Mark 14:61-64

[yeshuaslavejeff]

John 20:28
And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

From a Hebrew/ English translation with the original Names in place:

"Yahshua came and stood in the midst, and said, Peace to you.

27 Then He said to Thomas, Bring your finger here and see My hands, and bring your hand and thrust into My side, and be not unbelieving, but believing.

28 And Thomas answered and said to Him, my Master and my Elohim!

29 Yahshua said to him, Because you have seen Me, Thomas, you have believed. Blessed are the ones not seeing me, and believing.

30 Then truly Yahshua did many other miracles in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book.

31 But these have been written that you may believe that Yahshua is the Messiah, the Son of YAHWEH, and that believing you may have eternal life in His name.

 

[gadar perets]

(footnote: YHWH and Yeshua/Yahshua may occur over 1000 times in the original, but were edited out of english !!!!!!!!!! )

Are you suggesting they were edited out of the Greek as well since they are not found there either?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Are you suggesting they were edited out of the Greek as well since they are not found there either?

I don't know enough to answer you here. A suggestion: find one or more, if you can, of the translations that doesn't change the Names to the common English "God" "Jesus" "Christ" and so on, and see how often the differences occur .....

 

[dfw69]

From a Hebrew/ English translation with the original Names in place:

"Yahshua came and stood in the midst, and said, Peace to you.

27 Then He said to Thomas, Bring your finger here and see My hands, and bring your hand and thrust into My side, and be not unbelieving, but believing.

28 And Thomas answered and said to Him, my Master and my Elohim!

29 Yahshua said to him, Because you have seen Me, Thomas, you have believed. Blessed are the ones not seeing me, and believing.

30 Then truly Yahshua did many other miracles in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book.

31 But these have been written that you may believe that Yahshua is the Messiah, the Son of YAHWEH, and that believing you may have eternal life in His name.

Could Tomas had said "my adonai and my elohim"?

Or even "my YHVH and my elohim" ?

 

[dfw69]

Well, if we accept your interpretation, then Simeon was praying to YHWH while YHWH was in his arms!

It seems simeon was a prophet...or had special insight of yahshua revelation ....I like to think simeon prayed to YHWH while YHVH was in his arms.....

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Could Tomas had said "my adonai and my elohim"?

Or even "my YHVH and my elohim" ?

More information is needed to find out.
I just found this (haven't looked at the site yet)

From Adonai to Yahweh - Bible Topics
www.bibletopics.com/biblestudy/154.htm
The four most popular one-word names are Yahweh (6,800 times); Elohim (2,600 ... 1 Since Adonai and Yahweh are both typically translated as “Lord,” many ...

Other sites in the past 20 years have reported similar information.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

It seems simeon was a prophet...or had special insight of yahshua revelation ....I like to think simeon prayed to YHWH while YHVH was in his arms.....

No, it wasn't YHVH in his arms - Yahshua and YHVH were never mixed up in Scripture, in the original, nor by the faithful Ekklesia who knew them. (little children may mix them up, and adults new to learning,
and gentiles who haven't learned) .... it may be pertinent though, that when the disciples said "show us ABBA", Yahshua said "if you have seen Me, you have seen ABBA" ..... because they are echad (one), but they still talk with one another, for our sakes not because they have to, indicating to us that they are echad, yet still ABBA and SON, it is a mystery since we cannot see nor measure SPIRIT, nor grasp it in our feeble condition.

 

[dfw69]

No, it wasn't YHVH in his arms - Yahshua and YHVH were never mixed up in Scripture, in the original, nor by the faithful Ekklesia who knew them. (little children may mix them up, and adults new to learning,
and gentiles who haven't learned) .... it may be pertinent though, that when the disciples said "show us ABBA", Yahshua said "if you have seen Me, you have seen ABBA" ..... because they are echad (one), but they still talk with one another, for our sakes not because they have to, indicating to us that they are echad, yet still ABBA and SON, it is a mystery since we cannot see nor measure SPIRIT, nor grasp it in our feeble condition.

I'm hoping one day archeologists will find an old preserved scroll of the old testiment that dates to pre messiah times.. And it will hopefully show proof that YHWH and YHVH were written within the scriptures...which would clear a lot of our misunderstandings ...but that's just wishful thinking on my part ....

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I'm hoping one day archeologists will find an old preserved scroll of the old testiment that dates to pre messiah times.. And it will hopefully show proof that YHWH and YHVH were written within the scriptures...which would clear a lot of our misunderstandings ...but that's just wishful thinking on my part ....

Yahweh Willing, if you look for a while, you will find it. It is not a secret except to the world.

 

[gadar perets]

Could Tomas had said "my adonai and my elohim"?

Or even "my YHVH and my elohim" ?

"Adonai" means "Lord". "Adoni" means "my Lord". "Elohim" means "God". "Eli" or "Eloi" or "elohi" means "my God" or "my god" depending on who is being addressed. If the one true God is being addressed, then the first two are correct. If any other being is addressed, "elohi" is correct. Thomas knew he was not standing in front of Yeshua's Father (YHWH), but in front of Yeshua himself (YHWH's Son). Therefore, Thomas would have said, "adoni elohi" if he was speaking Hebrew.

 

[gadar perets]

It seems simeon was a prophet...or had special insight of yahshua revelation ....I like to think simeon prayed to YHWH while YHVH was in his arms.....

YHWH and YHVH are from the same Hebrew word (יהוה). Some pronounce the waw as a w and some as a v. Archaeologists will NEVER find a text where YHWH and YHVH are written in the text. All Hebrew texts read יהוה. It is only English texts that would have YHWH or YHVH, but not both.

 

[dfw69]

"Adonai" means "Lord". "Adoni" means "my Lord". "Elohim" means "God". "Eli" or "Eloi" or "elohi" means "my God" or "my god" depending on who is being addressed. If the one true God is being addressed, then the first two are correct. If any other being is addressed, "elohi" is correct. Thomas knew he was not standing in front of Yeshua's Father (YHWH), but in front of Yeshua himself (YHWH's Son). Therefore, Thomas would have said, "adoni elohi" if he was speaking Hebrew.

I been told its wrong to worship yahshua for the things he's done for us....that we should only worship Hashem....but I believe when we worship yahshua for what he is and what he done we worship the father as well ...because the 2 were one in purpose.....John 5:23 Revelation 5:13-14

 

[gadar perets]

I been told its wrong to worship yahshua for the things he's done for us....that we should only worship Hashem....but I believe when we worship yahshua for what he is and what he done we worship the father as well ...because the 2 were one in purpose.....John 5:23 Revelation 5:13-14

I agree with your position. What is wrong is to worship Yeshua for the things the Father has done. To say "Yeshua parted the Red Sea" or "Yeshua caused an ax head to float" is taking away from the glory of the Father. It is also wrong to worship Yeshua as though he IS the Father (Almighty YHWH). That is the Oneness doctrine.

 

[dfw69]

I agree with your position. What is wrong is to worship Yeshua for the things the Father has done. To say "Yeshua parted the Red Sea" or "Yeshua caused an ax head to float" is taking away from the glory of the Father. It is also wrong to worship Yeshua as though he IS the Father (Almighty YHWH). That is the Oneness doctrine.

Yes I see.....and there is no evidence yahshua was there with hashem unless scripture had revealed yahshua was YHVH with YHWH which as of now does not....

Hashem did all things for his son...

 

[Shimshon]

To say "Yeshua parted the Red Sea" or "Yeshua caused an ax head to float" is taking away from the glory of the Father.

How about saying it was Yeshua who gave the Law? And, when others use the verse John 14:15 'if you love me, keep my commands' and refer to the Torah, would you agree it is taking away from the glory of the Father who gave those laws?

 

[gadar perets]

How about saying it was Yeshua who gave the Law? And, when others use the verse John 14:15 'if you love me, keep my commands' and refer to the Torah, would you agree it is taking away from the glory of the Father who gave those laws?

Yes, I would.

 

[dfw69]

Were not yahshua commandments new laws within a new covenant?...
Love forgive judge not condemn not turn other cheek...love enemies . bless them ...have mercy ...pray to the father...etc

 

[gadar perets]

Were not yahshua commandments new laws within a new covenant?...
Love forgive judge not condemn not turn other cheek...love enemies . bless them ...have mercy ...pray to the father...etc

Some are some aren't. Love, forgiveness, blessing, mercy, and prayer are all "old". Many times Yeshua expounded upon something in the OC, but that did not make it a new law. For example, the OC commands us to love YHWH and our neighbors. However, our enemies can be our neighbors as well.