Messianic Newbie Introduction

[Amandine]

Hello all! I've been on Christian Forums for a few months now, but I haven't really posted in the Messianic Judaism section. Since this summer I've been using the wonderful resources around my university to find my "faith expression"* Long story follows.
*for lack of a better term

Being raised Protestant and being exposed to many "denominations", I was always trying to poke holes in things I found unbiblical. Although I had mulled on the thought of following Jewish tradition in the past, I never really followed through on doing research. Finally I was totally entranced by discovering the Eastern Orthodox Church. It was biblical and traditional (in a good, historical faithful sense of the term), it gave reasoning for the doctrines my church had believed, and it gave ample oppurtunities for religious study, meditation, and most importantly practice. However, I never quite felt right (THIS IS NOT SAYING IT IS BAD OR WITHOUT MERIT-I RESPECT THEIR STRICT ADHERENCE TO THE FAITH). I don't know why. I even researched Roman Catholicism, which had ample devotions (AGAIN, I DO NOT THINK IT EVIL AND AM GLAD I GOT RID OF THE BIASES AND MISCONCEPTIONS ABOUT IT THAT MANY PEOPLE HAVE). However, I still wasn't "convinced". I felt bad b/c I never "got it". I became so overwhelmed that I didn't do my prayers or fast. I still feel bad. I wish I could live the pious life that many believers have found they can live, with lots of encouragement and a large support base. However, further research about Messianic beliefs and Ancient Jewish perspectives on scripture tainted my thoughts, so to speak.
No longer could I observe communion and the concept of theosis without thinking of omophagia-(ancient Greek practice of the Dionysus Cult where they drank wine as the Blood of God and ate flesh as the Body of God in order to become more Godlike). There might be nothing wrong with these doctrines of the church. But I am having a hard time dealing with them now, and honestly don't think I could join either the EOC or RC and say I believed them whole heartedly

So, display my hopes and fears unto you, so that maybe you can help me and my questions with advice, prayer, testimony, and love. In a moment I will post my current take on my tattered belief system
-Catherine

 

[Amandine]

My Handy Dandy ever being redefined PERSONAL Belief Guide & Question List:
common term used to describe my faith and subsequent lifestyle: Messianic Gentile (non-Jewish believer in Yeshua as the Messiah, that gains much from Biblical Jewish perspective and tradition)
Worship: Synagogue to be supplemented with Messianic bible studies, fellowship and discussion (?)
Holidays: Jewish Holidays, American National Holidays, Birthday
Hebrew names & terms: good to know, but not sacred for my salvation
Trinity: yes?-concerns: heavily debated, but some say still acceptable view of God; personally think it is an ok concept, but overly expounded and more of man than scripture
Communion: no?-concerns: omophagia influence in the doctrine
Mitzvot (Laws): as a Gentile, should not convert to Judaism & not tied to the Laws except for the 4 mentioned in..er..Corinithians something? . If personal wish is to observe a law to the glory of God, and as encouragement for a faithful sinless
life, it is acceptable./?
Doctrine/Dogma/Apostolic Tradition: I'm curious what happened in the small gap between Jesus's death and the comments of the later "early Church
fathers" and how everything is interpreted in current society.
Sola Scriptura vs Scripture & Sacred Tradition: I think Tradition is important in helping to understand scripture. However, I think it is Jewish tradition that is as important or moreso than tradition established a few decades after the Resurrection.

Please, feel free to correct me!!! I'm rather new to these concepts and just want live my life in a way that is acceptable to God.
-Catherine

 

[simchat_torah]

Hahaha... I had the wonderful opportunity to meet Christine last week. Funny thing, we ended up living in the same town, and my wife, her and I all went for coffee and had a blast.

Anyway...

as a Gentile, should not convert to Judaism & not tied to the Laws except for the 4 mentioned in..er..Corinithians something?

I think you may be referring to Acts 15.



Beyond that, I think you are at a wonderful starting point, and I encourage you to continue seeking out all that HaShem has for you.

Shalom and welcome to the Messianic section!
-Yafet.

p.s. And don't tell everyone the 'real truth' about how mean and ugly I am in real life... jk.

 

[simchat_torah]

p.s. your open-ness is refreshing.

 

[koilias]

Right on ya Catherine!

You're part of a growing trend amidst us gentiles...Embrace the Jewish roots but don't forget: Yeshua is what it's all about! Some gentiles turn Jewish Roots into their personal idol.

I too have a problem with the gentile doctrines regarding Communion. The bread to me represents the Life and Teaching of Yeshua. Still, it's deeper to me than a mere symbol, since I reminds me conform my life to His. Heavenly bread, "manna--what is it?", (John 6) represents the revelation of Torah. "True manna" is knowledge and practice of Torah (don't just "hear", "hear and do"). Yes, we gentiles need to practice the good deeds of Torah, Hesed v'emet too! But as Yeshua taught them (He is our Hacham, the father of our oral Torah). It is Yeshua's teachings that I am meant to digest, and that are meant to live in my heart, and be represented outwardly in my actions. That's the true "transubstantiation". That's how the Kingdom of God advances!!!

Always digest Yeshua's teachings!

Blessings...

 

[SonWorshipper]

Welcome Catherine!

May I ask you a question to clarify what you are asking?

Mitzvot (Laws): as a Gentile, should not convert to Judaism & not tied to the Laws except for the 4 mentioned in..er..Corinithians something? . If personal wish is to observe a law to the glory of God, and as encouragement for a faithful sinless life, it is acceptable./?

I do not believe "conversion" is necessary at all, for in fact it very well might involve denying Yeshua. but as far as being tied to the Law, we are not tied, but do follow those of the Torah, both in the Tenach and the Brit Chadasha ( Yeshua's laws). The four mentioned in Acts 15 were a starting place as they were everyday things that needed to be addressed, the rest the council left to them learning in the synagogue where Moses was taugh every Shabbat.

As well it is a beginning point for you and HaShem will lead you along as it is apparent from your writings that He has been calling you and leading you onto this path of discovery. He will not leave you to fend for yourself, you just need to continue as you are, in submission to his will and calling.

I am not sure if this is what you are asking is acceptable or not, but walking in HaShems way are always acceptable.

Again Welcome!

 

[Amandine]

Sorry about those confusing question/comment things. My "profile" was from a freeflow text file I made to somewhat put my thoughts together.
I guess what I'm saying about following the Torah is, how much Jewish custom is good for a Gentile to folllow and how much is not? I.e., the bible says Gentiles should not be circumsised (something my boyfriend was concerned with )
I guess right now my main focus is to avoid practices I no longer think of as biblical or that are derived from paganism. As for the rest, I'm really curious about the varied opinions people have on this board.

 

[SonWorshipper]

Well you are right, you definately shouldn't be circumcised!

But , seriously, the circumcision ( if one is not "of the circumsion") is in the heart, where it counts. But we do not believe that the laws were "nailed to the tree" but rather the "sentance" for breaking them, as we all do , one time or another.Many of the mitzot you are probably already following , being lead by your heart and you don't even know it. Such as, are you kind to animals? Yes? Then you are following more than one mitzvah! When you see that someone needs help, do you help them or walk away careing only for yourself? You help them? Great! you are following mitzot!

The ones mainly contented by the church by either, "doing away with all things Jewish" or misinterpretation of scripture are ( just giving the biggies)

The correct Sabbath and its meaning
What things are clean and food to eat
What Holy Days to celebrate
The meaning of the Last Passover our L-rd celebrated on earth.

So if you have any questions that you don't see answered in our other threads, ask away ( we do have a frequently asked questions thread at the top of the forum as well as a not so up-to-date thread on what threads we have, catagorized but subject.

And you will see that we do all have differeing opinions, not because we can't be unified but because we are all learning to walk on the right path and walk in the Spirit of He who has called us.

Shalom!

 

[iitb]

we do have a frequently asked questions thread at the top of the forum

Well, we do have an FAQ, it just doesn't have any answers yet. I am working on it, and should be posting at least a partially answered one sometime in the next week or two.

 

[simchat_torah]

It would kinda be hard for Catherine to be circumsised....
considering she's a girl and all
lol

 

[Amandine]

Hey now! I was using it as an EXAMPLE


-Catherine

 

[simchat_torah]

yeah, you acutally said it about your 'boyfriend'... heheh, but I was just making a joke since others took it the wrong way.

 

[SonWorshipper]

It would kinda be hard for Catherine to be circumsised....
considering she's a girl and all
lol

heheh, but I was just making a joke since others took it the wrong way.

Um, I was making the joke Yafet, because with a name like Catherine how else could I not be ( which is a name dear to my heart BTW )

Well you are right, you definately shouldn't be circumcised!

But , seriously

Notice the winky dude?

 

[simchat_torah]

Hey Cathrine,

I put up a new site since we talked last...
http://earth.prohosting.com/jdillman/hashem.html

It's just for kicks.

oh, and I updated my resume website (you can find it on my profile)... your boyfriend might wanna do something like that and attach it to his resume.

peace, shalom, and all that good stuff.
-Yafet.

 

[simchat_torah]

sw, I knew you were joking and I had to rib in too...

muwhahahahahah

Then again, if she were a muslim she might consider circumcision.
Eh, then again, she might just chalk that up as another reason why not to convert to Islam.

 

[SonWorshipper]

Yikes! I don't think any of the woman get to "consider" that, Go wash you mouth out with soup! ( Matzah ball will be fine, just don't enjoy it too much)

 

[simchat_torah]

*below is mature*

It's a part of islamic tradition, that before a woman becomes married she must be circumcised. The idea is that she can not enjoy sex, it is purely for reproduction purposes.

I firmly believe that HaShem designed our bodies to enjoy sexual intercourse so that it would draw us closer as spouses. How beautiful is it that G-d designed us this way?

Shalom,
yafet

 

[SonWorshipper]

Yes, that is why I said that the woman doesn't get to consider it. But yet, kill a bunch of heretics and your reward ( if a man) is unbelievable sex. Yes, that definatly isn't from our Creator at all.

 

[SonWorshipper]

Yes, I am so happy that the L-rd blessed me by showing me the truth, and the wonderful being that he created me to be. HaSatan looks to tear apart and pervert the creation in any manner he can, I think that is one of the many reasons for the attitude of proper Shabbat observance, it denys creation. I made that part of my sharing when I read from the Torah this past Shabbat, I posted was I shared in that thread if anyone is interested. I was Kallat Bereishit , the Bride of Genesis, how cool is that?

 

[Shamash Of Yeshua]

Welcome to CF and the Messianic Judaism section.

May the peace that transcends all understanding be with you,

Tag