Many called, few chosen

[riverpastor]

I referenced the following scriptures below for this thread. I understand that there will be varying viewpoints, of which I am appreciative. I want to see some diversity here, mainly, because I want to see how people witness the Grace of God in this aspect of being CHOSEN. And, I want people on one side of the fence to see the view of someone from the other side of the fence that they do not necessarily hold the same viewpoint.

So... How are we chosen? Do "works" play a part in our being "chosen"? Do we have a choice ourselves in being chosen?

Please notice the last scripture just below the list itself. Mary had chosen and seemingly appears to have been chosen...

• Matthew 20:16 - So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.
  
• Matthew 22:14 - For many are called, but few are chosen.
  
• John 15:16 - Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
  
• John 15:19 - If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

Luke 10:42 - But one thing is needful: and Mary hath chosen that good part, which shall not be taken away from her.

 

[Suffolk Sean]

I referenced the following scriptures below for this thread. I understand that there will be varying viewpoints, of which I am appreciative. I want to see some diversity here, mainly, because I want to see how people witness the Grace of God in this aspect of being CHOSEN. And, I want people on one side of the fence to see the view of someone from the other side of the fence that they do not necessarily hold the same viewpoint.

So... How are we chosen? Do "works" play a part in our being "chosen"? Do we have a choice ourselves in being chosen?

Please notice the last scripture just below the list itself. Mary had chosen and seemingly appears to have been chosen...

• Matthew 20:16 - So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.
• Matthew 22:14 - For many are called, but few are chosen.
• John 15:16 - Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
• John 15:19 - If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.

Luke 10:42 - But one thing is needful: and Mary hath chosen that good part, which shall not be taken away from her.

I'll tell you what just came to me.

Many are called...The Sacrifice of the Cross is for all mankind. Jesus said that If I be lifted up from the Earth I will draw ALL men unto me.

Few are chosen...Only a few really accept it. Many try to get in via works, etc. Those that truely place their faith in the grace given them will be saved, they are the only ones that can be chose for the others will attempt to work their way into salvation.

I hope to flesh that out alittle more.

 

[Andry]

Let's qualify something first: chosen for what? I don't think we can get a consensus here on that. Chosen for salvation? Chosen for a specific work? And are the Biblical context for those Scriptures comparable that they are meaning the same thing? Are you wanting to discuss "remnant theology"?

I believe at the end of it all, there will be more people in heaven than in hell.

 

[riverpastor]

Andry, how do you qualify the vagueness of the scripture. You're right, probably not going to be a consensus on WHAT we are chosen for.

This is my point exactly. That there is no consensus. What does being chosen mean to you? And to everyone else? And apply the questions to your meaning.

 

[Trish1947]

I always thought that the many called, is the work of the Holy Spirit calling those to salvation. The few are chosen was the laborors. He always said that there wasn't enough laborors.

 

[Hisgirl]

I've always thought 'chosen' referred to the Lord using the person as a shepherd in a major way. The people I think of as 'chosen' would be those kind of picked like a flower for a specific task. Like Mary and Paul and Moses. Looking at it that way, I would also consider Billy Graham as chosen....among many others whom we don't know by name.

Last winter, as I sat on my sofa, the Lord started telling me about my 15-year-old daughter's life. What was about to happen, and what would happen over the next five years, in general terms. Then the following day, as I walked up the stairs, I heard the words,"She has been CHOSEN." Within two months, my pop-culture following shy daughter turned into someone I almost didn't recogize.....a leader amongst her peers, outspoken for the Lord, telling her lost friends about Jesus, desiring to go on missions, worshipping the Lord corporately four times a week....The first part of the prophecy in very specific terms has already occured to the minute detail...just as the Lord said....and I'm just sitting back and watching the rest.

So for me, I'm living the question of,"What does chosen mean?"

 

[riverpastor]

That is fantastic! Are we all, though, destined for something greater than what we are now?

I mean, Jesus is the Risen One inside each of us as believers.

 

[Hisgirl]

And by the way....RP....it's great to see you again!

 

[riverpastor]

BTW, ty D (Hg).

 

[Asaph]

That is fantastic! Are we all, though, destined for something greater than what we are now?

I mean, Jesus is the Risen One inside each of us as believers.

Wow RP. You're going to need to define "greater" there. If you mean to a calling with a wider influence, such as pastor like you and so many others here, didn't Paul say that you guys do that because you have to and not really because you want to? (serious paraphrase there )

Asaph

 

[Synesthesia]

I tend to lean towards the same meaning as Sean. I believe it is speaking of accepting the Gospel. There is the usual debate of God being a fair God, and what about people in other countries that never hear the Gospel...but 2 things come to mind.

First off, in that it is another country, we have no idea what goes on there. I believe God meets everyone where they are, at His time, so every man is without excuse. Who knows, maybe someone is visited by an angel or vision right before they die. But I believe that every man will be given the chance to choose to repent, realize that they have done wrong, and accept the Lord. This has to do (IMO) with many being called...some people can go to church and hear a message, and because the Holy Spirit hasn't moved on them or pricked their heart, but when He does, it will be up to them. They have to accept it on their own.

Second, Paul talks about people that know the LAW will be judge accordingly, but those that have never heard it, God deals with them accodingly as well. So, to recap, I believe it deals with God's call to men individually, His grace, and man's acceptance.




Ian

 

[Christian Dude]

I think the scriptures are basically saying that many will accept His price of salvation, but will become so comfortable that they don't want to go any further into the veil of the Spirit.

Hence the term "few are chosen" is a result of either so many forcing works upon themselves to be prideful, to have a title, and/or without doing this whole-heartedly and to the best of their abilities.

Works, as a matter of fact, are a result of the true faith. Whereas some people "mimic" others and try to be holy on their own which is entirely impossible.

I think God knows a person's heart, but that if you look deep enough as a Christian, is their faith being put into the works and even though they seem good are the fruits that are bore good, or are they bittersweet?

 

[Andry]

Andry, how do you qualify the vagueness of the scripture. You're right, probably not going to be a consensus on WHAT we are chosen for.

This is my point exactly. That there is no consensus. What does being chosen mean to you? And to everyone else? And apply the questions to your meaning.

Good to hear from you again RP.

If we note in Scripture, almost always God used only a few to do his work. Gideon is a good example of many. And it's to point out so that God get's the glory and not man. But the masses benefited.

I think it remains true today, in advancing the kingdom so that the gates of hell cannot prevent us from advancing, only a few have taken up this mantle (or chosen, more specifically). But the rest of the church will benefit also.

But of course it should not leave those of us who may be the masses to just sit around and do nothing (like a third string punter on a SuperBowl champion tema - he gets the championship ring too). It should be all of our hope and prayer that there is a sense of dynamic within us to do greater and greater things in the kingdom so that we too may be chosen.

 

[Asaph]

Good to hear from you again RP.

If we note in Scripture, almost always God used only a few to do his work. Gideon is a good example of many. And it's to point out so that God get's the glory and not man. But the masses benefited.

I think it remains true today, in advancing the kingdom so that the gates of hell cannot prevent us from advancing, only a few have taken up this mantle (or chosen, more specifically). But the rest of the church will benefit also.

But of course it should not leave those of us who may be the masses to just sit around and do nothing (like a third string punter on a SuperBowl champion tema - he gets the championship ring too). It should be all of our hope and prayer that there is a sense of dynamic within us to do greater and greater things in the kingdom so that we too may be chosen.

I disagree here some Andry. What you are saying sounds like being chosen is something you do, or at the very least, something you accept. The clear meaning of the word would suggest to me that neither one of those apply. Being chosen is something outside of your purview. It is something done to you, not something you have done to yourself.

That being said, being chosen is also not some kind of pink cloud, flowers and puppy dogs, kind of walk. Look at those whom we know God did chose. Their lives were generally not to be envied because of it. Maybe just sitting in a pew is not so bad after all.

Asaph

 

[Christian Dude]

I agree Asaph... Look at Elijah... and more or less Moses. Moses was definitely not an eloquent speaker, yet God called him to lead the Israelites out of Egypt.

It's kind of like what I learned in Human Services Relationships & Developments... A chosen role *you choosing* is something that you chose. You choose to accept Christ, yet Christ accepted you long before. Therefore you choose to be a Christian. BUT when it comes to a given role... *calling* God has predestined you for what you will be doing. So it is definitely not something we can take unless God gives it to us.

 

[brother daniel]

This is a good start. What we are talking about here is discipleship.
Discipleship is a very narrow walk. Those who choose to prefer the WORD OF GOD and to walk it are chosen.
Luke 10:42 - But one thing is needful: and Mary hath chosen that good part, which shall not be taken away from her.
Martha was busy doing good works and she was troubled that her sister "Lazy Mary"
as sitting around doing nothing but listening to Jesus.
Its important to see that Jesus did not instruct us to go around doing good deeds.
Thats expected by God and the world as loving conduct and it is, but it is not what Jesus is talking about. All our good works do not save us or anybody else.
We are saved by faith in Jesus and we receave that faith by hearing the word of God.
calling us to discipleship.
A disciple of Jesus is called like Mary, and chooses to heed that call. She dropped everything to listen to the word of God even though it displeased her sister who could have been sitting and listening to Jesus herself.
And we know from other scriptures that Mary and other women provided for Jesus and his disciples out of their own sustanence.
John the disciple and apostle of Jesus whom Jesus openly loved quotes Jesus as saying,
John 15:16 - Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
John 15:19 - If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
Jesus is speaking to all his disciples, not just 12 apostles. They have all already quite their jobs to follow Jesus and do what he commands.

Matthew 20:16 - So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.
Matthew 22:14 - For many are called, but few are chosen.
So who is chosen? Those who love THE WORD OF GOD more than a wife, children, lands,wealth, reputation friends and their own lives . The chosen are those who follow the LAMB OF GOD wherever he goes. The chosen are they who are about OUR FATHERS BUSINESS,
Preaching, teaching and supporting one another as they go.

 

[Andyman_1970]

Let's put these in their context:

[*]John 15:16 - Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Jesus (a Jewish rabbi) is speaking to His disciples. Keep in mind only one other rabbi in all of history who ever called disciples (vs. having a disciple "apply" to the rabbi) other than Jesus (the Jews agree to this BTW) that was rabbi Hillel. The significance of the passage is that Jesus is reminding them that He called them (He thinks they can do what a disciple does), they didn't come ask Him to be His disciple.........it's not Jesus saying He's a Calvinist..........LOL. The same goes for v19 in that chapter.

Luke 10:42 - But one thing is needful: and Mary hath chosen that good part, which shall not be taken away from her.

When you wanted to be a rabbi's disciple you would sit at the rabbi's feet, that was your way of indicating your desire to be a disciple. So what did Mary chose? She chose to sit at Jesus' feet and let Him know she wants to be His disciple, Jesus affirms this and indicates the fact that she is a disciple will not be taken away from her.

That's the context from the 1st century Jewish perspective.

 

[Andry]

I disagree here some Andry. What you are saying sounds like being chosen is something you do, or at the very least, something you accept. The clear meaning of the word would suggest to me that neither one of those apply. Being chosen is something outside of your purview. It is something done to you, not something you have done to yourself.

That being said, being chosen is also not some kind of pink cloud, flowers and puppy dogs, kind of walk. Look at those whom we know God did chose. Their lives were generally not to be envied because of it. Maybe just sitting in a pew is not so bad after all.

Asaph

I completely understand and agree. Lordy lordy....the people that God chose and used more often than not had to be dragged and pursued, leaving heel marks on the ground. Moses is a great example, Jonah another. It's not a thing to be envied, at least from the natural perspective.

As far as something we do or accept....well, doing nothing in our lives accept being saved, the 'our four and no more' mentality or 'I'll fly away to glory' syndrome....well, there's more to our lives than just that. Whether we are specifically 'chosen' or not, each has a role in the body, no matter how small or inconsequential it might seem to us in the natural.

 

[Trish1947]

Asaph... completely understand and agree. Lordy lordy....the people that God chose and used more often than not had to be dragged and pursued, leaving heel marks on the ground. Moses is a great example, Jonah another. It's not a thing to be envied, at least from the natural perspective.

You know, this is so true. I have to admit, some of the greatest things God has done, is when basicly I was kicking and screaming, and leaving my heel marks in the sand. So we have nothing to do with it, when He insists.. LOL.

 

[Asaph]

Let's put these in their context:



Jesus (a Jewish rabbi) is speaking to His disciples. Keep in mind only one other rabbi in all of history who ever called disciples (vs. having a disciple "apply" to the rabbi) other than Jesus (the Jews agree to this BTW) that was rabbi Hillel. The significance of the passage is that Jesus is reminding them that He called them (He thinks they can do what a disciple does), they didn't come ask Him to be His disciple.........it's not Jesus saying He's a Calvinist..........LOL. The same goes for v19 in that chapter.

But that is exactly how it happened to me in the 20th century. Perhaps Calvin was closer to the truth than you allow. Jesus did go and get some of His disciples.

When you wanted to be a rabbi's disciple you would sit at the rabbi's feet, that was your way of indicating your desire to be a disciple. So what did Mary chose? She chose to sit at Jesus' feet and let Him know she wants to be His disciple, Jesus affirms this and indicates the fact that she is a disciple will not be taken away from her.

That's the context from the 1st century Jewish perspective.

This is not to say that Jesus had not chosen her before this. He was familiar with the family apparently. Perhaps she had been reluctant to submit before this? Perhaps the "horse" is always God's sovreign choice, and our obedient submission is the "cart"? The cart is after all yoked to the horse.

Asaph