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Featured Missing the Point

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by dreadnought, Jul 16, 2017.

  1. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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    From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." Matt 4:17 RSV

    I think most people miss the point of what Jesus is saying here. I believe he’s telling us that heaven comes to us the moment we repent of our sin.
     
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  2. RC1970

    RC1970 post tenebras lux

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    Actually, heaven's coming to you is the reason you repent.
     
  3. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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    Would any of us repent without a little prodding from the Lord?
     
  4. RC1970

    RC1970 post tenebras lux

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    More than a little prodding, I'm afraid. You need to be born again.
     
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  5. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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    If we repent of our sin, I think the Lord will be happy.
     
  6. Soyeong

    Soyeong Well-Known Member

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    The Mosaic Law was given to reveal sin (Romans 3:20), without we wouldn't even know what sin is (Romans 7:7), and sin is defined as Lawlessness (1 John 3:4), so the Mosaic Law is how the people who heard the Good News knew what they should be repenting of doing and it is instructions for how a citizen of God's Kingdom ought to live. Christianity is as much about getting us into heaven as it is about getting heaven into us.

    Mark 12:34 And when Jesus saw that he answered wisely, he said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” And after that no one dared to ask him any more questions.

    I think this verse makes it clear that saying the Kingdom is near is not speaking chronologically, but in relation to distance. It could also be understood as saying that the King is here at the door and knocking.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
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  7. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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    Well, we have to define what is required of us. I don't think we are required to produce two doves during the third new moon of the third and ninth months of the year, but the Lord did give us some commandments that he expected us to obey: Dot not murder, do not commit adultery, etc.
     
  8. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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  9. JESUS=G.O.A.T

    JESUS=G.O.A.T Well-Known Member

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    You're actually not that far off in your analysis, this verse is saying that a person enters the spiritual kingdom on Earth once they repent, baptized, and receive the Holy Spirit. Not heaven though
     
  10. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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    Well, if you take the Lord's statement, that the kingdom of heaven is at hand, at face value ...
     
  11. JESUS=G.O.A.T

    JESUS=G.O.A.T Well-Known Member

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    You can't though why would Earth be Heaven he's more then likely referencing the kingdom he promised we can walk in on Earth not heaven itself. It's like walking in heaven as the scripture points out but it's not the streats of gold or place of no pain literally.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
  12. dreadnought

    dreadnought Junior Member Supporter

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    I believe heaven is what our lives turn in to when we repent of our sin, and yes, life is eternal.
     
  13. JESUS=G.O.A.T

    JESUS=G.O.A.T Well-Known Member

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    I see then we will just have to beg to disagree then. I believe in a new heaven and new earth personally but that's me. I believe now upon repentance, baptism, Holy Ghost reception we simply enter a spiritual kingdom on Earth that Jesus has set for us. But yeah tons of different views on this verse when you think about it and what it implies
     
  14. JESUS=G.O.A.T

    JESUS=G.O.A.T Well-Known Member

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    In the end we both agree you enter some kingdom though after salvation.
     
  15. friend of

    friend of Well-Known Member

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    on earth as it is in heaven

    don't mind me, trying out new signature to see if it's obnoxious or not lol
     
  16. ChristianFromKazakhstan

    ChristianFromKazakhstan Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Jesus said, the kingdom of God is within you.
     
  17. Haipule

    Haipule Active Member

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    Notice the 'how to' of "repent" is missing. If you think that that means to "repent sins": then how come the word "sin" is not stated?

    Jesus Himself heralded those words everywhere He went. So, do you think He would make some broad assumptions that everyone who heard Him would know what He meant without qualification?

    The truth is, EVERYONE knew what He meant! It is a simple verb in the Greek: metanoeO in its 2nd person, perfect active imperative form which is metanoeite. That is the form here in Matthew 4:17

    Perfect tense: He has been doing it(heralding) in the past and continued to do it. Active voice: He is doing it. The imperative mood means: He commanded the action. The 2nd person: He said this to you-all or, everyone.

    The prefixed preposition meta means: with as in, loose association. The verb noeO, means:
    to perceive with the mind; to understand; to think upon; to heed; to ponder; to consider.

    I have no idea where the words 'repent', 'penance', 'penitent' came from! But, they are stupid! And meta should never be translated by the Latin prefix trans or the English prefix meta. Jesus commanded: Be!-you-all-with-minding/like minded. In Modern English: Get it together people!

    The above statement does not have to be qualified. Everybody understood what He said. They just needed to know about "what". Jesus said. "For she-has-been-drawing near/approaching/coming, thee dominion(feminine) of-thee skies(masculine plural--up, authoritative positions)

    Not knowing this, we argue mans invention of "repent"! Instead of the Word of the Day: Thee dominion(kingdom) of-thee skies(heavens). Jesus talks about the kingdom(rulership, dominion) of God/sky/skies ALOT! Jesus commanded that we get together, and get it together, concerning an oft stated command and oft stated principle.
     
  18. Purity Clarity Parkes

    Purity Clarity Parkes New Member

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    I do not remember any part of scripture where Jesus proclaimed that Heaven is within a person. I do know that 1 Corinthians 3:16 says:
    New International Version
    Don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's Spirit dwells in your midst?

    New Living Translation
    Don't you realize that all of you together are the temple of God and that the Spirit of God lives in you?

    English Standard Version
    Do you not know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in you?

    Berean Study Bible
    Do you not know that you yourselves are God's temple, and that God's Spirit dwells in you?

    Berean Literal Bible
    Do you not know that you yourselves are God's temple, and the Spirit of God dwells in you?

    New American Standard Bible
    Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?

    King James Bible
    Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
    However, I have not found any verses stating plainly declaring the Kingdom of Heaven to be within one's soul.
     
  19. tturt

    tturt Senior Veteran

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    Includes The Kingdom of God/heaven has come (Matt 12:28), is come (Luk 11:2), and will come (I Cor 15:24).
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017
  20. alhaynes86

    alhaynes86 Member

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    Matthew 22:36-40
    "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?"
    Jesus replied: "'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.'
    This is the first and greatest commandment.
    And the second is like it: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'
    All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments."

    thats what we have to do.....
     
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