Masonic Eschatology

[O.F.F.]

Readers, please note, that masonicinfo.com is a site created by Masons to defend the heretical teachngs of Freemasonry and to spread lies about, and defame, those who oppose it. It is therefore, NOT an objective source of information. Instead, it is completely and totally biased. On the other hand, any Christian can use the objective Word of God (the Holy Bible) and compare what it teaches to what Freemasonry teaches and find that Masonic teachings are in fact heresy.

So Sabbathiel's use of this Masonic website is for malice purposes. Rather than debate the subject of the thread with creditible Grand Lodge data to try to refute the claims levied against his fraternity with dignity and respect, he thinks that character assasination will somehow eliminate the truth about Freemasonry. I guess since there is no Grand Lodge data to refute the charges against Masonic heresy, he feels he has no other choice.

If he insists that those who oppose Freemasonry are "anti-masons," which we are NOT, then as a defender of the false religion of the Masonic faith, he is effectively calling himself an "anti-Christian." He fails to realize that by his involvement in the Masonic Order, he in essence serves Satan, while having the audacity to call himself a Christian.

 

[Sabbathiel]

Readers, please note, that masonicinfo.com is a site created by Masons to defend the heretical teachngs of Freemasonry and to spread lies about, and defame, those who oppose it. It is therefore, NOT an objective source of information. Instead, it is completely and totally biased. On the other hand, any Christian can use the objective Word of God (the Holy Bible) and compare what it teaches to what Freemasonry teaches and find that Masonic teachings are in fact heresy.

So Sabbathiel's use of this Masonic website is for malice purposes. Rather than debate the subject of the thread with creditible Grand Lodge data to try to refute the claims levied against his fraternity with dignity and respect, he thinks that character assasination will somehow eliminate the truth about Freemasonry. I guess since there is no Grand Lodge data to refute the charges against Masonic heresy, he feels he has no other choice.

If he insists that those who oppose Freemasonry are "anti-masons," which we are NOT, then as a defender of the false religion of the Masonic faith, he is effectively calling himself an "anti-Christian." He fails to realize that by his involvement in the Masonic Order, he in essence serves Satan, while having the audacity to call himself a Christian.

You're not Anti-Mason?

Anti-Masonry (alternatively called Anti-Freemasonry) is defined as "Avowed opposition to Freemasonry".[1] However, there is no homogeneous anti-Masonic movement. Anti-Masonry consists of radically differing criticisms from sometimes incompatible groups who are hostile to Freemasonry in some form.

You obviously are...

"...he in essence serves Satan" Well if you call helping and supporting needy children and families along with volunteer work with American Red Across, visiting the sick and afflicted, caring for and supporting our veterans and riding along side those of the Patriot Guard Riders as Satanic, then I guess I'm guilty... Who knew following Christ would be considered "Satanic" in essence?

"spread lies about, and defame, those who oppose it" So Stephen Dafoe did not catch you stealing someone's identity and you did not write an apology admitting that you did? Somethings "Fishy", Gentry... And it's not coming from Ed King's side. All one needs to do is ask proof from Ed King about you and I'm sure Ed King will provide enough evidence to show your hidden agenda... It's not defaming and if you don't like the truth then why be crooked in the first place? If it's false, prove it...

And debate? Why? If someone can't accept the facts over opinionated views that are completely wrong, already been proven wrong time and time again, and proven lies and misconceptions based on statements taken out of context, then they are hopeless...no need to debate as it is a waste of time...And how can one debate when the other side just shuns any rebuttal and calls it "Malice" and ignores it?


Heresy? I've been in the Lodge for sometime and not seen or heard any heresy. Of course you can take things out of context, much like the Atheists do to Christianity to make it appear dangerous, and make it "Heretical." You've done a great job doing that...Why? You can make anything into a religion, but why would you when it is not a religion?


Malice? What's so malice about it? And why ignore and look over a range of posts that prove my point? Why not prove Ed King wrong? All the readers have to do is contact Ed King asking for proof about the stuff you posted, lies by a mischievous man and about you and I'm sure he'll be happy to provide it.

Why not read the other sides of an argument? Why should we listen to you? Because you claim that you are a "Christian", reborn, inspired by the spirit? Even the most wicked of man claim the same! To say "Don't listen to their side of story" is absurd and only asking people to follow you blindly. Why ignore Ed King's site? Because he has "Proof" of what you've done? Evidence of the real "Fishy" Gentry? It's typical of someone who has some hidden agenda that's been exposed to tell everyone to ignore the evidence...So why should we listen to a criminal claiming to be some "Christian"?

Why don't you answer my questions? Why ignore them? Why do you copy testimonies of men that are scam artists and tell others not to question it? Why are you so bound and determined to put so many patients out on the street by cutting their source of funding? Why do you call men who worship God, Jesus Christ, "Satanists" because they are within a "Fraternity" with others who might not be "Christians?" Why do you call a "Fraternity" a "Religion." Why Freemasons and not "Elks" or "Boy Scouts" or some Greek Frat at some College? They are similar in the sense that they are "Diverse."

Why don't you post essays like the one I posted on this thread taken from and based on a Masonic Monitor? The one about the Holy Sts. John? It came from a Freemason who is a preacher and it mentions the Worship of Jesus Christ? Why not that? Why only take things out of context, knowingly, to slander men and offend so many? Why put down the founding fathers of the USA? Teach children to "Rebel" against their own government, making them fear men who only stood for Brotherly Love and Charity and Equality among all men?

Why do you claim that Freemasonry does not allow the mention of Jesus Christ when I jost posted an essay from a Freemason and Preacher who mentions Jesus Christ and both Johns, teaching men to follow the instructions of the Apostles? Why do you say that Freemasons can't be Christian and they don't mention Christ in Prayer when we, at my Lodge and Lodges around my area, Pray in the name of Jesus Christ at every meeting? Why is the Lord's prayer in my monitor, established by the Grand Lodge of AL? Did not Christ teach the disciples to pray using that prayer? If so, then why do you claim that it is "Evil?"

Why do you claim that Freemasonry is incompatible with Christianity when I have a Bible sitting next to me with references to scripture in the Old and New Testament that backup the philosophies of Freemasonry? Are not men to follow the Holy Bible?

Did you know about that crime from that Anti-Mason that I posted on this thread? He listened to you and many other Anti-Mason conspiracy theorists? Did you apologize to the family who lost their loved one? After all, it was your words and that of many Anti-Mason and conspiracy theory crowds that set him off... Do you not feel any remorse for such actions? I'm not sure what sane person would go along with your "Ministry" that promotes fear and terror that lead to such atrocities? What do you say to the family for putting such drivel in that criminals mind that led him to such actions? Do you even care? Is there not even an ounce of humanity in you people? Who truly is following Satan, Gentry?

If anybody prefers facts, contact a Lodge. If you need proof about "Fishy" Gentry, I'm sure Ed King will be happy to provide it...You can contact him on his site that Gentry pleads you to ignore. He does keep copies and history of his research and investigations.

Otherwise stay Anti-American, paranoid, and continue to support such causes that have done more damage to society than good. Ignorance is truly bringing the world to its knees. If you don't believe me, then take a look at the article I posted earlier in this thread and think about the harm it has done. You can also check it out at Masonicinfo.com...

Anybody can find bad in anything, it's just suspicious that these people look pretty hard ignoring all of the good. If that's kind of person you want to be, that's your prerogative but don't expect many to be nice to you about provoking others to slandering us and many other good men, especially when it comes to you people planting fear in the minds of others that lead them off the deep and and thus hurting others. You people should be held reliable of such actions...

If Masonry is as bad as "O.F.F." states, then why are "Pagans" leaving the fraternity due to it being too "Christian?" Why don't "OFF" and their extremists show that side of the argument?

I have removed myself, I demitted my membership when the Grand Master of Missouri, MWB Stan Thompson violated his Masonic Oath and openly denounced Pagans as Freemasons in a tiled lodge as a part of his Official visit to his home lodge. I have refused to return to the Masonic Fraternity to date simply because when I did decide that I wanted to have my membership active to visit other states, I was targetted by Christians within the lodge because of my support of the Alternative religions pulled under the label of Paganism and a supporter of Esoteric Freemasonry and the Ancient Mysteries. I was not a supporter of the Christianization of Freemasonry, I was an outsider and I didn’t give them a chance to call me unwanted, I withdrew my request to rejoin.

http://antagonyst.org/home/?p=11

So which is it? Is it "Pagan" or "Christian" folks...can't be both! In fact "Grand Lodge Data" states that it is Niether! Even your favorite Masonic Author Albert Pike stated that!

Masonry is not a religion. He who makes of it a religious belief, falsifies and denaturalizes it.
-Albert Pike "Morals and Dogma" Page 161.

 

[Sabbathiel]

So if Freemasonry is so bad then why such good Freemason men?

In pursuit of his Christian duty, the Rev. Matthew Wissell used to dress up as a clown.

Pastor of Eastham United Methodist Church on Cape Cod and a Freemason, Wissell spent six years entertaining young burn victims at Shriners Hospital for Children in Boston. The Shriners are part of the Freemasons, the global fraternal organization founded in 18th-century England that spends millions of dollars on charitable works, motivated in part by its minimalist religious requirement that members profess faith in one God.
Wissell followed his grandfather's footsteps into the Freemasons 15 years ago.
"As a United Methodist, we understand that faith is more than simply adhering to a group of beliefs," he said. "It's living out our beliefs in the world in a very tangible way."
Celebrating their 275th anniversary this year, the 38,000-member Massachusetts Freemasons - down from more than 100,000 a generation ago - have run TV ads to attract new members and publicize a group that for centuries piqued the interest of conspiracy theorists obsessed with its supposedly nefarious secrets and religious heresies. The group's US membership peaked around 1960 but has been almost halved, to 2.5 million, since.
The first significant third party in American history cracked the Electoral College in 1832 on a platform devoted solely to exterminating Freemasonry: the Anti-Masonic Party. Evangelical clergy of the time condemned Freemasons as deists, or worse. Today, cabalistic notions about the group linger mainly in potboiler plots. "The Da Vinci Code" revels in references to the organization and its roots in medieval stonemason guilds. ("The secret knowledge of how to use a wedged keystone to build a vaulted archway was part of the wisdom that had made the Masons such wealthy craftsmen, and it was a secret they guarded carefully," novelist Dan Brown wrote in his blockbuster.)
And Freemasons squirreled away the titular stash in the movie "National Treasure," putting themselves atop a secret fortune.
"I can assure you that is not the case," said Roger W. Pageau grand master of Freemasons in Massachusetts, who said he'd probably be in Bermuda if it were. Which is not to deny the impressiveness of the Boston grand lodge. Masonic symbols in tile on the façade splash color onto Tremont Street, while inside, the monthly meeting room is replete with a wooden throne, upholstered side benches, and scalloped ceiling.
Yet behind the ornate appearance, one church sees a theological foe. Dick Cusick, the 61-year-old insurance coordinator for the grand lodge and a Catholic, said when the Vatican learned that he had been a Freemason for 23 years and he vowed to remain in the organization, he was excommunicated.
The Vatican considers the mandatory belief in nothing more than a supreme being to be a renunciation of such teachings as the Trinity and Jesus' divinity, The Pilot, the newspaper of the Archdiocese of Boston, reported last year. Pageau said, however, that the Freemasons don't require Catholic members, or those of any other faiths, to renounce any of their churches' teachings, and that the group counts many Catholics among its members.
But Cusick says he ran into trouble when the Society of St. Vincent de Paul, the Catholic charity for which he worked, learned of his Freemason affiliation and alerted Rome.
For a man engaged in Catholic social works, getting the boot stung.
"I fed the homeless," he said. "Every Wednesday, I did a prison ministry down in Bridgewater."
Belief in God and devotion to ritual aside, the group is fraternal, not theological, and its chapters, called lodges, tend to have distinct personalities, says Pageau. Harvard, for instance, hosts a lodge that is open to men with some connection to the university. It recently welcomed 25 new members, while the Freemasons statewide added 600 members last year. Pageau hopes these numbers signal a wave of renewed interest in the fraternity that included George Washington, Benjamin Franklin, and Paul Revere in its membership.
Wissell is far from the only minister in the Freemasons.
"My pastor today is a member," said Pageau, also a Methodist, "and his father was, and his father was." But "we are not a religion. Hopefully, we are not even a substitute for religion, although maybe in some cases we are."

 

[Sabbathiel]

Robert Emmett Bledsoe Baylor

He was born in Kentucky in 1793, nephew to Kentucky politician Jesse Bledsoe.

Baylor served in the military during the War of 1812. After the war he studied law in Kentucky. From 1819 to 1820, he was a member of the Kentucky House of Representatives. He resigned and moved to Alabama.

Baylor practiced law and studied Theology, learned to preach and was ordained to the Baptist Ministry.

In 1824 Baylor was elected to the Alabama House of Representatives. In 1829 he was elected a Jacksonian to the 21st Congress from Alabama's 2nd Congressional District.

In 1839 Baylor moved back to Texas where he founded Baylor University in 1845 and Baylor Female College. He was elected judge of the district and supreme courts of the Republic of Texas and was a member of the convention that framed the State Constitution of Texas.

Baylor also established a health care system that eventually became the Baylor network of hospitals.

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,Sans]Initiated : 1828
Grand Chaplain : 1843, 1846, 1847
Grand Lodge of Texas
Founding member : 1853
Baylor Lodge No. 125, Gay Hill [/FONT] [FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,Sans] Source : The Texas Mason, Pete Normand. College Station, Texas : Texas Lodge of Research, 1986. Photo : http://law.baylor.edu/History/Faculty/baylor.htm[/FONT]

Wilbur Patterson Thirkield

He was born in Franklin, Ohio September 25, 1854. The Thirkield family had been involved with the Methodist church and devoted to Methodism for a long time. James, Wilbur's grandfather, signed the original charter for a Methodist church in their hometown of Franklin. Wilbur's father taught Sunday school for years at the church.

Wibur attended Ohio Wesleyan University and the theology school of Boston University. He ultimately received his Doctor of Divinity from the latter school. For most of his career, Wibur Thirkield championed the cause of education for African Americans. From 1883 to 1900, he was the first president of the Gammon Theological Seminary. From 1900 until 1906 he was in Cincinnati, Ohio as the general secretary of the Freedman's Aid and Southern Education Society of the Methodist Episcopal Church.
Reverend Thirkield served as president of Howard University from 1906 until his election to bishop on June 1, 1912. During his tenure at Howard, he was friends with Booker T. Washington, the latter being a member of the board of trustees of the school. Mr. Washington was one of the reverend's strongest supporters on the board at the time. As Bishop Thirkield, Wilbur left Howard to take up duties with the Methodist Church.
​

If a Christian cannot be a Freemason, then why were there great Freemasons that were Christian? If Freemasonry is such a terrible sin, then wouldn't these educated devoted Christian men know that?

In other words, Freemasons throughout history have done great things that put them in the history books for future generations to see and learn. Many of these men just so happen to be Christian and were well educated. The key word here, and word of the day, is "Educated."

Educated men are not ignorant. They know what they do and they know the consequences of their actions. They also know how to think for themselves.

You can be a Christian and a Freemason... Just flip through the history books and read about the many great Christians who were Freemasons. Their credentials and education should be some indication that they can tell the difference between right and wrong.

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica,Sans][/FONT]

 

[Sabbathiel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajqhDcmQy5Q

 

[Sabbathiel]

For the hundreds of players and parents attending Fall River Youth Soccer games each week from now on, immediate access to a life-saving medical device that can jump start a person's heart should it stop beating will be an arm's reach away on the sidelines.
Thanks to a collaborative effort between two local orders of the Freemasons, and a former Miss Massachusetts, Fall River Youth Soccer was presented Saturday with the device, known as an Automatic External Defibrillator.
Joshua Hetzler, a Fall River resident and member of the King Philip Lodge A.F. & A.M., and former Miss Massachusetts Michaela Gagne paired up to benefit Fall River Youth Soccer, where Hetzler serves as a coach. Gagne was a star soccer player back in her days as a Durfee Hilltopper, but her senior year was cut short when she learned she had Long QT Syndrome, which can affect her heart rhythms. Today, she has an internal pacemaker implanted in her chest that can control her heart beat if needed, and she works to promote heart health as a national spokesperson for the American Heart Association.
"We're so very much appreciative of Michaela and Joshua and their efforts on our behalf," said Janet Belanger, fall director for Fall River Youth Soccer, during a pasta dinner fund-raiser hosted by the Freemasons' Lodge on Columbus Drive, a short distance from the Frank M. Silvia School fields where the league plays its games.

Gerard Forcier, a member of the soccer league's board, said he was astonished to learn from his wife, a registered nurse, just how much the device costs — about $1,000-$1,500 — and how that fact underscored how much generosity was involved among those giving of their time and effort to raise money to benefit the league was such a gift.
Forcier says some 700 players participate in the league each week, with most being accompanied by at least one or more family members.
"You're dealing with thousands," Forcier said. "You never know when an emergency will arise."
The money raised by the King Philip and Massasoit-Narragansett Lodges of the Freemasons, which includes generous donations by Hetzler Contracting (Joshua's father's company), Amaral's Central Market, Billy's Cafe (Gagne's sister's business), Reis Bakery, the American Heart Association and Michaela's parents, Ron and Denise Gagne, will also provide for medical training for league personnel.
"All willing coaches from Fall River Youth Soccer are going to get certifed in CPR and AED use," says Gagne, who is certified in the use if both life-saving techniques.

"For every minute without the use of an AED or CPR, for someone whose heart stops beating, there is a 10 percent less chance of survival," Gagne says.
"These devices need to be everywhere. We're trying to protect all the kids in the city."
Gagne and Hetzler are dating, and the two came up with the idea to raise money for the project after Joshua recently completed a Freemasons leadership group.
"We love to do things to help the community," Hetzler said.
Sheniqua Brown, a Fall River resident and advocacy specialist for the American Heart Association, says the SouthCoast has an especially high rate of cardiovascular disease.
"For the American Heart Association to have a presence between Fall River and New Bedford means a lot," says Brown, who notes just how seriously the Heart Association is working to raise awareness of the need to be prepared to help if someone's heart should suddenly stop.

"We're asking legislators to have AED and CPR training as a graduation requirement," Brown says.
Leon Cudworth and Charles Katsanos, masters respectively of the King Philip and Massasoit-Narragansett Lodges A.F. & A.M., which are both housed in the same headquarters, said they were more than willing to take on the challenge when fellow Freemason Hetzler approached them with his idea.
"Giving back to the community is what Masonry is all about," said Cudworth.
"The Masons are all about giving back," said Katsanos.
Leftovers from Saturday's fund-raiser were donated to a local soup kitchen downtown.

 

[Sabbathiel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfMY5xnbVjI

 

[Sabbathiel]

RiteCare
In the early 1950s in Colorado, the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry of the Southern Jurisdiction of the United States initiated a program to help children with speech and language disorders. The results obtained from this program led to the establishment of RiteCare clinics to provide diagnostic evaluation and treatment of speech and language disorders, as well as learning disabilities. Today, there are 170 RiteCare® clinics, centers, and special programs operating or planned for children and therapists located throughout the United States. Each facility is staffed by speech-language pathologists or other trained personnel. Through the support of Scottish Rite members, these clinics, centers, and programs continue to increase. The value of this philanthropy has long been apparent. Tens of thousands of youngsters across the United States have been helped significantly. With the good work of dedicated clinicians and parents, the Scottish Rite has achieved successes that could only be imagined a few years back. Children who might have remained educationally behind for a lifetime can now talk, read, and lead productive lives.
Program Eligibility

As a rule, the RiteCare® Clinics accept preschool children who have difficulty speaking or understanding the spoken word or school-age children who have difficulty learning to read. Some centers also offer literacy training for adults.
Inquiries on age groups and program offerings in specific areas should be addressed to the director of the local Scottish Rite facility. Equally important, all services are available regardless of race, creed, or the family's inability to pay.
While all children in need are eligible for available RiteCare® Program treatment, please consult with your local facility for specific financial information.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70UtmD3wKj4

 

[Sabbathiel]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D70HAVlpEKM

 

[Sabbathiel]

Members of the local Shriner’s chapter heard about Blake Boyington who was hurt in a car accident on September 27th and has been hospitalized ever since. The wreck left him severely disabled, but the family is hopeful that will soon change.

With one flight, the Boyington family believes Blake's recovery will take off. The 15-year-old was delicately placed on an Air Ambulance and flown to the Shriner’s Hospital in Chicago. There, he will begin intense spinal cord injury rehabilitation. Blake's mother, Theresa, said she is praying that this will be a life changing trip.

Blake was injured on his way to a fishing trip. He and a friend were headed down a damp road when the driver lost control, and the car struck a tree. Theresa said, "He was brought by life-flight, he had his arm pretty much severed and just about bled to death, now they're telling us he's paralyzed from his sternum down."

As his mother flipped through pictures of the crash, she couldn’t help but think of the pain her son has endured. Theresa added, "He has titanium in his right side, hip down, and his ankle is titanium and he completely severed just about all of the bones in his neck, so he has all titanium bones and screws in his neck."

Blake's already undergone six surgeries and may possibly need more. That's why folks with the Shriner’s Hospital stepped in and vowed to help his recovery.

Don Moore with the Abba Shriner’s of Mobile said, "The Shriner’s Hospitals are known worldwide as the premier orthopedic and burn hospitals and we provide these services to these children through fundraisers, requests and donations."

Theresa said, "He's ready to get up there, where he'll be one more day closer to coming home. He's real positive about everything."

Blake's mother said he will be evaluated for the first month he's in Chicago and is expected to be in the Shriner’s' care at least until 2009.

 

[O.F.F.]

Did you know about that crime from that Anti-Mason that I posted on this thread? He listened to you and many other Anti-Mason conspiracy theorists? Did you apologize to the family who lost their loved one? After all, it was your words and that of many Anti-Mason and conspiracy theory crowds that set him off... Do you not feel any remorse for such actions? I'm not sure what sane person would go along with your "Ministry" that promotes fear and terror that lead to such atrocities? What do you say to the family for putting such drivel in that criminals mind that led him to such actions? Do you even care? Is there not even an ounce of humanity in you people? Who truly is following Satan, Gentry?

The article you posted said nothing about the killer being motivated by "my words" or those from O.F.F. In other words, he did not "listen to me" (Mike Gentry) and decide to kill his neighbor. You are mischaracterizing the story by attributing blame for his actions to me. That's a far stretch, and a false witness, sad Sab.

By your logic, I can attribute the murder of a Prince Hall Mason (civil-rights leader, Medgar Evers) by a "traditional" (non-Prince Hall Mason, Byron De La Beckwith) to you, because you are one, and the hatred and bigotry of "White" Masons who do not accept Black Masons descending from Prince Hall as fellow brothers in the fraternity. I trust you don't want to take such blame, but if you insist my responsibility in the case you cite, I certainly can say the same of you in the one I cite.

 

[Sabbathiel]

The article you posted said nothing about the killer being motivated by "my words." In other words, he did not "listen to me" and decide to kill his neighbor. You are mischaracterizing the story attributing blame for his actions to me. That's a far stretch, and a false witness, sad Sab.

By your logic, I can attribute the murder of a Prince Hall Mason (civil-rights leader, Medgar Evers) by a "traditional" (non-Prince Hall Mason, Byron De La Beckwith) to you, because of the hatred and bigotry of "White" Masons who do not accept Black Masons descending from Prince Hall as fellow brothers in the fraternity. I trust you don't want to take such blame, but if you insist my responsibility in the case you cite, I certainly can say the same of you in the one I cite.

No but the article posted and evidence has been gathered from where the criminal read "Anti-Mason" sites...It's safe to assume your fairly well known site is one of them. An assumption, "Opinion", rather false or not we'll never know but my underlying message is correct that the whole "Anti-Mason" propaganda and fear mongering did not help matters much.

As far as African Americans not being accepted in Lodge, then how do you explain several African Americans being members of regular Lodges and the spread of Prince Hall being recognized by regular Lodges and what about African Lodges in African recognized by the UGLE and most American Grand Lodges? You don't know much do you?

And if you read my posts, you would have learned of a Christian Mason that was quite fond of helping African Americans even in the darkest of times...

Times are changing and racism is coming to an end... It's a shame ignorance is not and a danger is growing coming from you people who mislead others thus continuing more hate crimes based on fear and delusions. People like you don't even care because you only want and worship that almighty dollar...

 

[Sabbathiel]

And its funny that you want to through out that race card rather quickly without even knowing if I'm African American, Latino, etc... as if Race is an issue... The only connection to Masonry being made is you Anti-Masons when Masonry teaches "Equality" among all men and its you who says RACE is an issue considering different races are likely to believe in something other than Christianity. Many African Americans are Muslim and so are Africans. Heck people on this site is calling Obama the "Anti-Christ". Anti-Masons keep reassuring them that he is because he is believed to be a MASON!

AND You say that it is a sin for me to stand beside a man of different race in Lodge... I say that it is not and I call that man of a different race "Brother" and would put my life on the line for him... You call me a "Satanist" for doing so...

You might as well be tied to that crime to as that is what you are teaching the younger generation...Hey, if you don't like it, then quit being such a bigot!

Don't take my responses at face value Gentry, think about them a little. If you are not part of the solution then you are a part of the problem. That's what I'm getting at. You and the rest of the Anti-Mason community is planting fear in the minds of these kids and adults that listen to you! For example, if you go along and start shouting that Obama is the Anti-Christ then your followers will go along with it and thus start becoming more and more paranoid. What do you got then? A bunch of anarchists...And whose fault is that? Surely not ours but the ones who keep spreading the delusions...

If you continue to tell people that good men are "Evil" then they will follow you like a bunch of mindless zombies. That's the point... And you don't even recognize the harm being done...Just take a look at the posts I put out there on this thread. What are you going to tell those people in the hospitals, that the Masons are evil for funding their health care? What about the community involvement that countless Masons partake in to help others? Where in their actions is the evil?

 

[O.F.F.]

Calm down boy, you are going to blow a gasket! It sounds like the "Sabbathiel" needs to take a sabbatical.

If you continue to tell people that good men are "Evil" then they will follow you like a bunch of mindless zombies.

Too bad that you speak in such a condescending manner by undermining the intelligence of those who frequent this site, and the entire Internet for that matter, by thinking they are "a bunch of mindless zombies."

But just to set the record straight, I have NEVER said that good men are 'evil' nor have I ever called Masons evil. My contention, and that of O.F.F. is that what Masons have been taught is heretical, and therefore evil. Get it straight, or else we'll have to call you a 'crooked' Mason.

If in your futile 'zeal' to defend indefensible heresy, you insist on mischaracterizing our position, than I will simply choose to ignore your ignorance. If on the other hand, you would like to debate the topic of the thread, than I would be happy to engage you in this discussion. Otherwise, just know that, like I told my kids when they immaturely threw 'a fit,' your little temper tantrum will get you nowhere.

While we recognize that 'red herrings' are a common tactic by defenders of the Masonic faith, it's rude for you to use them here, or anywhere for that matter. It's a poor manner of debate, and fails miserably in refuting any argument. I suspect that most readers would rather you get back to the topic of the thread or simply leave us alone to discuss it ourselves. As one who claims to be both a Christian and an 'upright man and Mason' which of these choices are you going to make?

 

[The Cub]

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[Sphinx777]

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Utterly fascinating...

 

[Sabbathiel]

One can be both, Christian and a up-right man. If not, then you cannot be a Christian...Christians are to walk up-right, be honest and caring...Something you consider "Heresy."

I like the red herring picture, you steal that too?

By the way, only those who blindly follow false teachers and those who irrationally accuse others of "Heresy" are mindless zombies. If you claim everyone on the internet follow you, well so be it... I obviously give more people credit than you do...

Also I thought the contention of OFF was taking money by defaming a good organization? I thought that was proven too...Oh, it was! Wow...

I'm not sure how I can be crooked. After all, you're the one caught stealing identities...

I honestly don't think the readers prefer debating with dishonest individuals, especially one that steals identities... Also, it helps to start a discussion with material not used by a man who wrote it to take advantage of the Christian Faith for profitable gain. Especially sense it makes Christians look like idiots for even trusting such a man. You know, men such as yourself who rely and sponge off those who believe in God, hoping that your "Ministry of lies and deception" will draw people in and throw some cash your way.

And we call that the "Con artist" tactic which has been used for generations, mainly by televangelists...
"Pay your way into heaven!" Come on...get a real job dude...

So what topic? What debate? You can't even answer the questions I posted, respond to the material...Typical "con artist" tactic to shun that which further proves my point... There's nothing wrong with Masonry, just that which you invented and call "Heresy", not sure which part since you can't even provide that... What you add and what is legit is two different things...

Face it... Your "Ministry" has been exposed and so have you. Hopefully more and more people will wise up and funding for such BS will end, but then again you'll just continue to sponge off the government another way.

Sorry if you consider spouting facts about OFF the red fish tactic but that's just another way of telling people to ignore the other side and only listen to you...

 

[HisdaughterJen]

If Freemasonry truly was a charity organization, there would be no problem. It's not. All anyone has to do is look at the symbolism to see that something is amiss.
Digging a little deeper reveals that it is very anti-God (true God, Jesus/Yahweh) and pro-Lucifer.

As far as the people who are caught up in it...sure, there are plenty of good people who do charity work but that isn't going to save them on Judgment Day. I imagine even wicca and devil worshippers participate in charity work.

No one is judging INDIVIDUALS who are caught up in the Freemason "religion"...YES, RELIGION....they pray to the "grand architect of the universe" and have their own way to God. What is being judged is the symbolism, the teachings, the ideology of Freemasonry standing up against the Word of God and Freemasonry is found to be lacking and quite evil.

Individuals are judged by God as only HE can see the heart and motivations.

 

[Sabbathiel]

By the way, noticed you like to just say "Sab." If the intention is to make fun of the name, well you should look more into theology and learn a little about Religion and various Religions before "Preaching" about heresy...

 

[Sabbathiel]

If Freemasonry truly was a charity organization, there would be no problem. It's not. All anyone has to do is look at the symbolism to see that something is amiss.
Digging a little deeper reveals that it is very anti-God (true God, Jesus/Yahweh) and pro-Lucifer.

As far as the people who are caught up in it...sure, there are plenty of good people who do charity work but that isn't going to save them on Judgment Day. I imagine even wicca and devil worshippers participate in charity work.

No one is judging INDIVIDUALS who are caught up in the Freemason "religion"...YES, RELIGION....they pray to the "grand architect of the universe" and have their own way to God. What is being judged is the symbolism, the teachings, the ideology of Freemasonry standing up against the Word of God and Freemasonry is found to be lacking and quite evil.

Individuals are judged by God as only HE can see the heart and motivations.

Perhaps reading past posts, actually reading them, and knowing what it is you are talking about might help.

Also when talking about "Charity" know what the full definition is...even in scripture and not just throw it to the side...

Do try to get the full picture of what it is you are speaking against...