My fear of Proverbs

[annrobert]

Because no one will be searching diligently for God while they are in Hell. It would be useless and they would know it.

Jesus said there would be weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth.I bet with the amount of torment they are in ,they do cry out despite themsleves.
in revelations it says they are tormented in the presence of the Lamb,therefore I bet they do call out and beg and weep to get out of the torment despite themselves.
Even in Abrahams bosom, the rich man asked for water, despite the chasm.
However Jesus did go preach to those in prison when He died and set many free.So for those ones it did help , even if it won't later.

These verses cannot contradict all the verses Jesus speaks about come to Me All ye that labour and are heavy laden and I will give you rest,and whosoever will let him come drink drink freely of the water of life.And he that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out.
and God commands all men everywhere to repent.Therefore Robert you are welcome to repent and Jesus kindness and longsuffering brings us to repentance.Condemnation and fear make people scared,but Jesus mercy invites with all of His power to forgive sin and save to the uttermost.Do not let ocd lie to you.Just ask Jesus to help you and never give up because you will overcome.Jesus is our Saviour,we can trust Him.
blessings
annrobert

 

[SoldierOfSoul]

He's the God of the universe! He hates sin sure but He loves man, He made us! Robert their is nothing to fear, there is no need to fear the God who says that He is love, the one who says that His mercy endures forever! Forever Robert, His mercy is everlasting, He hates sin so much that He took our place for it, but that also shows how very much He loves His creation, that the creating God of the universe would die and go through horrible pain to save a lost rebellious sinner, the love is beyond comprehension. But is is true, praise God it is true! It is the greatest news in the world Robert, there is no reason to be afraid, Jesus is loving and merciful, He is Emmanuel, God with us! He is our Saviour our God our great High Priest, He is the worthy Lamb of God. We are unworthy all of us, but He is worthy of all our praise; we are just sinners but He is the great God Almighty the King of glory. His love for us is so real, why would He die for us? Because He loves us! The same love that makes angels perplexed when they look down at earth. They say to themselves "Our blessed King is going down their for them?" But yes is is true! He has risen, in heaven they are still celebrating His return, His victorious triumph over death and satan! Glory to His name! No fear Robert, He died for you! Join in the celebration!

For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
(Isaiah 9:6)

God bless you Robert and know that Jesus loves you very much.

 

[kaykay9.0]

BTW it isnt just vernon mcgee who see's this passage of Proverbs in this light, a lot of pastors agree that it has to do with the sinner hardening himself against the Spirit of the Lord.

I just have to say one more time and several others have said this, proverbs is a book all about wisdom. I truly, truly believe that this interpretation you are fearing is a stretch to say this is about salvation and not wisdom. Of course, it's wisdom to come to Christ, but just like people who teach on interpreting scripture say that you can't take a parable and try to apply extra single detail of it cause it's written as a parable. So it is with this I believe. I believe the proper interpretation of the verses you are afraid of is this and simply this:

It is foolishness to spurn wisdom and if you do, there will come a time when you will regret it.

I really believe that is absolutely all these verses are saying. You could obviously apply them to salvation but trying to make every detail fit of what is written as a literary device just doesn't work in my opinion.

 

[RobertZ]

It is foolishness to spurn wisdom and if you do, there will come a time when you will regret it.

Thats exactly right! but how can you not see that this can apply to salvation as well? The spirit of the Lord says "because I have stretched out my hand and ye refused".

This is what hardened sinners do when the Holy Spirit calls them to salvation, they resist and resist and resist until the Holy Spirit ceases to strive with them.

Then their can come a point later in that persons life (such as the way it happened with me) when they realize that they need salvation but................OH NO! Too little to late because the Holy Spirit has forsaken the arrogant hardened sinner!

You have to come when the Holy Spirit is dealing with you and calling you, later in life their will come a time when you realized you should have gotten saved while the Holy Spirit was convicting you but it will be too late.


I dont believe every hardened sinner goes to the grave unknowingly of what they did, I think people like me who grew up in church and resisted all their life will face a situation later on that will make them regret that they didnt heed the callings of the Holy Spirit. Such as my case, I have no purpose in life now and I am completely and utterly ruined.

 

[kaykay9.0]

Yes, robertz, the precept or principle here about spurning wisdom can be applicable to salvation OR spurning wisdom about every other piece of wisdom in the world.

But I don't think it is specifically referring to salvation though, and hence, I don't think you can try to force this "literary device" of the personification of wisdom to apply to everything concerning salvation.

Let me try to explain better what I meant about interpreting parables and hopefully, you will see my point. I have read from people who were discussing how to interpret scripture that if you read for example, one of the parables Jesus told, that it is erroneous to try to force every detail in the story or parable to "fit" some spiritual principle.

I think this is much the same here when you attempt to make this whole section of Proverbs fit a situation concerning salvation.

To be more specific, I don't think God is laughing or deriding people about not accepting Christ soon enough. I think this is stretching the application waaaaaaay more than what was meant here. How can I explain this~ When we try to force an interpretation waaay beyond what the originl intent was, I think we can arrive at false theology. And I think you have done so here. Maybe some teachers would teach this, but if they are, I'm sorry, but I think they're just flat wrong. No matter how good a teacher someone is, they can be wrong. I'm not so arrogant to think that I also couldn't be wrong here too, but I don't think so in this case. I really don't.

And furthermore, I arrived at my interpretation of this passage by reading it alone, but when you further add other scriptures in to help interpret such as the "whosoever wills..." in other parts of the Bible, I think it becomes abundantly even clearer that this passage does not FULLY represent salvation and proper theology about it.

Finally, let me say that IMO, some hardened people may go to the grave knowing they are not right with God, but I think those people are also not willing or desirous of turning to God either. I know your OCD and maybe your theology makes you believe otherwise, but I can only tell you that I don't believe a person even has the will or the "want to" to come to God if God is not still extending grace to them.

 

[annrobert]

kaykay wrote an excellent post here Robert, try to read it carefully and think about what she is saying.Robert it is not too late for you at all,you are thinking He has less forgiveness than a man.Jesus has all authority in heaven and in earth and He came to save not condemn.Jesus says whosoever will let Him come.Just come Robert ,with all your fear and anguish and hopeless feelings,just come.Keep looking to Jesus to heal you and open your eyes to His mercy,because that is what He is going to do for you.Never never give up Robert,Jesus can heal your emotions and memories and take the confusion away.Jesus delights in mercy and is mighty to save.Jesus cares deeply for the broken hearted and bruised reed.Jesus loves you just the way you are you do not have to fix yourself first as we can do nothing without Him.I pray that Jesus will open your eyes to His mercy and grace.
annrobert

 

[Jesuslovesme29]

I think you need to seek the Lord with Patience and Faith on what the truth is.

What we believe reguarding ourselves, the state we are in and wisdom and understand of His Word can be often times wrong, and very well taken out of context.

James 1:5-7 If you need wisdom, ask our generous God, and he will give it to you. He will not rebuke you for asking. 6 But when you ask him, be sure that your faith is in God alone. Do not waver, for a person with divided loyalty is as unsettled as a wave of the sea that is blown and tossed by the wind. 7 Such people should not expect to receive anything from the Lord.

Stop looking at internet commentary, it will screw around with your faith.

Start seeking the Lord with all your heart soul and mind (Deuteronomy 4:29)