Matthew 16:19 Translation

[MattMMMan17]

"I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." Mt 16:19 DR

Okay, does anyone have the original Greek translation of this passage? Specifically, I'm looking for the translation pointing out the "you" being singular, not plural. I know I've read something on this before but for the life of me can't find it. Thanks for your help.

 

[thereselittleflower]

Hi Matt

The personal pronoun used here when Jesus says I will give to you the Keys of the Kingdom is "soi"


Strong's <B>

G4671

</B>​

&#963;&#959;&#953;&#769;

soi

soy

Dative case of G4771; to thee: - thee, thine own, thou, thy.

​

This is the SINGULAR pronoun:

This is the pattern of the first and second personal pronoun in the singular:

nom.e0gw& Isu& you acc.e0me/ *, memese/ you gen.e0mou~, mouof mesou~ of you dat.

e0moi/, moi

to me

soi/

to you
​

Here is a reference page this was taken from:

http://www.lamp.ac.uk/classics/mathos/pnoun.htm


Hope this is helpful to you!


Peace in Him!

 

[MattMMMan17]

Thank you VERY much!

 

[thereselittleflower]

Hi Matt,

And there is a little more that might be helpful.

the "thou shalt bind" "thou shalt loose" is in the singular in Matthe 16:19, but in the plural in Matthew 18:18.

The King James can be good for something and we see this reflected in the older King James version even in the English:



Look at this:

Mat 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.



Mat 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.


​

Notice that "thou" is used in Matt 16:19, but "ye" is used in 18:18 ?

This was an older English way of diferentiating between the singular 2nd person pronoun and the plural 2nd personal pronoun that is lost now in modern English . .


So, the translaters of the King James were conveying in English that in Matthew 16:19 Jesus said "you" in the singular regarding the Keys of the Kingdom as well as in the verbs for binding and loosing, by using "thou"; and they were conveying in Matthew 18:18 that the same verbs were now in the plural 2nd person by using "ye" . .



It is even in the very bible those who love to argue against the truth in these passges use themselves . .





Edited to add . . Matt, the distinctiveness found in the King James older English bible regarding the use of "thou" "ye" which is lost in the modern translations is explained more fully here:

http://www.bright.net/~bkrajcik/thoutheethineye.htm






Peace in Him!

 

[MattMMMan17]

Wahoo!! Thanks a lot I hadn't even thought about looking into the Olde English text.

 

[Rising_Suns]

Hi Matt

The personal pronoun used here when Jesus says I will give to you the Keys of the Kingdom is "soi"




Strong's <B>

G4671


</B>​

&#963;&#959;&#953;&#769;

soi

soy

Dative case of G4771; to thee: - thee, thine own, thou, thy.


​

This is the SINGULAR pronoun:

This is the pattern of the first and second personal pronoun in the singular:


nom.e0gw& Isu& you acc.e0me/ *, memese/ you gen.e0mou~, mouof mesou~ of you dat.

e0moi/, moi

to me

soi/

to you

​

Here is a reference page this was taken from:


http://www.lamp.ac.uk/classics/mathos/pnoun.htm


Hope this is helpful to you!


Peace in Him!

Therese,
where have you been? I was beginning to get worried that something happened to you. Glad to see you are back.

 

[Markh]

I am a bit behind. Why is it that the second should be "ye"- what is the basis for this? Surely there must be something in the Greek or whatever to have prompted this?

 

[MattMMMan17]

in Mt 16:18-19 Jesus was speaking only to Peter, as evidenced by His saying "THOU art Peter"

In Mt 18:18 He was addressing all of the apostles, and did not just singling out Peter.

 

[Markh]

doesn't the second ye cancel the first thou?

and so Making Peter less important as he is later over-ridden with a ye to all the group including him

 

[Rising_Suns]

doesn't the second ye cancel the first thou?

and so Making Peter less important as he is later over-ridden with a ye to all the group including him

No, the way it was written; picture Jesus taking Peter aside and speaking directly to him (thou), then picture Jesus turning to the rest of His disciples and addressing them (ye)...going from singular to plural. There is no cancellation; but rather, just a change of audience.

 

[Markh]

doesn't this line support the Orthodox Primus inter Pars opinion regarding the pope rather than the Catholic.

He is given the same abilities as the others, only first.

Surely for the Catholic papal establishment it would have been "Peter you have overall power to bind" and the others would get "you have power under Peter to bind"

i'm still Catholic just pushing an argument someone else might give

 

[MattMMMan17]

The fact that Peter was given the keys of authority just prior to that declaration is of utmost importance. When Jesus appointed Peter as His official over His house by designating him as the holder of the keys, he gave Peter and thereby his successors, ultimate authority to act in the name of the King. In essence, this is what says "Peter, you have the overall authority, in order to bind and loose in My name.