Me, Jesus & My Bible

[jimmyjimmy]

In my limited time posting here, I have seen a growing trend, for lack of a better term, Cowboy Christianity. These are its features:

• Anti-intellectualism. No need for study, teachers, books, etc., "I have the Spirit"
• Anti-church. No need to gather with other believers for worship and edification.
• Anti-authority. No regard for the authority of elders as spiritual leaders
• Anti-organization. A disregard and mistrust of the organized church.

The NT allows for none of the above, yet these ideas seem common and are growing in popularity. Does anyone else see this trend?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

In my limited time posting here, I have seen a growing trend, for lack of a better term, I call it Cowboy Christianity. These are its features:

• Anti-intellectualism. No need for study, teachers, books, etc., "we have the Spirit"
• Anti-church. No need to gather with other believers for worship and edification.
• Anti-authority. No regard for the authority of elders as spiritual leaders
• Anti-organization. A disregard for the organizational structure of church

The NT allows for none of the above, yet these ideas seem common and are growing in popularity. Does anyone else see this trend?

I agree with your first two points...

As far as anti authority, we are not subject to man when in contradiction to scripture. Those that reject the teaching of the church fathers, are rejecting their claims of doctrine.
Remember the model set forth... that Christ is our head and husbands are to be subject unto Christ and He is to His Father... I know we are told to obey state authority as long as it doesn't violate God's requirements. These teachings that men are rejecting is because they see them as "being preached another gospel".

Your last point is related to the third...

 

[Extraneous]

What you have described is true i suppose, but not always the case. Some people get tired of the division, and the fallible teachers who don't try to end it, and so they put their faith in the Lords promise that he will teach us himself, and then they reject the messy theological stumbling block known as theology. Its not about pride or rebellion, its more about wisdom, in my opinion. This type of person doesn't reject scripture however, they embrace it. They don't necessarily reject the opinions of others either, but they do reject teachers. They feel they can learn from their brothers and sisters but they don't follow any one person at any one time.


Mathew 23:8 But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi’; for One is your Teacher, the Christ, and you are all brethren. 9 Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven. 10 And do not be called teachers; for One is your Teacher, the Christ. 11 But he who is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 And whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.


1 John 2:27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you will[a] abide in Him.


John 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. 24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father’s who sent Me.

25 “These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. 27 Peace I leave with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

 

[Wgw]

In my limited time posting here, I have seen a growing trend, for lack of a better term, I call it Cowboy Christianity. These are its features:

• Anti-intellectualism. No need for study, teachers, books, etc., "we have the Spirit"
• Anti-church. No need to gather with other believers for worship and edification.
• Anti-authority. No regard for the authority of elders as spiritual leaders
• Anti-organization. A disregard for the organizational structure of church

The NT allows for none of the above, yet these ideas seem common and are growing in popularity. Does anyone else see this trend?

You are quite right to raise this issue, and I salute it for you. Indeed, this post is quite literally brilliant.

What you describe is a truly lamentable trend; what is worse, many of these chaps are rather belligerent.

 

[Wgw]

I agree with your first two points...

As far as anti authority, we are not subject to man when in contradiction to scripture. Those that reject the teaching of the church fathers, are rejecting their claims of doctrine.
Remember the model set forth... that Christ is our head and husbands are to be subject unto Christ and He is to His Father... I know we are told to obey state authority as long as it doesn't violate God's requirements. These teachings that men are rejecting is because they see them as "being preached another gospel".

Your last point is related to the third...

I agree. This is why I reject Arius, Macedonius, Eusebius of Caesarea, Montanus, and other disagreeable Patristic figures...because their views are contrary to Scripture, contrary to the Apostolic Faith.

 

[Extraneous]

Just something that occurred to me a moment ago. Its just a thought. The Lord called teachers....however they may not be standing behind the pulpit but instead are sitting in the back of the Church, so to speak. Just a thought.

Mathew 23:8 But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi’; for One is your Teacher, the Christ, and you are all brethren. 9 Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven. 10 And do not be called teachers; for One is your Teacher, the Christ. 11 But he who is greatest among you shall be your servant. 12 And whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.

 

[Extraneous]

1 peter 5:3

 

[Rick Otto]

In my limited time posting here, I have seen a growing trend, for lack of a better term, I call it Cowboy Christianity. These are its features:

• Anti-intellectualism. No need for study, teachers, books, etc., "we have the Spirit"
• Anti-church. No need to gather with other believers for worship and edification.
• Anti-authority. No regard for the authority of elders as spiritual leaders
• Anti-organization. A disregard for the organizational structure of church

The NT allows for none of the above, yet these ideas seem common and are growing in popularity. Does anyone else see this trend?

Yeah, I see it and I see the causes of it that come from:
Too much intellectualism vs personal relationship with God.
Too much group loyalty and group identity vs loyalty to God and identifying with Him.
Too much respect for institutional authority and rules vs respect for the authority of truth
I think the organization thing is just a part of the authority thing, and it is just another example of elevating rules above the principals from which they are derived - letting the letter of the law kill the spirit of the law.

 

[Albion]

The NT allows for none of the above, yet these ideas seem common and are growing in popularity. Does anyone else see this trend?

I hadn't thought about it exactly, but I have felt that there has been a trend towards less conventional religious attitudes, so you could be correct in what you wrote. Many of the best thinkers have been 'hounded away' from CF in the past several years, so this is what's taken their place.

 

[Wordkeeper]

I agree. This is why I reject Arius, Macedonius, Eusebius of Caesarea, Montanus, and other disagreeable Patristic figures...because their views are contrary to Scripture, contrary to the Apostolic Faith.

None of the issues were salvation issues.

Learning how we are saved, by grace , by God's approval and how to receive that approval, THESE are salvation issues.

 

[Commander Xenophon]

None of the issues were salvation issues.

Learning how we are saved, by grace , by God's approval and how to receive that approval, THESE are salvation issues.

If we reject the Trinity, which most of the guys listed by @Wgw did (Montanus didn't, but he thought he was the Holy Ghost), we worship a false god and have committed idolatry.

 

[Commander Xenophon]

I hadn't thought about it exactly, but I have felt that there has been a trend towards less conventional religious attitudes, so you could be correct in what you wrote. Many of the best thinkers have been 'hounded away' from CF in the past several years, so this is what's taken their place.

That's horrible.

 

[Commander Xenophon]

Yeah, I see it and I see the causes of it that come from:
Too much intellectualism vs personal relationship with God.
Too much group loyalty and group identity vs loyalty to God and identifying with Him.
Too much respect for institutional authority and rules vs respect for the authority of truth
I think the organization thing is just a part of the authority thing, and it is just another example of elevating rules above the principals from which they are derived - letting the letter of the law kill the spirit of the law.

The problem is the continual verbal abuse that intellectual members face from non-traditionalists in all of the Theology forums, even in Traditional Theology. Abuse from people who are driven mainly by a radical anti-Catholic, anti-ecclesial, anti-intellectual agenda, which makes them want to bully and intimidate traditional Christians, theologians, etc.

Some of the abuse comes from people who reject the CF.com statement of faith; who deny that Jesus Christ is God or reject the Creed or the Trinity.

A lot of intelligent members have been driven away by it.

 

[Extraneous]

The problem is the continual verbal abuse that intellectual members face from non-traditionalists in all of the Theology forums, even in Traditional Theology. Abuse from people who are driven mainly by a radical anti-Catholic, anti-ecclesial, anti-intellectual agenda, which makes them want to bully and intimidate traditional Christians, theologians, etc.

Some of the abuse comes from people who reject the CF.com statement of faith; who deny that Jesus Christ is God or reject the Creed or the Trinity.

A lot of intelligent members have been driven away by it.

A lot of people have been driven away by the radical traditionalists too. It goes both ways.

 

[Commander Xenophon]

A lot of people have been driven away by the radical traditionalists too. It goes both ways.

Maybe, and that's a good reason for wanting there to be a more peace and less inter-denominational bickering.

 

[Extraneous]

Maybe, and that's a good reason for wanting there to be a more peace and less inter-denominational bickering.

I dont see any hope for that. There are just too many beliefs that contradict each other.

 

[Albion]

A lot of people have been driven away by the radical traditionalists too. It goes both ways.

I doubt that, frankly. This is supposed to be a "Christian forum," after all, and does have a published statement of principles that is conventionally Christian. The reason that the bomb-throwing skeptics may seem to have disappeared after awhile I'd attribute more to them having had their fun and deciding to move on. The traditional Christians OTOH have often explained their reasoning upon departing.

 

[Extraneous]

I doubt that, frankly. This is supposed to be a "Christian forum,.

I guess those who are not RC, Anglican, EO or Lutheran are not considered Christians then.

 

[Albion]

I guess those who are not RC, Anglican, EO or Lutheran are not considered Christians then.

What are you talking about?

 

[Extraneous]

Exactly why i stay away