Most OT prophetic passages futurists think are about the End Times, aren't

DavidPT · Oct 30, 2021

Douggg said:
"Why not?"

Because Antiochus IV was not time of the end.

Daniel 8:17, the little horn person is time of the end. He meets his end when he attempts to stand up against the Prince of princes -Jesus. Daniel 8:25.

Which takes place, when he as the beast convinces the kings of the earth to assemble their armies at Armageddon to try and stop Jesus from executing judgment on them, Revelation 19:17-21.

______________________________________________

Regarding the little horn, who cannot be Antiochus IV, ......

In Daniel 8, the angel Gabriel appears in the form of a man to Daniel to explain about the vision of the little horn....

9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

15 And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.

16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

In Daniel 9, Gabriel again appears, and again in the form of a man, to Daniel...

21 Yea, whiles I was speaking in prayer, even the man Gabriel, whom I had seen in the vision at the beginning, being caused to fly swiftly, touched me about the time of the evening oblation.

22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding.

23 At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision.

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

What most people do not realize is that the vision referred to in Daniel 9 is the vision that Daniel had in Daniel 8 when he first encountered Gabriel.

Daniel in the first verses of Daniel 9 was praying about the 70 years of Babylonian captivity to be about over... which in Daniei 9:23 is the "matter".

The vision in Daniel 9:23, however, is about the vision of the little horn Daniel had in Daniel 8.

Daniel had no vision in Daniel 9, prior to Gabriel's appearance, nor afterward in Daniel 9. Prior to Gabriel's appearance, Daniel had been speaking to God in prayer, Daniel 9:21.

Gabriel, in Daniel 9:24-27, gave Daniel skill and understanding about the future of his people and Jerusalem, and of the vision of the little horn person - to take place in the 70th week.

The little horn person will be the prince who shall come. Who as the Antichrist will confirm the Mt. Sinai covenant for the 7 years, as required by Moses in Deuteronomy 31:9-13. Then in the middle part of the 7 years stops the daily sacrifice and commits the transgression of desolation act by going into the temple and claims to have achieved God-hood.

Douggg, can you not see that what is recorded in Daniel 11:31-35 is also recorded in Daniel 12? How can anything recorded in Daniel 12 possibly involve Antiochus 4?

Daniel 11:31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.

Compare with Daniel 12.

Daniel 12:9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end.
10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Verse 10 involves verse 11 in Daniel 12. Verse 35 in Daniel 11 involves verse 31 in that same chapter. We need to be combining these accounts, not separating them.

RandyPNW · Oct 30, 2021

Douggg said:
No Antiochus 4 in Daniel 8.

Antiochus 4 is in Daniel 11:29-31, committing what is a preview of the end time abomination of desolation.

Your opinion is noted. There's only a few interpretations of any note, that I'm aware of. Belief that Dan 8 is speaking of Antiochus 4

Douggg said:
No Antiochus 4 in Daniel 8.

Antiochus 4 is in Daniel 11:29-31, committing what is a preview of the end time abomination of desolation.

Your opinion is noted. There aren't many options here. The belief that Antiochus emerges from the empire of Alexander the Great is logical, and is the interpretation many scholars favor. But we all have to be convinced in our own mind.

keras · Oct 30, 2021

DavidPT said:
I of course agree entirely with this, yet this wasn't my point. My point is that both the King meant in Daniel 11:36 and the little horn meant in Daniel 8, these are one and the same, though I unfortunately neglected to mention verse 36 at the time, thus, the king meant in Daniel 11:36 is meaning the same person meant involving Daniel 11:31-35. How can that not be meaning the king meant in verse 36? If it isn't, what then happened to the one involving verses 31-35? Why is he relevant one minute and the next minute he isn't, and that he just disappears from the text altogether without even an explanation whatsoever? How does that make sense?

The reason for confusion with the Prophetic Word is explained by Isaiah 28:13....a little here a little there.
It requires discernment to sort out which has happened and what remains to be fulfilled.
Remember it was all future, [mostly] to Daniel.

A4E was a precursor to what is yet to happen, I believe; in our future.

DavidPT · Oct 30, 2021

keras said:
The reason for confusion with the Prophetic Word is explained by Isaiah 28:13....a little here a little there.
It requires discernment to sort out which has happened and what remains to be fulfilled.
Remember it was all future, [mostly] to Daniel.

A4E was a precursor to what is yet to happen, I believe; in our future.

As to Daniel 8, discernment about those recorded events are rather easy. Maybe not so much so in Daniel 11. But as to Daniel 8, though.

Daniel 8:17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

Daniel 8:19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

Daniel 8:23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.

Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
26 And the vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many days.

It can't get any clearer than this. What I have underlined tells us we are dealing with the end of this age here. Verse 26 says many days, which obviously equates to a few thousand years post when Daniel received the visions, yet, when debating with Amils, in regards to Isaiah 24:22 for example, and the fact it says after many days they shall be visited, and that if one then proposes to them that many days equate to a thousand years, they find that idea preposterous. As if many days can't mean that amount of time because that doesn't make sense. Yet, in Daniel 8 it clearly proves many days can involve a large amount of time, such as a thousand years or even longer.

BTW, I'm not implying a connection between Daniel 8 and Isaiah 24:22, I only used that as an example since it too mentions many days and that Daniel 8 proves it is not preposterous to take many days to involve a large amount of time, such as a thousand years or longer.

Douggg · Oct 30, 2021

DavidPT said:
Douggg, can you not see that what is recorded in Daniel 11:31-35 is also recorded in Daniel 12? How can anything recorded in Daniel 12 possibly involve Antiochus 4?

Daniel 12 does not pertain to Antiochus IV because the events of Daniel 12 are time of the end.

In Daniel 11:30 Antiochus 1V is forced to turn around by the Romans and is grieved by it... and heading back focuses on hellenizing the Jews.

In Daniel 11:31 pursant to the hellenizing objective, Antiochus IV, stops the daily sacrifice, and according to history has a statue of Zeus placed in the temple, called the abomination that makes desolate in the text.

In Daniel 11:32 the Maccabees, if we apply history, repels Antiochus IV.

Then in Daniel 11:33-35 is a long period covering many centuries to the time of the end.

In Daniel 11:36 at the time of the end, it picks up with the little horn person, the willful king, after he has become the beast claiming to be God.

The battles in Daniel 11:40-45 are the prelude to Armageddon as the nations are drawn in the middle east. (first chart below)

In Daniel 11:45, the beast takes his final stand to his end. (second chart below)

eclipsenow · Oct 30, 2021

Timtofly said:
So you deny these verses have any meaning whatsoever?

So you're using short accusatory questions to avoid the hard work of making a proposition and justifying it with reasonable data again? A lot of people are firing questions at me right now - it would be polite for you to summarise what on earth you are talking about and not resort to your usual 'jab' of a short trite question.

eclipsenow · Oct 30, 2021

keras said:
You are not only incapable of understanding the Prophesies, you make no attempt to do so.
I have posted a sequence of events for the end times. It is basically how Revelation gives it.
The next prophesied event will be the Sixth Seal, the Lord's Day of fiery wrath which will set the scene for all the rest, leading to the Glorious Return of Jesus. Satan will have virtual world control for the final 42 months before the Return.

This is scriptural truth and scoffing about it, as you do, is a crime against God.

So the CME, then Jesus returns to rule over Jerusalem (because Christians are all meant to be in Israel after 2027 - right?) then somehow an AOD knocks Jesus off his throne? Isn't that what you're saying?

Douggg · Oct 30, 2021

DavidPT said:
Verse 10 involves verse 11 in Daniel 12. Verse 35 in Daniel 11 involves verse 31 in that same chapter. We need to be combining these accounts, not separating them.

Because we have historical accounts, we can be certain that Daniel 11:31 can be attributed to Antiochus IV.

Daniel 11:35 is a transitional verse covering many centuries from the time of Antiochus IV and the Maccabees all the way to the time of the end.

The parable of the fig tree generation indicates we now live in the time of the end generation.

Here is my sequential list of time of the end events...

Israel a nation again (1948)
Jews gain possession of Jerusalem again (1967)
EU reorganizes to ten leader form of Gov't
The little horn comes to power
Gog/Magog takes place
end of Islam
little horn comes into middle east
little horn anointed the king of Israel
becomes the Antichrist
Antichrist confirms covenant for 7 years.
False messianic age begins, the great falling away in Christianity begins
The world saying peace and safety
Antichrist breaks covenant.
transgression of desolation act (rapture must take place prior to the ToD act)
beginning years of the Day of the Lord
revealed man of sin killed.
revealed man of sin brought back to life
now the beast
a statue image made of him
triggering the great tribulation
two witnesses killed.
seventh angel sounds his trumpet
war in the second heaven
Satan cast down
vials of wrath poured out
battles of Daniel 11:40-44 take place
Sign of the son of Man in heaven
Armageddon assembly
Armies surround Jerusalem, Zechariah 14
Jesus returns
beast and false prophet cast into the lake of fire
armies destroyed
Satan bound, cast into the bottomless pit
resurrection of the martyred great tribulation saints
the millennium rule of Jesus on this present earth
Satan released from prison
final rebellion, including the former Gog Magog nations
God destroys them
resurrection of all dead
the Great White Throne judgment
New Heaven, New Earth, New Jerusalem
Eternity.

keras · Oct 30, 2021

eclipsenow said:
So the CME, then Jesus returns to rule over Jerusalem (because Christians are all meant to be in Israel after 2027 - right?) then somehow an AOD knocks Jesus off his throne? Isn't that what you're saying?

No. You fail simple comprehension.

Next prophesied event will be the world changer of the Sixth Seal. I believe the Lord will use a Coronal Mass Ejection of unprecedented magnitude to literally fulfil all the Prophesies about that Day.
This will allow the Lord's Christian peoples to migrate and live in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 66:18b-21, Psalms 107, Isaiah 62:1-5, +

About 10 years later Jesus will Return, after all the wrath of God is over. Revelation 15:1

eclipsenow · Oct 30, 2021

keras said:
No. You fail simple comprehension.

Next prophesied event will be the world changer of the Sixth Seal. I believe the Lord will use a Coronal Mass Ejection of unprecedented magnitude to literally fulfil all the Prophesies about that Day.
This will allow the Lord's Christian peoples to migrate and live in all of the holy Land. Isaiah 66:18b-21, Psalms 107, Isaiah 62:1-5, +

About 10 years later Jesus will Return, after all the wrath of God is over. Revelation 15:1

Ah, see, I haven't actually been studying your website - just going off various bits and pieces you've said here - and I thought somehow as a Christian I was 'magically' protected by the CME and transported to Israel where Jesus obviously reigned in a magical New Middle East Garden of Eden that somehow is not heaven and earth wed - yet - but a magical in-between land where I magically somehow live in a Christian nation for a while - in a world that has been destroyed by a CME that makes Mazerunner's CME look tame - but somehow it's not the New Heavens and New Earth yet - and somehow I survived the CME because I'm a Christian - but somehow I migrate to the New Jerusalem with a silly name - without Jesus actually being here to turbo-charge all this. Right. And despite the massive CME that literally fulfils all those OT fire verses NOW in a massive accumulated CME unlike anything the world has ever seen before - in a comprehensive judgement against God's enemies COMPLETELY unlike any OT wars - as you have repeatedly told me - because the cleansing of the land will be SO thorough and SO overwhelming and SO complete - SOMEHOW THERE'S STILL GOING TO BE A ONE-WORLD GOVERNMENT AFTER ALL THAT FIRE?

And the AOD comes from this One World Government - when there's barely anyone left because all those OT fire verses were literally dumped on the earth in one huge cataclysm?

Yeah, all makes perfect sense!

So tell me, is this CME the real deal fire from God we read about in the Sixth Seal - or just a rather bad sunburn for those that get caught out in it? Like, HOW are there enough enemies left over to even form a "One World Government" to fall prey to the AntiChrist?

And there I was believing in the 2 ages model - when yours is so clear and self-explanatory?

Christian Gedge · Oct 31, 2021

eclipsenow said:
Yes, I'm still struggling with Matt 24 - and I'm a lay person. My friends who have studied theology seem to think Matt 24 talks about AD70 and then telescopes out to Judgement Day. There seems to be the FULL "Boltian" (named after Peter Bolt - a client of ours) view which basically suggests we don't learn much at all about Judgement Day from the gospels - and the partial Boltian view as described in the sermon below.

Basically, "These things" = temple destroyed in AD70, being local, avoidable, predictable events, and "That day" being the future Judgement Day which is universal, unavoidable and unpredictable.

Start at 22:00 minutes in and then the talk.

Then there's a follow up talk below on the second half of Matthew 24. The parable of the days of Noah proves that we cannot know - the people were all marrying and partying like the Noah thing was a mystery. The whole point of quoting Noah is how utterly unknowable Jesus' return really is.

Matthew 24

“But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41 Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.

Indeed, Jesus here makes the whole futurist reading of Revelation laughable. Because if ANY of the things in Revelation were to happen as interpreted by 'literal futurists' then we'd know, for sure, that there was a 7 year timetable, here we go! But this directly contradicts Jesus own words here. Jesus says life will be so normal no one will suspect a thing. They'll be making long term plans like marrying and partying all like nothing's wrong!

The thief doesn't know, the bad servant doesn't know, and the young women with their bridal welcoming lamps don't know. Indeed, the whole point of the parable of the 10 young women is that only those who plan for Jesus to delay a long time are doing the right thing!

The thing I love about Sydney Anglican Amillennialism is that it is incredibly practical and just rings absolutely true of what Jesus is saying here. We cannot know when Jesus will return. It may indeed feel long delayed. So what are we to do? Stay true to the gospel, serve God well, and remain ready throughout your life. It's practical, gospel focussed, and deeply soul-searching - not all this end-times tables guessing nonsense.
Starts at 21 minutes in.

Just finished listening to the first message. You’ve got a nice church. I liked the preacher too, but basically he presented the Preterist variety of Amillenialism. I didn’t agree. There is something Preterists need to get their heads around when it comes to the Olivet discourse. Some prophecy is telescoped through a ‘near’ fulfilment on to ‘far’ fulfilment. Both satisfy the prophecy but the first is precursor to the ultimate fulfilment.

I’ll go with C S Lewis. By the time we get halfway through the Olivet, we are in apocalyptic stuff - big time. That’s my view.

keras · Oct 31, 2021

eclipsenow said:
So tell me, is this CME the real deal fire from God we read about in the Sixth Seal - or just a rather bad sunburn for those that get caught out in it? Like, HOW are there enough enemies left over to even form a "One World Government" to fall prey to the AntiChrist?

After this forthcoming CMA explosion, the sun will be darkened by being obscured by the approaching mass and the moon will shine bright red from the reflection of the sun being seven times brighter.
24 hours after the explosion, the main mass will strike the earth, directly onto the Middle East, Zephaniah 2:4, wiping out the entire population, excepting a small remnant in Jerusalem. Isaiah 29:4, Jeremiah 10:18, Psalms 97:3-5, Zephaniah 1:14-18;+ [God's perfect solution to the ME crisis]
But as the earth is rotating and moving at 66,000mph on its orbital track, it quickly moves away and the rest of the world won't be so badly affected. The survivor's will form a One World Government, but we Christians will gather and live in all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-31, Psalms 107, Isaiah 35:1-10

klutedavid · Oct 31, 2021

Acts29 said:
To me, prophecy is not akin to fortune-telling. Prophecy has one purpose, the revelation of Jesus Christ.

I presume you are referring to Daniel 8 being about Antiochus Epiphanes? If so, the angel tells Daniel the vision is about "the end of God's wrath" and "the time of the end," verse 19. The second century BC wasn't the time of the end. Further Daniel 12:9 also says the vision is about "the time of the end." Lastly, one has to clip out quite a bit of Matthew 24 in order to make it fit 70 AD. These are the reasons people interpret them as future events, because they believe God meant what He said.

Matthew compressed the destruction of the temple in with the return of Jesus. Where as Luke's gospel in chapter 21, separates the destruction of the temple from the age of the Gentiles. We are currently in that age of the Gentiles, theocratic Israel will never be seen again.

So I would disagree with your post.

eclipsenow · Oct 31, 2021

keras said:
After this forthcoming CMA explosion, the sun will be darkened by being obscured by the approaching mass and the moon will shine bright red from the reflection of the sun being seven times brighter.
24 hours after the explosion, the main mass will strike the earth, directly onto the Middle East, Zephaniah 2:4, wiping out the entire population, excepting a small remnant in Jerusalem. Isaiah 29:4, Jeremiah 10:18, Psalms 97:3-5, Zephaniah 1:14-18;+ [God's perfect solution to the ME crisis]
But as the earth is rotating and moving at 66,000mph on its orbital track, it quickly moves away and the rest of the world won't be so badly affected. The survivor's will form a One World Government, but we Christians will gather and live in all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 34:11-31, Psalms 107, Isaiah 35:1-10

So the Middle East gets burned pretty much like a bad Crusade of raping and pillaging and torching and salting - and the rest of the world goes on almost as normal. This is your 'Great Day of the Lord'? For a guy who wants to read the OT 'literally' you sure take liberties! Also, Revelation 6 has the whole human race gazing on the Son of God - NOT a silly solar storm. Revelation 6 is the END OF THIS WORLD and you reduce it to a nuking of the Middle East? That's just sad mate - I expected something a bit more spectacular for all your insistence that the CME was the "literal" Day of the Lord from the OT prophets! It's a nerfed, impotent, sad little thing. WE could do it if we full on launched every nuke we have at the Middle East.

You've nerfed the CME to something rather unspectacular, really. And you want 1/4 of OT prophecies to be about something the human race could hypothetically do ourselves?

You've completely contradicted all your work and undone your own interpretation of the bible.

Also, where's your 'literal' reading of Revelation 6?
You're doing EXACTLY what you accuse me of.

It literally says: every mountain and island was removed from its place.

This is world-ending language, every mountain and island being removed from its place.
But you reduce it to a mere super-nuking of the Middle East?

Also: how does a CME look like the very face of God? Come on - literalist - tell me where this fits into your nerfed, sad little CME? “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, 17 for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?”

Ancient of Days.
Lamb.
Face.

Yet you want to turn THEM into a mere localised nuke-fest?

keras · Oct 31, 2021

eclipsenow said:
So the Middle East gets burned pretty much like a bad Crusade of raping and pillaging and torching and salting - and the rest of the world goes on almost as normal. This is your 'Great Day of the Lord'?

Please cease jumping to wrong conclusions. Your desperate attempts to denigrate the Prophets, rebounds onto you.
Everyone can read Revelation 6:12-17.
The Sixth Seal will be a worldwide disaster, it will change most everything and set the scene for a One World Govt, as prophesied. The Middle East region; all of the holy Land will be virtually depopulated, as many prophesies make clear. Deuteronomy 32:34-43

Douggg · Oct 31, 2021

keras said:
The Sixth Seal will be a worldwide disaster, it will change most everything and set the scene for a One World Govt, as prophesied. The Middle East region; all of the holy Land will be virtually depopulated, as many prophesies make clear. Deuteronomy 32:34-43

The reason the sixth seal event is not a CME is because the sun is one of millions of stars and does not affect the other stars, the closest of which is light years away.

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

The stars will appear to fall to the earth, but will simply be disappearing on the horizon, as the cosmos is rolled away as a scroll.

The cosmos, the second heaven, is going to be removed and the world is going to see Jesus before the throne of God sickle in hand (Revelation 14:14).

The reaction of the evil men of this world (not just them in the middle east) will be that they are terrified at the appearance of Jesus in heaven (the third heaven).

The sixth seal event is at the end of the 7 years, and Jesus's appearance is the sign of the Son of Man in heaven in Matthew 24:29-30.

Douggg · Oct 31, 2021

eclipsenow said:
Also: how does a CME look like the very face of God? Come on - literalist - tell me where this fits into your nerfed, sad little CME? “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, 17 for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?”

The sixth seal is not a CME, but it is not the end of the world either.

Sixth seal is on a magnitude that there is no scientific explanation for it.

The second heaven, the cosmos will be taken away, rolled up like a scroll, the stars disappearing on the horzion.

The world will see Jesus in the third heaven, before the throne of God, sickle in hand (Revelation 14:14). Prepared to take vengence on behalf of the martyred great tribulation saints.

Jesus's appearance with sickle in hand, his intentions clear to them upon the earth who have done evil. They will be terrified.

It will take the beast, the false prophet, and the dragon (Satan) to convince them to make war on Jesus to stop Him from descending down to earth and executing judgement of them.

So they assemble their armies at Armageddon, and devise a plan of taking half the city of Jerusalem as hostages, Zechariah 14, to stop Jesus.

It does not work because Jesus when he stands on the Mt of Olives creates a valley which them held as hostages escape through unharmed.

Followed by the thousand year millennium rule of Jesus on this earth with a rod of iron over the nations. God's one thousand year Sabbath day of rest, as the nations will learn war no more during that time.

Douggg · Oct 31, 2021

Christian Gedge said:
Some prophecy is telescoped through a ‘near’ fulfilment on to ‘far’ fulfilment.

Christian Gedge · Oct 31, 2021

Near > Medium far > Further far

is not quite what I had in mind Doug.

Douggg · Oct 31, 2021

Christian Gedge said:
Near > Medium far > Further far

is not quite what I had in mind Doug.

The splitting of the Mt of Olives in Zechariah 14 does not mean a split between Amils over the Mt of Olives discourse... believe it or not.

Most OT prophetic passages futurists *think* are about the End Times, aren't

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anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Scripture is God's word, Science is God's works

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Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Well-Known Member

Scripture is God's word, Science is God's works

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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Most OT prophetic passages futurists think are about the End Times, aren't