scriptures (Rom 3:23, 5:12).

2. I am accountable to You as if I have broken your law completly (Jam 2:10).

3. My good deeds look to You as filthy rags (Isaiah 64:6). Therefore I am unable to reconcile myself to You through any of my works, regardless of how pure my motives seem to be (Eph 2:8-9).

4. You made your Son to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God, and by this I am able to be reconciled to You (2 Cor 5:20-21).

5. You were pleased for our sake to crush Him, placing all our sins upon him as the acceptable and final sacrifice for us (Isa 53:4-6, Heb 9:26)

6. It was by faith that I believed in Jesus as my sacrifice for my sins and have been saved, through His righteousness only and not my own (John 3:16, Rom 4:24-25, Rom 10:9, 1 Tim 1:16, Eph 2:1-9, Gal 2:15-16, etc...).
​

This is the defense that has been promised will not put me to shame on that day, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame”
Romans 10:11.


"For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast." Eph 2:8-9

 

[bling]

Recently a poster commented on my Judgment Day Defence Strategy. That concept is a little odd to me, since I sincerely doubt that life after death is even possible. I therfore never expect to need to defend my life at a future judgement day in the afterlife. But suppose to my shock I someday find myself in that position. My defence might sound something like this:

I did my best to live a worthy life. I had no way of knowing what God or any other transcendent being asked of me, but I did know this:

1. I am human.
2. I am surrounded by other humans.
3. There is something very good about being human.
4. Humans have emotional and physical needs that are best fulfilled by working in cooperation with others.
​

Therefore, I have done the best I could to work in cooperation with others, caring for their emotional and physical needs, and working together with them to promote the best for all of us.
​

Do you have a better Judgment Day Defence Strategy?

​

You are not entering a courtroom to plead your case. Your life is known and the results are automatic
This time in court is for sentencing (receiving you reward). You maybe surprised either way but God will be doing the talking and say what your heart was saying.
Pray each day for mercy.

 

[doubtingmerle]

The problem with that defense is that you'll be judged as compared to the rightousness of God Himself, and not compared to any other man.

That seems a little harsh to me. Doesn't God realize we are human? Why would he expect anything more of us than what humans are capable of?

James 2:10 tells us that is we ever break any part of the Law, then we are accountable for all of it.

So if a child takes a cookie without permission he is guilty of murder and rape? I disagree.

3. My good deeds look to You as filthy rags (Isaiah 64:6).

That bad?

Perhaps you should be doing good deeds that are better than the good deeds you are doing.

5. You were pleased for our sake to crush Him, placing all our sins upon him as the acceptable and final sacrifice for us (Isa 53:4-6, Heb 9:26)

How can it be acceptable to punish somebody else for our sins? That doesn't sound fair.

6. It was by faith that I believed in Jesus as my sacrifice for my sins and have been saved, through His righteousness only and not my own

His righteousness only? So even if you have no righteousness at all, his righteousness would be sufficient? Even if you rape, murder and pillage, that in no way hinders your standing on judgment day?

 

[razeontherock]

That bad?

Perhaps you should be doing good deeds that are better than the good deeds you are doing.

those are the BEST of deeds. and literally it doesn't say just a filthy rag, but a used menstrual cloth. Which also had sin attached to it.

How can it be acceptable to punish somebody else for our sins? That doesn't sound fair.

Here, logic can be your friend. If you are having difficulty comprehending substitutionary atonement, expiatory power and propitiation, look into Christus Victor. It's more to the point anyway.

His righteousness only? So even if you have no righteousness at all, his righteousness would be sufficient? Even if you rape, murder and pillage, that in no way hinders your standing on judgment day?

Don't forget the plunder; it's rape, pillage and plunder. Very important I have not given in to those ancestral urges because sin clearly does affect us on Judgment Day, sad to say ...

Bottom line is the One who paid the ransom for our sin is also our Defense Attorney, and our Judge. No wonder why all Judgment is given to Him, eh?

Answers that come from Him matter!

 

[drich0150]

Do you have a better Judgment Day Defense Strategy?

​

When I first identified (At the time) your current work as a Judgment day defense strategy, it was to show you the irony in all of your efforts.. In that you were and are engaged in an effort that your professed system of belief does not support, but at the sometime you seem to be hard at work preparing excuses for your own disbelief in a God or an afterlife..

My comment was Not indented to be an invitation for you to futilely try and work out an actual defense strategy. Primarily because the only defense is an actual guilty plea that one has to make in this life. Once you acknowledge that you are guilty (A sinner) then you must seek atonement for that sin. That can only be done through the completed work of Christ on the cross. It is only through this atonement that we can be found not guilty.

If you still feel a need then by all means proceed, I guess it is your own way of trying to explore what you do not understand. However, If you do seek clarity and understanding then know your "judgment" will not be depend on your ability to fool or mislead God with the same philosophy you have fooled yourself into believing. You WILL stand or present yourself before God as a completely guilty person. You will know without doubt where you stand, because everything will be laid bare before Him, and there is nothing to say, nor any excuse that can be made. You will admit your guilt and weeping receive your judgment without a defense.

The only time a Judgment Day defense strategy is actually used is in this life. It is used to aid the unbeliever in accepting his Godless sense of moral/personal righteousness... As witnessed by your outline. It is not a tool that you can employ on the day of your judgment.

If you truly want a glimpse of this day then with all your heart ask for one and keep asking till you get what your heart seeks.

 

[doubtingmerle]

those are the BEST of deeds. and literally it doesn't say just a filthy rag, but a used menstrual cloth. Which also had sin attached to it.

The best we can do is like a used menstrual cloth?

Dear sir, I beg to differ. It would seem to me that people can do many worthy things.

If the best we can do is like a used menstrual cloth, then is there any case for human self-esteem at all? Is there no dignity to being human?

How can it be acceptable to punish somebody else for our sins? That doesn't sound fair.

Here, logic can be your friend. If you are having difficulty comprehending substitutionary atonement, expiatory power and propitiation, look into Christus Victor. It's more to the point anyway.

How does Christus Victor answer the question of how it can be acceptable to punish somebody else for our sins?

Don't forget the plunder; it's rape, pillage and plunder. Very important I have not given in to those ancestral urges because sin clearly does affect us on Judgment Day, sad to say ...

Bottom line is the One who paid the ransom for our sin is also our Defense Attorney, and our Judge. No wonder why all Judgment is given to Him, eh?

Ah, so your Judgement Day Defense Strategy includes your own rightousness? So the statement by Faulty that salvation from judgement is "through His righteousness only and not my own" is faulty reasoning? (pun intended).

Answers that come from Him matter!

Except nobody seems to be able to figure out which answers come from Him. See http://www.christianforums.com/t7526630/

 

[Uncle Floyd]

I had no way of knowing what God or any other transcendent being asked of me

Really? So the Bible notwithstanding, you don't have a conscience? You don't have any internal mechanism that tells you that something is wrong or that causes you to feel any guilt or remorse when you've done something wrong?

Therefore, I have done the best I could to work in cooperation with others, caring for their emotional and physical needs, and working together with them to promote the best for all of us.

Unfortunately, doing the best you can doesn't negate your sin.

It isn't like a ledger sheet, where you take one credit for good works out of one column and then put it in another column to balance out the debits of your sin.

If you've sinned, then you have to be judged for that sin.

Do you have a better Judgment Day Defence Strategy?

Yes: "Nothing in my hand I bring, simply to Christ's cross I cling".

 

[razeontherock]

You are not entering a courtroom to plead your case. Your life is known and the results are automatic
This time in court is for sentencing (receiving you reward). You maybe surprised either way but God will be doing the talking and say what your heart was saying.
Pray each day for mercy.

+1. I think that is what Scripture teaches, but this applies to the Judgment of rewards, not the Great White Throne of Judgment. 2 different things; the latter I hope to never face

 

[razeontherock]

The best we can do is like a used menstrual cloth?

Dear sir, I beg to differ. It would seem to me that people can do many worthy things.

If the best we can do is like a used menstrual cloth, then is there any case for human self-esteem at all? Is there no dignity to being human?

Rather, it makes sense to understand humility from a Biblical perspective:

people often berate themselves, conjuring up their worst in an effort to humble themselves before G-d. I don't mean to make light of a sincere effort, but this is false humility. When we put forth our best, and compare it to G-d Himself - THAT is humility. And that is the "filthy rags" text, in context.

How does Christus Victor answer the question of how it can be acceptable to punish somebody else for our sins?

It is a higher understanding, that is more to the point of the Gospel, rather than merely focusing on substitutionary atonement. If the latter gives you trouble, the former is an alternative route. The Orthodox say go that route either way.

Ah, so your Judgement Day Defense Strategy includes your own rightousness? So the statement by Faulty that salvation from judgement is "through His righteousness only and not my own" is faulty reasoning? (pun intended).

I don't see how this follows from what I said. Again, there is no "Salvation from Judgment." We are translated from the kingdom of darkness to the glorious Kingdom of His dear Son. There is a different judgment, w/ different rules. In this Kingdom - He rules! Mercifully.

Except nobody seems to be able to figure out which answers come from Him. See http://www.christianforums.com/t7526630/

That still doesn't get to the bottom of the matter. You need answers from Him not found in any text. DAILY.

 

[doubtingmerle]

Really? So the Bible notwithstanding, you don't have a conscience? You don't have any internal mechanism that tells you that something is wrong or that causes you to feel any guilt or remorse when you've done something wrong?

Yes, of course I have a sense of right and wrong.

What I said was, "I had no way of knowing what God or any other transcendent being asked of me"

How can you be certain that your conscience is telling you what God wants you to do?

 

[doubtingmerle]

If the best we can do is like a used menstrual cloth, then is there any case for human self-esteem at all? Is there no dignity to being human?

Rather, it makes sense to understand humility from a Biblical perspective:

people often berate themselves, conjuring up their worst in an effort to humble themselves before G-d. I don't mean to make light of a sincere effort, but this is false humility. When we put forth our best, and compare it to G-d Himself - THAT is humility. And that is the "filthy rags" text, in context.

I don't see how that begins to address the question. Is there or is there not a case for human dignity and self-esteem? If so, how can that be true if the best we can accomplish is a filthy-menstrual-cloth equivalent of good? And if there is no case for human dignity, what a sad life that would be!

That still doesn't get to the bottom of the matter. You need answers from Him not found in any text. DAILY.

Except nobody agrees on what answers are coming from "Him". If one person thinks "He" is instructing to destroy the work that another thinks "He" is telling to do, could both really be hearing from "Him"?

 

[Uncle Floyd]

Yes, of course I have a sense of right and wrong.

So then it's not true that you have no way of knowing what God requires of you.

How can you be certain that your conscience is telling you what God wants you to do?

Because I can measure it by the Word of God.

 

[doubtingmerle]

Yes, of course I have a sense of right and wrong.

So then it's not true that you have no way of knowing what God requires of you.

Uh but you yourself admit that we need to verify whether our sense of right and wrong agrees with God. So simply saying I have a sense of right and wrong does not prove I know for certain what God requires.

How can you be certain that your conscience is telling you what God wants you to do?

Because I can measure it by the Word of God.

OK, if only we knew which books were God's Word.

Nobody seems to be able to tell me how I could know that a book was God's word. Is Matthew God's Word? Is the Epistle of Barnabas God's Word? Is The Purpose Driven Life? How about the Book of Morman?

If you have an effective way of knowing which books are God's Word, perhaps you could jump on this thread-- http://www.christianforums.com/t7526630/ --and let us know how you know. Thanks.

 

[Uncle Floyd]

Uh but you yourself admit that we need to verify whether our sense of right and wrong agrees with God. So simply saying I have a sense of right and wrong does not prove I know for certain what God requires.

It shows that God has given you a way to know what He requires of you.

OK, if only we knew which books were God's Word.

We do.

Nobody seems to be able to tell me how I could know that a book was God's word. Is Matthew God's Word?

Yes.

Is the Epistle of Barnabas God's Word? Is The Purpose Driven Life? How about the Book of Morman?

No.

 

[doubtingmerle]

Uncle Floyd,

Can you explain to me how you know that Matthew is God's Word, and the Epistle of Barnabas is not?

Thanks!

 

[Uncle Floyd]

Uncle Floyd,

Can you explain to me how you know that Matthew is God's Word, and the Epistle of Barnabas is not?

Thanks!

Because one meets the criteria of, among other things, internal consistency, while the other does not.

 

[doubtingmerle]

Because one meets the criteria of, among other things, internal consistency, while the other does not.

Ah, I see, so Matthew is God's word because it is internally consistent?

And if I find contraditions between Matthew and other books, then Matthew is not God's word?

Very interesting. I guess we can write off Matthew.

 

[CatholicForSure]

Do you have a better Judgment Day Defence Strategy?

Yes. Obey God insead of trying to outwit him

 

[doubtingmerle]

Because one meets the criteria of, among other things, internal consistency, while the other does not.

Well according to Razeontherock (http://www.christianforums.com/t7526630-13/#post56667278), "As long as you are prioritizing documents, you will not be making room in your inner being for the Lord whom you presumably wish to approach."

Is Razeontherock correct? If so, why are you prioritizing docments?