Masturbation

[Johnnz]

Far too simplistic my friend. Is eating, gardening, exercising, studying, playing a sport, sleeping or much of what makes up our daily lives therefore sinful because it is not ana ct of love directed towards someone else?

John
NZ

 

[Johnnz]

Far too simplistic my friend. Is eating, gardening, exercising, studying, playing a sport, sleeping or much of what makes up our daily lives therefore sinful because it is not ana ct of love directed towards someone else?

John
NZ

 

[Zebra1552]

I ignore red herrings.

The issue is whether or not masturbation is a sin. What exactly sin is and how you come by that definition is perfectly relevant to that issue. I'll ask again. What is sin, and where is that definition found?

 

[david_x]

The issue is whether or not masturbation is a sin. What exactly sin is and how you come by that definition is perfectly relevant to that issue. I'll ask again. What is sin, and where is that definition found?

I answered both. If you are having trouble finding the golden rule:
Matthew 7:12
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."

aka, love your neighbor as yourself.

Luke 10:25-28
"On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. "Teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
"What is written in the Law?" he replied. "How do you read it?"

He answered: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind; and, 'Love your neighbor as yourself.

"You have answered correctly," Jesus replied. "Do this and you will live.""

 

[Zebra1552]

I answered both. If you are having trouble finding the golden rule:
Matthew 7:12
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."

aka, love your neighbor as yourself.

Luke 10:25-28
"On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. "Teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
"What is written in the Law?" he replied. "How do you read it?"

He answered: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind; and, 'Love your neighbor as yourself.

"You have answered correctly," Jesus replied. "Do this and you will live.""

How does this define what sin is? This gives what we should be doing, and your definition of sin is incredibly vague.

 

[david_x]

How does this define what sin is? This gives what we should be doing, and your definition of sin is incredibly vague.

How so?

 

[Zebra1552]

How so?

What is 'not loving' can be interpreted many, many different ways. Homosexuals could consider it unloving to condemn homosexuality.

 

[david_x]

What is 'not loving' can be interpreted many, many different ways. Homosexuals could consider it unloving to condemn homosexuality.

Homosexuals would be wrong, it is unloving of family and friends and God to participate in homosexual activity.

 

[Zebra1552]

Homosexuals would be wrong, it is unloving of family and friends and God to participate in homosexual activity.

Great. But the argument could still be made, and it'd be a valid one.

 

[david_x]

Great. But the argument could still be made, and it'd be a valid one.

The argument could be made by someone who doesn't believe in God, not in this section though.

 

[Zebra1552]

Um... I could easily make that argument.

 

[david_x]

Um... I could easily make that argument.

How....would be a good way to answer that....

 

[Kencj]

You're really still avoiding answering the original question, which was simple enough; what is your basis for your claim that masturbation is a sin?

So far you've not said anything close to answering that question.

 

[Zebra1552]

How....would be a good way to answer that....

Um, no, not really. All I need to do is claim that it is unloving. Since you didn't define what is or is not loving. Also since I can make a legitimate claim that homosexual relationships INVOLVE love. So I'll ask again: what is sin, where do you find this definition, and how do you apply it?

 

[david_x]

Um, no, not really. All I need to do is claim that it is unloving. Since you didn't define what is or is not loving. Also since I can make a legitimate claim that homosexual relationships INVOLVE love. So I'll ask again: what is sin, where do you find this definition, and how do you apply it?

Love for who? Surly not love for God, which is the most important. Love God, love others.

 

[Kencj]

Thanks, David X, for being in the conversation and I don't want you to think I'm going after you in any way. But the question in this thread isn't whether or not homosexual sex is a sin, but whether or not masturbation is. Since you claim it is, you need to offer convincing scriptural proof that it is. It's not difficult to find the verse or two in the Torah that condemns homosexual sex, but where do you find anything about masturbation?

It's a legitimate concern, since making something out to be a sin that scripture doesn't make out to be a sin, is condemned very clearly by Christ.

 

[Zebra1552]

Love for who? Surly not love for God, which is the most important. Love God, love others.

That is vague and arbitrary. Are you saying that God has given us things that are vague and arbitrary to go by? If so, then how can masturbation possibly be considered sin?

 

[david_x]

That is vague and arbitrary. Are you saying that God has given us things that are vague and arbitrary to go by? If so, then how can masturbation possibly be considered sin?

How can you say that is vague or arbitrary? There is clearly no argument from you at all. If you can't justify it, i'm not going to walk circles around with you.

 

[Zebra1552]

How can you say that is vague or arbitrary? There is clearly no argument from you at all. If you can't justify it, i'm not going to walk circles around with you.

I already explained why your definition is vague and arbitrary. I've spent the last several posts explaining why. And now you say I don't have an argument? The best you come up with for explaining a hypothetical statement I could easily argue is an opinion. That's not an argument.

 

[david_x]

I already explained why your definition is vague and arbitrary. I've spent the last several posts explaining why. And now you say I don't have an argument? The best you come up with for explaining a hypothetical statement I could easily argue is an opinion. That's not an argument.

You're 'argument' was void. Love God, love others all the laws fall into one/both of these groups. Homosexuality was defined in the OT as wrong, that is one of the laws that this covers.