Mariology

[lionroar0]

The past 2000 years worth of traditions will never equal 2000 years worth of scipture. Illumination comes from the Holy Spirit not from man.

Since the Apostles only had the OT and no NT. I wonder what they had in place of the NT till they were written.

Maybe they had everything that Jesus taught and the revelation of the Holy Spirit.

I wonder what that's called?

Peace

 

[Hentenza]

Not at all. I'm merely saying since it is God's WILL to allow others to pray for us then there is no reason for Him to disallow it in Heaven as well since we are all supposed to be part of the Church.

And this is your opinion?

Poor interpretation on your part. The Church acknowledges there is only ONE mediator being Christ. However, you and I are little mediators as well when we assist others by praying for them when they ask us to. That verse annoys me seeing it constantly thrown at us when the very mention of asking Saints in Heaven to Pray for us is presented.

There is no way that you can interpret 1 Timothy 2:5 any other way. You don't like it because it contradicts THE church false teaching.
We are not mediators to God. We can have several people pray for one person but it is praying directly to God. Big difference.

 

[Hentenza]

Yes good one Hentenza. So if they did insert that book to back up Eroneous claims, then they just as well could have taken others that you feel defuses our Dogma out. But they didn't did they. Seems they knew very well nothing in there went against our Teachings.

Yeah, right.

 

[Hentenza]

There could be a 10 000 instances of traditions where the Bible is against it but the one Tradition it does speak of, is the one we speak of.

So if that is tghe case then you are actually agreeing with me. mmm....

Listen to yourself. Your saying everything must be consistant to how you interpretate it. C'mon, give me a break.

So you are saying that writtings that are inconsistent with scripture have as much weight as scripture? The anti-christ is going to have a field day with you guys.

 

[Hentenza]

Yes She could. God could easily allow them to also share in semi Omniscience. As in allow them to know what He wants them to know. It doesnt mean they would be God either be doing this. As the saying goes: "With God anything is possible" and if you think it is, then again, you limit God's power every time you utter those words.

Again, your opinion.

 

[Hentenza]

But all Baptists pray to other Christians, asking others to intercede before God.

That is an ignorant statement. We do not pray TO other christians, that would be silly. We pray directly to God in Jesus name. We can even have a bunch of us praying for someone but, again, the prayers are dircted at God.

 

[Hentenza]

Omniscient means all-knowing, it does not mean 'having spiritual ears to hear others'. If that were true, (and it were limited to God, which Scripture does not state either), then there would not be joy in heaven over one sinner repenting (because of course they would have to be omniscient to witness this).

And since omniscient means all knowing and Mary and the saints are not omniscient, how do you explain Mary or the saints being able to listen to silent prayer? How can they possibly listen to millions of prayer at one time? There is nothing in scripture that says that they can, however, scripture is very clear as to whom to pray to.

 

[Hentenza]

Since the Apostles only had the OT and no NT. I wonder what they had in place of the NT till they were written.

Maybe they had everything that Jesus taught and the revelation of the Holy Spirit.

I wonder what that's called?

Peace

Well, lets think about that for a minute. When the NT was being written the apostles were still alive to refute any false teachings. If you notice most of the epistles include warnings to different churches for straying away from the apostles teachings. Once the apostles died, the NT was wriiten. That is called scripture.

God Bless

 

[Oblio]

You don't like it because it contradicts THE church false teaching.

And you don't like the RC teaching because it contradicts your false teaching.

We are not mediators to God. We can have several people pray for one person but it is praying directly to God. Big difference.

No difference, we can have several Saints pray directly to God for us. You are confusing soteriological Mediation with intercessory mediation.

That is an ignorant statement. We do not pray TO other christians, that would be silly. We pray directly to God in Jesus name. We can even have a bunch of us praying for someone but, again, the prayers are dircted at God.

It is not ignorant, I used to be Baptist (and not long ago), it is an experiential testimony of Baptist faith and praxis. We often prayed to other Christians, at least in the Biblical meaning of the word.

And since omniscient means all knowing and Mary and the saints are not omniscient, how do you explain Mary or the saints being able to listen to silent prayer? How can they possibly listen to millions of prayer at one time? There is nothing in scripture that says that they can, however, scripture is very clear as to whom to pray to.

"All" != "Millions"

If Scripture is so clear on this, why do modern evangelicals disagree with 2000 years of orthodox praxis of the Church ? Why is it only in the past few hundred years that the Communion of the Saints has been forsaken by a few Christians ?

 

[Hentenza]

And you don't like the RC teaching because it contradicts your false teaching.

I have the teachings of scripture, no some contradictory word of mouth writting.

No difference, we can have several Saints pray directly to God for us. You are confusing soteriological Mediation with intercessory mediation.

Your opinion. Big difference between praying to dead saints and praying directly to God.

It is not ignorant, I used to be Baptist (and not long ago), it is an experiential testimony of Baptist faith and praxis. We often prayed to other Christians, at least in the Biblical meaning of the word.

Never seen that, and If I saw it I, would run the other way.

"All" != "Millions"

If Scripture is so clear on this, why do modern evangelicals disagree with 2000 years of orthodox praxis of the Church ? Why is it only in the past few hundred years that the Communion of the Saints has been forsaken by a few Christians ?

Truth will set you free. Yahooooo!!!!

 

[Oblio]

I have the teachings of scripture, no some contradictory word of mouth writting.

No, you have the teachings of your pastor, likely different from the one down the street, and definately different from a hundred years ago. How long before Baptists return to their former Calvinist ways ?

Never seen that, and If I saw it I, would run the other way

You would be like a pachinko ball here in the Baptist held SE USA, bouncing from church to church in search of one that fits your personal theology.

 

[Hentenza]

No, you have the teachings of your pastor, likely different from the one down the street, and definately different from a hundred years ago. How long before Baptists return to their former Calvinist ways ?



You would be like a pachinko ball here in the Baptist held SE USA, bouncing from church to church in search of one that fits your personal theology.

Again, your opinion, of course.

 

[IamAdopted]

No, you have the teachings of your pastor, likely different from the one down the street, and definately different from a hundred years ago. How long before Baptists return to their former Calvinist ways ?

Hhhmm Well His bible says the same as my bible and even though we don't know one another on a personal level we do stand on the same structure and that is the written scriptures. For it is Gods written truth that leads us to agreement.

 

[Oblio]

Hhhmm Well His bible says the same as my bible and even though we don't know one another on a personal level we do stand on the same structure and that is the written scriptures. For it is Gods written truth that leads us to agreement.

But you aren't in agreement, so it can't be God's word that you are professing, but rather the tradition of men.

 

[icedtea]

Imagine if there was a protestant Church and all in agreement, how powerful it could advance the gospel. Yet it is way splintered. Why is that?

 

[jckstraw72]

We can even have a bunch of us praying for someone but, again, the prayers are dircted at God.

and who the heck do you think the saints in heaven are praying to? seriously, do you think before you post stuff?

 

[Hentenza]

and who the heck do you think the saints in heaven are praying to? seriously, do you think before you post stuff?

The saints in heaven are worshiping God, not listening to our prayers. Only God can do that.
Don't you have something better to do than insult me? Seriously!

 

[IamAdopted]

But you aren't in agreement, so it can't be God's word that you are professing, but rather the tradition of men.

Who says we are not in agreement with each other. There has been nothing said from Hentenza that I have not agree'd with.

 

[ScottBot]

Again, your opinion.

In case you hadn't figured it out, this whole forum is based 99% on opinion. So, all posts should just carry that disclaimer.

 

[ScottBot]

I have come up with what should be adopted in Theology as a new standard definition:

tradition of men: An expressed opinion that I personally disagree with.