Male only Pastors

[Daniel C]

This is the Biblical criteria for a pastor defined by the Apostle Paul:



1 Timothy 3:1-7
1This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.



And again to Titus:

6 If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
8 But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Yes...

 

[Aussie Pete]

This is the Biblical criteria for a pastor defined by the Apostle Paul:



1 Timothy 3:1-7
1This is a true saying, if a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;
4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;
5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)
6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.
7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.



And again to Titus:

6 If any be blameless, the husband of one wife, having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;
8 But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;
9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

Apart from the fact that elders (bishops) are not necessarily pastors, I agree wholeheartedly. The role of pastor is way overstated in the modern church.

 

[Albion]

Apart from the fact that elders (bishops) are not necessarily pastors, I agree wholeheartedly.

But a bishop has first been a priest/presbyter/minister (which is what "pastor" amounts to when people speak of ithis). Indeed, the bishop virtually always continues to exercise the functions of a priest.

 

[Aussie Pete]

But a bishop has first been a priest/presbyter/minister (which is what "pastor" amounts to when people speak of ithis). Indeed, the bishop virtually always continues to exercise the functions of a priest.

Maybe in the Anglican church. The word translated bishop is translated "overseer" or "elder" in some translations. My understanding is that the elder/overseer/bishop (take your pick) refers to the local church. The various denominational structures did not exist. Paul decried the movement towards cliques within the church of Corinth.

The problem with the "Pastor does everything" model is that it is broken. That's why pastor burn out is a thing. Elders should be apt to teach. Not much scope for that in most churches. Elders should be able to encourage believers and counsel them wisely. Most pastors I've known are so possessive that they will not allow others to help them out. It creates a personality cult following instead of pure devotion to Christ. It overloads the few instead of sharing the burden. It breeds passivity in the congregation. Christians are inclined to contract out their spiritual lives to the paid professionals. It is exactly the opposite of what the leadership should be doing.

Ephesians 4 tells us what the role of leadership is. It is not to live the believer's life for him.

 

[Albion]

Maybe in the Anglican church. The word translated bishop is translated "overseer" or "elder" in some translations. My understanding is that the elder/overseer/bishop (take your pick) refers to the local church.

In the very early church, the bishop was an elder who was picked to be in charge of a number of congregations, not just one. So the historic pattern is essentially that which the Anglican, Catholic, Orthodox, some Lutherans, and even the Methodists have preserved. On the other hand, you are correct that some evangelical churches have resurrected the term for use as you noted. My impression is that these are relatively few, however.

 

[Carl Emerson]

If the OP doesn't mind I would like to ask a question on this matter.

Do folks think the 'husband of one wife' means...

- not being presently married to more than one wife
- not being in a second marriage for any reason
- either of the above

In other words was Paul simply addressing the customary practice of polygamy or was he outlawing second marriage - period?

 

[Radagast]

But a bishop has first been a priest/presbyter/minister (which is what "pastor" amounts to when people speak of ithis). Indeed, the bishop virtually always continues to exercise the functions of a priest.

Outside the Anglican church, it's complicated. Possible views are:

1. The minister is an "episcopos." The elders are "presbyteroi." This view survives in the Dutch title "dominee" for a minister (from the Latin for "my lord"). It also explains why ministers need to be ordained by the "laying on of hands" by other ministers.

2. The minister is an "episcopos" and a "presbyteros." The elders are merely "sundry governing officials." This is the original Presbyterian view.

3. The ministers and elders are all both "episcopoi" and "presbyteroi." That is, the ministers are just elders who teach. The language used here is often RE = Ruling Elder and TE = Teaching Elder.

In the very early church, the bishop was an elder who was picked to be in charge of a number of congregations, not just one.

That's not consistent with what I've read.

 

[Radagast]

Do folks think the 'husband of one wife' means...

- not being presently married to more than one wife
- not being in a second marriage for any reason
- either of the above

None of the above. Paul actually says that the overseer should be μιᾶς γυναικὸς ἄνδρα (mias gunaikos andra). Literally that means "a one-woman man." In informal English, that's perfectly comprehensible. It rules out two wives at the same time, and it rules out wife + girlfriend, and it rules out wife + prostitute, but it doesn't rule out a widower remarrying.

In fact, marriage, as such, isn't mentioned at all. The emphasis is on being faithful (to one woman).

 

[Carl Emerson]

None of the above. Paul actually says that the overseer should be μιᾶς γυναικὸς ἄνδρα (mias gunaikos andra). Literally that means "a one-woman man." In informal English, that's perfectly comprehensible. It rules out two wives at the same time, and it rules out wife + girlfriend, and it rules out wife + prostitute, but it doesn't rule out a widower remarrying.

In fact, marriage, as such, isn't mentioned at all. The emphasis is on being faithful (to one woman).

So it doesn't rule out a divorcee?

 

[Radagast]

So it doesn't rule out a divorcee?

That seems like a grey zone to me. Some people say "yes," and others "no." It all hinges on whether you think he's "still really married to her."

 

[Carl Emerson]

That seems like a grey zone to me. Some people say "yes," and others "no." It all hinges on whether you think he's "still really married to her."

Even if she is a non-believer and lives with someone else and instigated the divorce?

 

[Radagast]

Even if she is a non-believer and lives with someone else and instigated the divorce?

Most Christians would say "yes" in that case. After all, in that case, she is no longer "his woman."

Then again, one might ask: if a man cannot pastor his wife, how can he pastor a church? (1 Timothy 3:5)

 

[Carl Emerson]

Most Christians would say "yes" in that case. After all, in that case, she is no longer "his woman."

Then again, one might ask: if a man cannot pastor his wife, how can he pastor a church? (1 Timothy 3:5)

Well this one has been re married 35 years with 5 Children. plenty of track record there...

 

[Radagast]

Well this one has been re married 35 years with 5 Children. plenty of track record there...

Ah. I wondered if you were somehow taking it all personally.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Ah. I wondered if you were somehow taking it all personally.

Yes, today a brother refused to fellowship with me sighting this issue.

 

[Aussie Pete]

If the OP doesn't mind I would like to ask a question on this matter.

Do folks think the 'husband of one wife' means...

- not being presently married to more than one wife
- not being in a second marriage for any reason
- either of the above

In other words was Paul simply addressing the customary practice of polygamy or was he outlawing second marriage - period?

I believe that Paul was saying that polygamy disqualified an individual, not that a second marriage was a deal breaker. The finest Christian man I ever met was married three times. The last marriage endured until he passed away. I owe an enormous debt to my late brother in Christ. The Lord used him to encourage, teach, correct and exhort me for around 30 years.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Yes, today a brother refused to fellowship with me sighting this issue.

Not much of a brother, but I know what you mean. I was given the third degree by the elders of a church I went to because I was divorced. It was not long after the event and I was still in pain from it. They went to great lengths to assure me that I was unqualified for leadership in their denomination. It was in some ways laughable. I had no intention of seeking a position or even becoming a member. It was probably the least edifying and least helpful advice I've ever received. Some years later, that assembly fell apart and they no longer exist a as fellowship.

 

[Radagast]

Yes, today a brother refused to fellowship with me sighting this issue.

 

[Albion]

That's not consistent with what I've read.

Actually, it's pretty well established, so I'm surprised to have anyone say that they've read something to the contrary. Not unless it's a tract from some church that doesn't believe in the office or something else like that.