Manipulating the truth?

[Akmauser]

As said in title, not trying to step on any toes here but I'm not afraid too.

Watching some posts lately and even having been involved with some along with listening / paying attention to others in the body of Christ, I've come to the conclusion that there is allot of misrepresentation involving the word.

What I'm getting at here is people are not wanting to be held accountable, even us Christians. The truth is straight forward and in our face, yet the body is suffering from bad logic. Humanistic logic not Gods word.

We (talking about the body as whole) since we should be accountable for each other and help cultivate a firm foundation.

trying to come up with a good example, and actually it is very easy but I do not want to start a war. Let's just say that Gods word says one thing and is very clear, yet we want to interrupt from Gods word into our own. To make if fit our logic and what we want to believe.

Here is a debate that I am talking with my best friend over: When we die, we die, we are in an eternal sleep till the second coming. Then we will be risen and judged. If we are sent to heaven or hell right way after death, what reason would there be for Christs second coming? It would null and void and there would be no meaning behind Christ coming in the first place...or the second for that matter.

Yet people refuse to believe this and typically are in complete denial. Most want to have that faith for when they die or a loved one they are with God or will be seen again shortly.


That is an example, something we have been in deep discussion for years over.

This is just something that has been bothering me, up above is not me trying to convince any of you.

Again it is a mere example for this post as there are thousands of issues at hand.

Not looking to debate death just the manipulation in Gods word from our human logic.

 

[CherubRam]

Manipulation of Christ words was taking place before he was even hung on a stake. Many Christians hold to Pagan and Gnostic beliefs without even knowing that they do. Christ and his disciples were Orthodox Jews before the New Covenant. That should be a clue to anyone who is able to apply logical deduction. If what is said or taught in the New Testament disagrees with Orthodox Judaism, then most likely it is a falsehood.

Pope Gregory and Paganism.
The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.”
Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well.
Pope Gregory 540 – 12 March 604.

What were the Pagan beliefs harmonized with Christianity? Maybe the answer can be found by comparing Orthodox Judaism to Paganism.

The Papacy canonized the New Testament. Think people, think!

Daniel 8:12
Because of rebellion, the LORD’s people and the daily sacrifice were given over to it. It prospered in everything it did, and (truth / Scriptural truth) was thrown to the ground.

What do Pagans and Gnostics believe and do?

 

[someguy14]

Manipulating the truth?

Aint possible. One is certainly free to try. The fire greets those against God(truth).

 

[PROPHECYKID]

As said in title, not trying to step on any toes here but I'm not afraid too.

Watching some posts lately and even having been involved with some along with listening / paying attention to others in the body of Christ, I've come to the conclusion that there is allot of misrepresentation involving the word.

What I'm getting at here is people are not wanting to be held accountable, even us Christians. The truth is straight forward and in our face, yet the body is suffering from bad logic. Humanistic logic not Gods word.

We (talking about the body as whole) since we should be accountable for each other and help cultivate a firm foundation.

trying to come up with a good example, and actually it is very easy but I do not want to start a war. Let's just say that Gods word says one thing and is very clear, yet we want to interrupt from Gods word into our own. To make if fit our logic and what we want to believe.

Here is a debate that I am talking with my best friend over: When we die, we die, we are in an eternal sleep till the second coming. Then we will be risen and judged. If we are sent to heaven or hell right way after death, what reason would there be for Christs second coming? It would null and void and there would be no meaning behind Christ coming in the first place...or the second for that matter.

Yet people refuse to believe this and typically are in complete denial. Most want to have that faith for when they die or a loved one they are with God or will be seen again shortly.


That is an example, something we have been in deep discussion for years over.

This is just something that has been bothering me, up above is not me trying to convince any of you.

Again it is a mere example for this post as there are thousands of issues at hand.

Not looking to debate death just the manipulation in Gods word from our human logic.

Agreed!!

 

[food4thought]

Sorry... I just have to point out that Paul said to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Also, he mentioned not desiring to be unclouthed, but desiring to be further clothed, which indicates the possibility of being unclothed. Also, there is that passage in Revelation that speaks of the souls of the martyrs in heaven being told to wait until the full number of them was filled. There are probably more, but these were what came to mind: instances in the NT that support the view that we go to be with Jesus in heaven at death, and at the rapture/2nd coming (depending on your eschatology) we are given our eternal bodies.

I don't believe that I am misrepresenting God's word... I would agree that there is quite a bit of that going on though, but perhaps you just chose a poor example where full counsel of the Scripture does not give us an extremely clear understanding, but is left to us to interpret because it is not central to salvation.

JMO

 

[iaworkshop]

i met many christian that quote bible.. yet gambling weekly in casino... yet selling things that are not valuable to people or end up people hurt or losing money.. an yet praise jesus..
its disgusting...

 

[Akmauser]

Sorry... I just have to point out that Paul said to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Also, he mentioned not desiring to be unclouthed, but desiring to be further clothed, which indicates the possibility of being unclothed. Also, there is that passage in Revelation that speaks of the souls of the martyrs in heaven being told to wait until the full number of them was filled. There are probably more, but these were what came to mind: instances in the NT that support the view that we go to be with Jesus in heaven at death, and at the rapture/2nd coming (depending on your eschatology) we are given our eternal bodies.

I don't believe that I am misrepresenting God's word... I would agree that there is quite a bit of that going on though, but perhaps you just chose a poor example where full counsel of the Scripture does not give us an extremely clear understanding, but is left to us to interpret because it is not central to salvation.

JMO

Again not looking for a debate on this subject as I could throw something out there as well nor in anyway did I state my stance only something going on between me and my best friend.


This is a perfect example, something that is debated in and out of church. It is nearly split down the middle.

I could even come back with these scriptures.

Psalm 6:5 - For in death there is no remembrance of thee: in the grave who shall give thee thanks?

Psalm 146:4 - His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Ecclesiastes 9:5,6 & 10 - Although those can be argued that God is talking about unsaved with that one. I have heard both sides with these verses.

Psalm 16:10 - After reading do research on what grave actually translates into Greek / Hebrew.

Psalm 49:15 - Are we talking about the second coming at this point?

Again I will not state my view as I am on the fence but this is an example of an argument that is on going among brothers and sisters.

This is also scripture that 9/10 churches seem to avoid as if telling the truth and possibly taking away some hope into seeing their loved ones is ripping their faith away and bodies from the pews.

I know my churches stance.

Once again this is not an attack on you and your beliefs just an example in manipulating scripture into something that it is not. Taking an idea that most can agree with (heaven) for example and giving possible false hope.

Personally I am fine with both views, I know that God has my back And that is all that matters to me, I am seeking further self edification, I want my relationship to be about me and my savior. The ability to answer any questions truthfully and honestly know that I am right with what God has intended.

There is allot more scripture I am sure.

 

[LadyOfMystery]

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