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Mary as mediatrix?

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Gwendolyn

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Hi all,

Just wondering if you have some info on the portrayal of Mary as "mediatrix of all graces". I know that some of you likely have a lot of info - excerpts from papal documents, etc. that refer to Mary as mediatrix and/or explain what the term means.

I would specifically like to know the first earliest appearance of this term applied to Mary, and the circumstances under which it appeared (ie context).

Also, if you guys could brief me on what it means theologically - isn't Christ the only mediator, especially of grace? - that'd be great.

I know I am asking a hefty amount, but I figure that if I had to ask anyone, you guys would know best. :)
 

JoabAnias

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Everything you want is here:

http://www.voxpopuli.org/booktext.php

I sent in a petition and got a letter back from Rome stating it wasn't currently under consideration for various reason.

I could find the letter and what it said for you later if you like.
 
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BAFRIEND

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Also, if you guys could brief me on what it means theologically - isn't Christ the only mediator, especially of grace? - that'd be great.

This was dealt with in Vatican II. No title in anyway bestowed upon Bl. Mary can take away from dignity of Christ as the sole mediator.
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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Everything you want is here:

http://www.voxpopuli.org/booktext.php

I sent in a petition and got a letter back from Rome stating it wasn't currently under consideration for various reason.

I could find the letter and what it said for you later if you like.

Besides all the Latin phrasings and over analysis, is there one shred of Scriptural evidence to back up the idea of Mary be equal (coredemptrix, mediatrix ) to Jesus Christ ? I will submit that the scripture clearly and unequivocally shows that Jesus is the only mediator between us and God.

For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man [1] Christ Jesus,

15 Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant. [1]


Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
 
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BAFRIEND

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The Sole Mediator between God and man is Jesus Christ.

Vatican II (Lumen Gentium): The Fathers of the Council brought up titles for Mary including: "Mediatrix" , "Benefactress" , "Helper" (never once Co-Redemptrix).

The Council stated that, (Blessed Mary's titles) "...neither takes away anything nor adds anything to the dignity and efficacy of Christ the one Mediator."

So, the Bishops of the Catholic Church stated that Jesus Christ was the One Mediator and specifically stated that no title given to Blessed Mary could take away the fact that Jesus is the One Mediator and that to hold the view or procalim Blessed Mary as a Co-Mediator takes away from the dignity that Lord Jesus Christ is the Sole Mediator.
This is just to point out the Church's official standing.

No, Jesus is the only mediator, while Mary was his mother, she cannot take the place of the role of Jesus in regards to our salvation.
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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The Sole Mediator between God and man is Jesus Christ.

Vatican II (Lumen Gentium): The Fathers of the Council brought up titles for Mary including: "Mediatrix" , "Benefactress" , "Helper" (never once Co-Redemptrix).

The Council stated that, (Blessed Mary's titles) "...neither takes away anything nor adds anything to the dignity and efficacy of Christ the one Mediator."

So, the Bishops of the Catholic Church stated that Jesus Christ was the One Mediator and specifically stated that no title given to Blessed Mary could take away the fact that Jesus is the One Mediator and that to hold the view or procalim Blessed Mary as a Co-Mediator takes away from the dignity that Lord Jesus Christ is the Sole Mediator.
This is just to point out the Church's official standing.

No, Jesus is the only mediator, while Mary was his mother, she cannot take the place of the role of Jesus in regards to our salvation.

I agree, but to just take this a step further. If the council HAD stated that Mary was co mediator, would that take precedence over scripture ?
 
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BAFRIEND

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I agree, but to just take this a step further. If the council HAD stated that Mary was co mediator, would that take precedence over scripture ?

Yes, but not in spite of scripture but because of it. Jesus promised that the Holy Spirit would never abandone the Church and that was bound on earth would be bound in heaven. To go against the council would basically be to state that the Holy Spirit has abandoned the Church.

Also, Catholics are not fundies and the RCC Canonized the New Testament. Jews are not fundies and they authored and safeguarded the Old Testament. Fundamental literalism is modern day sagism and fails in the very first two chapters of Genesis which gives two conflicting creation accounts.
 
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eastcoast_bsc

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Yes, but not in spite of scripture but because of it. Jesus promised that the Holy Spirit would never abandone the Church and that was bound on earth would be bound in heaven. To go against the council would basically be to state that the Holy Spirit has abandoned the Church.

Also, Catholics are not fundies and the RCC Canonized the New Testament. Jews are not fundies and they authored and safeguarded the Old Testament. Fundamental literalism is modern day sagism and fails in the very first two chapters of Genesis which gives two conflicting creation accounts.


You certainly know that I am NOT a Fundie, and yes some Catholics are Fundies. Also both your assertions, 1. The Bible is not accurate, 2. The Catholic church Canonized the scripture, can be both argued for and against. Do a simple Google query. But I submit that what you state can easily become a slippery slope, what if the Church decided that Christ rising from the dead was simply a metaphor for faith and a hope for a better future ? Would you simply agree or look to the scripture and stand firm ?
 
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thereselittleflower

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This was dealt with in Vatican II. No title in anyway bestowed upon Bl. Mary can take away from dignity of Christ as the sole mediator.

In Vatican II her role as Mediatrix is clearly recognized with this title, with specific reference given to Church writings referring to Mary as Mediatrix of All Graces.

This takes nothing from Christ.
 
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BAFRIEND

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You certainly know that I am NOT a Fundie, and yes some Catholics are Fundies. Also both your assertions, 1. The Bible is not accurate, 2. The Catholic church Canonized the scripture, can be both argued for and against. Do a simple Google query. But I submit that what you state can easily become a slippery slope, what if the Church decided that Christ rising from the dead was simply a metaphor for faith and a hope for a better future ? Would you simply agree or look to the scripture and stand firm ?

Easily become a slippery slope ?

If so, please give an example of when that has happened in the last 2000 plus years.
 
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BAFRIEND

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In Vatican II her role as Mediatrix is clearly recognized with this title, with specific reference given to Church writings referring to Mary as Mediatrix of All Graces.

This takes nothing from Christ.

I believe that what is being addressed is whether Mary can mediate between God and man. The answer is no. That is reserved for Christ alone, and that is what I am addressing.
 
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thereselittleflower

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I believe that what is being addressed is whether Mary can mediate between God and man. The answer is no. That is reserved for Christ alone, and that is what I am addressing.

We all mediate between God and man every time we pray for someone.

Christ is not the only mediator. The Catholic Church teaches that Christ is not the only meditor. The only ones who teach this are protestants.

Christ is the only mediator of the NEW COVENANT - no one else died for us.

But that does ot nea that Mary is not what God chose her to be, the Mediatrix/Dispensatrix of all graces.

The Church has taught from earliest tines that Christ is the Head, Mary is the neck, and we are body. All flows through Mary. This is by God's design.

This has been consistantly taught by popes for the last few centuries:


The Church teaches that Mary is the dispenser of ALL Graces, she is the Mediatrix of ALL Graces. The Church teaches that as Christ is the Head of the Body, and we are the Body of Chirst, Mary is the neck, and all flows through Mary to us from Christ by God's divine will and design.


Vatican II in Lumen Gentium calls Mary "Mediatrix".

Even though Vatican II does not call Mary Mediatrix of ALL Graces, it does refer to Leo XIII, Adiutricem populi saying
she has "practically limitless power." ,
St. Pius X, Ad diem illum - she is:
"Dispensatrix of all the gifts which Jesus gained for us by His Death and by His Blood.... But Mary as St. Bernard fittingly remarks [De Aquaeductu 4] is the 'channel' or, even, the neck, through which the body is joined to the head, and likewise through which the head exerts its power and strength on the body. 'For she is the neck of our Head, by which all spiritual gifts are communicated to His Mystical Body.' [St. Bernardine of Siena, Quadrag. De Evangelio aeterno, Sermo X, a. 3. c. 3.]"
and Pius XI, Miserentissimus Redemptor, and Pius XII, Radiomessage to Fatima:
""Her kingdom is as vast as that of her Son and God, since nothing is excluded from her dominion."
For more examples of this doctrine of the Church, one can examine this page by Fr Most:
http://www.ewtn.com/faith/teachings/marya4a.htm

in which he gives us many such quotes as:

"2) Leo XIII, Encyclical, Superiore anno, August 30, 1884. ASS 17, 1884. 49.
... may He hear the prayers of those who beseech through her, whom He Himself willed to be the mediatrix [administram] of graces."
) Leo XIII, Encyclical, Octobri mense adventante, Sept 22, 1891, ASS 24, 1891, 196.
... it is right to say, that nothing at all of that very great treasury of all grace which the Lord brought us--for 'grace and truth came through Jesus Christ' [Jn 1.17]--nothing is imparted to us except through Mary, since God so wills, so that just as no one can come to the Father except through the Son, so in general, no one can come to Christ except through His Mother.
4) Leo XIII, Encyclical, Iucunda semper, Sept 8, 1984. ASS 27, 1894. 179.
... when He [the Father] has been invoked with excellent prayers, our humble voice turns to Mary; in accordance with no other law than that law of conciliation and petition which was expressed as follows by St. Bernardine of Siena : 'Every grace that is communicated to this world has a threefold course. For by excellent order, it is dispensed from God to Christ, from Christ to the Virgin, from the Virgin to us.' [Internal quote from S. Bernardine, Sermon on Nativity of B. V. M. n. 6.]
15) Pius XI, Apostolic Letter, Cognitum sane, Jan 14, 1926, AAS 18, 1926, 213.
We, to whom nothing is dearer than that the devotion of the Christian people be aroused more and more towards the Virgin who is the treasurer [sequestra] of all graces with God, think we should grant these wishes.
16) Pius XI, Encyclical, Ingravescentibus malis, Sept 29, 1937, AAS 29, 1927, 380.
... we know also that all things are imparted to us from God the Greatest and Best, through the hands of the Mother of God.
19) John XXIII, Epistle to Cardinal Agaganian, Legate to Marian Congress in Saigon, Jan 31, 1959, AAS 51, 1959, 88.
For the faithful can do nothing more fruitful and salutary than to win for themselves the most powerful patronage of the Immaculate Virgin, so that by this most sweet Mother, there may be opened to them, all the treasures of the divine Redemption, and so they may have life, and have it more abundantly. Did not the Lord will that we have everything through Mary
This has been the clear and unanmious teaching of the Church.
 
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thereselittleflower

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Mary being the Mediatrix of all graces is indeed the consistant teaching of the Church, consistantly taught by popes for the last 3 centuries, and not just because she gave birth to Jesus, but because God has chosen, in His economy of salvation, to give to Mary this task.

Even in the ancient Church, Mary is prayed to thus in this most ancient prayer of the Church:
We fly to your patronage, O holy Theotokos2;
despise not our petition in our necessities,
but deliver us always from all dangers,
O ever-glorious and blessed Virgin.


Sub Tuum Praesidium
This teaching comes all the way down the centuries to us from the ECF's and the saints - this doctrine is continuously testified to:
St Ephraem - (373 AD):
"I call upon you, Mediatrix of the world; I invoke your prompt protection in my necessities."


(fourth sermon on Our Lady) “dispensatrix of all gifts... Mediatrix of the whole world

Sancti Ephraem Syri opera graece et latine,. ed. Assemani, Vol. 3 (Rome, 1746), p. 525 and pp. 528‑529.
St. Andrew of Crete (660-740 AD):
"Mediatrix of the law and grace”

“she is the mediation between the sublimity of God and the abjection of the flesh.”
St. Cyril of Alexandria:
"Hail Mary Theotokos, venerable treasure of the whole world, light unextinguished, crown of virginity, sceptre of orthodoxy, indestructible temple, which contains the uncontainable... it is through you that the Holy Trinity is glorified and adored, through you, the precious cross is venerated and adored throughout the whole world, through you that heaven is in gladness, that angels and archangels rejoice that demons are put to flight, through you that the tempter, the devil is cast from heaven, through you that the fallen creature is raised up to heaven, through you that all creation, once imprisoned in idolatry, has reached knowledge of the truth, that the faithful obtain baptism and the oil of joy, churches have been founded in the whole world, that peoples are led to conversion." [7]
St. Germanus:
Our Lady is “truly a good Mediatrix of all sinners.” (Hom. in Dorm. II, PG 98, 321, 352‑3)
St. Tarasius of Constantinople:
“the Mediatrix of all who are under Heaven.” (In SS. Deiparae Praesentionem. PG 98, 1499).” [8]
St. Bernard of Clairvaux:
“gratiae inventrix, mediatrix, salutis restauratrix saeculorum.” [9]

"God Has willed that we should have nothing which would not pass through the hands of Mary." (Hom. III in vig. nativit., n. 10, PL 183, 100)
"God has placed in Mary the plenitude of every good, in order to have us understand that if there is any trace of hope in us, any trace of grace, any trace of salvation, it flows from her." [10]

"God could have dispensed His graces according to His good pleasure, without making use of this aqueduct (Mary); but it was His wish to provide this means whereby grace would reach you." [11]
St. Albert the Great:
“To her [Mary] alone was given this privilege, namely, a communication in the Passion; to her the Son willed to communicate the merit of the Passion, in order that He could give her the reward; and in order to make her a sharer in the benefit of Redemption. He willed that she be a sharer in the penalty of the Passion, insofar as she might become the Mother of all through re-creation even as she was the adjudtrix of the Redemption by her co-passion. And just as the whole world is bound to God by His supreme Passion, so also it is bound to the Lady of all by her co-passion.” (Mariale, Opera Omnia, v. 37, Q. 150, p. 219)

every single grace passes through the hands of Mary.” [12]

“The Blessed Virgin is very properly called ‘gate of heaven,’ for every created or uncreated grace that ever came or will ever come into this world came through her.” (Mariale 147)
St. Thomas Aquinas:
"Mary is the whole hope of our salvation,” [13]

"Through the intercession of Mary any souls are in Paradise who would not be there had she not interceded for them, for God has entrusted her with the keys and treasures of the heavenly kingdom.” [14]
St. Gregory Palamas:
“No divine gift can reach either angels or men, save through her mediation. As one cannot enjoy the light of a lamp … save through the medium of this lamp, so every movement towards God, every impulse towards good coming from Him is unrealizable save through the mediation of the Virgin. She does not cease to spread benefits on all creatures….” [15]
Theophanes of Nicaea:
“[Mary] is the dispenser and distributor of all the wondrous uncreated gifts of the divine Spirit, which make us Christ’s brothers and co-heirs, not only because she is granting the gifts of her natural Son to His brothers in grace, but also because she is bestowing them on these as her own true sons, though not by ties of nature but of grace.” [16]
St. Louis De Montfort:
"To Mary, His faithful spouse, God the Holy Ghost has communicated His unspeakable gifts; and He has chosen her to be the dispensatrix of all He possesses, in such sort that she distributes to whom she wills, as much as she wills, as she wills and when she wills, all His gifts and graces. The Holy Ghost gives no heavenly gift to men which does not pass through her virginal hands." [17]

“… Mary whom He has appointed to be … treasurer of His riches, Distributor of His graces, Worker of His great miracles, Restorer of the human race, Mediatrix of men, Destroyer of God’s enemies, and faithful Companion of His great works and triumphs.” (W.G. 28)
St. Alphonsus Liguori:
"God, who gave us Jesus Christ, wills that all graces that have been, that are, and will be dispensed to men to the end of the world through the merits of Jesus Christ, should be dispensed by the hands and through the intercession of Mary." (The Glories of Mary, Ch. 5).

"I consider it as indubitably true that all graces are dispensed by Mary.” [18]
St. John Vianney:
"All the saints have a great devotion to Our Lady: no grace comes from Heaven without passing through her hands. We cannot go into a house without speaking to the doorkeeper. Well, the Holy Virgin is the doorkeeper of Heaven.”
St. Peter Julian Eymard:
"Mankind was unworthy to receive the Word directly from God, so Mary was our Mediatrix in the Incarnation, and she continues to exercise that function. No one comes to the knowledge of Jesus Christ and embraces His holy law except through her; no one obtains the saving gift of faith except by her prayers. Her mission, to which she is ever faithful, is to give us Jesus. He must be received from her hands, and in vain do we seek Him elsewhere." [19]

This is the Sacred Tradition of the East as well:
Syriac liturgy:
"How can I praise thee duly, O most chaste Virgin? For thou alone among men art all‑holy; and thou givest to all the help and grace they need

Armenian liturgy:
“Rejoice, 0 Mother of God, throne of salvation and hope of the human race, Mediatrix of law and grace

Chaldean liturgy:
“O Queen of queens, all rich, enrich thy servants with benefits, O Mother of the Most High. For He has made thee the dispensatrix of His treasures and the universal Queen. It is in thy bosom that He has placed His treasures, and in thee He has gathered graces as in a sea, and He has made thee the source of life for mortals…”

This is the clear and consistant teaching of the Church from ancient times, pronounced even more cleary in the teaching of our Popes in the last few centuries.
 
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BAFRIEND

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RCC theology: Jesus Christ is the sole mediator between man and God. Mediation is not something the saints posses on their own. The Saints pray for us and we pray for each other- but God needs neither.

Christ is not the only mediator. The Catholic Church teaches that Christ is not the only meditor. The only ones who teach this are protestants.

Sorry, but you are mistaken.

1 Timothy 2 Chapter 2:5:

For there is one God.
There is only one mediator between God and the human race, Christ Jesus, himself human, who gave himself as ransom for all.

Since when is St Paul a protestant, TLF ? Jesus chose Saint Paul in the desert to spread the word. The Bishops of our Church stated there is only co-redeemor and no co-redemptrix.
 
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JoabAnias

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Besides all the Latin phrasings and over analysis, is there one shred of Scriptural evidence to back up the idea of Mary be equal (coredemptrix, mediatrix ) to Jesus Christ ? I will submit that the scripture clearly and unequivocally shows that Jesus is the only mediator between us and God.

You didn't check out the site did you? I am not getting into it, just providing info as asked for.

I believe the site referenced explains your question here:

Do we find support for the proposed Dogma of Mary Coredemptrix, Mediatrix of all Graces and Advocate in Scripture?

and here:

Mary Co-redemptrix: A Response to 7 Common Objections
 
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thereselittleflower

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RCC theology: Jesus Christ is the sole mediator between man and God. Mediation is not something the saints posses on their own. The Saints pray for us and we pray for each other- but God needs neither.
It is by God's design that the saints pray for us and we pray for each other. In this we share in Christ's mediating role, but we doe not become THE Mediator of the New Covenent.Mary is not called THE Mediatrix. She is called the CO-Mediatrix, meaning "with". As with all titles given Mary, this must be understood according to the teaching of the Church. As with all teaching of the Church on Mary's role in the economy of salvation is always dependent on Christ's, subordinate to Christ's, inferior to Christ"s, but always superior to all others.True, God could have chosen a different way. But he didn't. This is what God has chosen.To argue that Mary cannot be Co-Medatrix on the grounds you have chosen is no different than protestants arguing we can't pray to Mary because Christ is the Sole Mediator.But like what is happning here, they are privately interpretting scripture contrary to the teaching of the Church and arriving at a wrong concluson; in part because they also are ignoring the context in which Paul said this which, when taken into consideration, is about Christ being the one mediator of the New Covenant, NOT the only mediator ever.The scripture never trumps Church teaching, and as Catholic we are not permitted to interpret scripture contrary to Church teaching.
Sorry, but you are mistaken. 1 Timothy 2 Chapter 2:5:For there is one God. There is only one mediator between God and the human race, Christ Jesus himself human, who gave himself as ransom for all.
Right there is the context telling us what Paul was referring to - Christ's death on the cross</p>
&quot; who gave himself as ransom for all.&quot;
This is all Paul was referring to. Christ being the mediator of the New covenant - there is no other name by which men might be saved.
Since when is St Paul a protestant, TLF ? Jesus chose Saint Paul in the desert to spread the word. The Bishops of our Church stated there is only co-redeemor and no co-redemptrix.
Now this completely contradicts what the Church has proclaimed.And this thread is not about the title co-redemtrix which is Catholic teaching by the way and simply the feminine form of redeemer; it is about the title Mediatrix or Co-Mediatrix.This title Mediatrix is official Catholic teaching officially recognized in Vatican II when The Church clearly proclaimed that Mary is recognized under the title Mediatrix in Lumen Gentium.When one argues that Mary is not Mediatrix anyone is arguing against the Church Herself which is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth.
 
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ShannonMcCatholic

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And in regards to Co- Redemptrix...we are all co-redeemers, since as Catholics we believe that we have to participate in the ongoing work of redemption to receive salvation. We a re justified by Christ's sacrifice on the Cross and nothing else--but we are redemed in cooperation with grace bestowed upon us, and experience salvation once we enter heaven.
 
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isshinwhat

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And in regards to Co- Redemptrix...we are all co-redeemers, since as Catholics we believe that we have to participate in the ongoing work of redemption to receive salvation. We a re justified by Christ's sacrifice on the Cross and nothing else--but we are redemed in cooperation with grace bestowed upon us, and experience salvation once we enter heaven.

:thumbsup:

I find it ironic that the same Protestants who have a problem with the term Co-Redemptrix have no problem with saying that they are going on a mission trip to save souls... They aren't "saving" anyone in the same sense Christ is, but they realize full well they have a part to play with Christ, co-Christ, in His Redemptive work. It's really beautiful if people would just sit back and listen to what is being said, rather than getting worked up about Latin phraseology they don't understand.
 
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