Making friends with unrighteous wealth? Luke 16:1-9

[public hermit]

This parable has to be one of the more confusing parables that Jesus gives.

1. For what, exactly, is the manager being commended? Is he shrewd because he ingratiated the debtors to himself? How does that apply to followers of Christ and their use of "unrighteous wealth"?

2. Is Jesus suggestion we use our wealth to receive an "eternal dwelling?" If so, how does one square that with faith and grace? Or, is there a better way to interpret the "take away" that Jesus offers?

What is your interpretation?

Luke 16:1-9
1He also said to the disciples, "There was a rich man who had a manager, and charges were brought to him that this man was wasting his possessions. 2And he called him and said to him, 'What is this that I hear about you? Turn in the account of your management, for you can no longer be manager.' 3And the manager said to himself, 'What shall I do, since my master is taking the management away from me? I am not strong enough to dig, and I am ashamed to beg. 4I have decided what to do, so that when I am removed from management, people may receive me into their houses.' 5So, summoning his master's debtors one by one, he said to the first, 'How much do you owe my master?' 6He said, 'A hundred measures of oil.' He said to him, 'Take your bill, and sit down quickly and write fifty.' 7Then he said to another, 'And how much do you owe?' He said, 'A hundred measures of wheat.' He said to him, 'Take your bill, and write eighty.' 8The master commended the dishonest manager for his shrewdness. For the sons of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own generation than the sons of light. 9And I tell you, make friends for yourselves by means of unrighteous wealth, so that when it fails they may receive you into the eternal dwellings. (ESV)

 

[Sabertooth]

The gist that I got was that we were supposed to be opportunistic in our evangelism, along the same lines as Matthew 10:16.

 

[Josheb]

This parable has to be one of the more confusing parables that Jesus gives.

1. For what, exactly, is the manager being commended? Is he shrewd because he ingratiated the debtors to himself? How does that apply to followers of Christ and their use of "unrighteous wealth"?

2. Is Jesus suggestion we use our wealth to receive an "eternal dwelling?" If so, how does one square that with faith and grace? Or, is there a better way to interpret the "take away" that Jesus offers?

What is your interpretation?

Luke 16:1-9
1He also said to the disciples, "There was a rich man who had a manager, and charges were brought to him that this man was wasting his possessions. 2And he called him and said to him, 'What is this that I hear about you? Turn in the account of your management, for you can no longer be manager.' 3And the manager said to himself, 'What shall I do, since my master is taking the management away from me? I am not strong enough to dig, and I am ashamed to beg. 4I have decided what to do, so that when I am removed from management, people may receive me into their houses.' 5So, summoning his master's debtors one by one, he said to the first, 'How much do you owe my master?' 6He said, 'A hundred measures of oil.' He said to him, 'Take your bill, and sit down quickly and write fifty.' 7Then he said to another, 'And how much do you owe?' He said, 'A hundred measures of wheat.' He said to him, 'Take your bill, and write eighty.' 8The master commended the dishonest manager for his shrewdness. For the sons of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own generation than the sons of light. 9And I tell you, make friends for yourselves by means of unrighteous wealth, so that when it fails they may receive you into the eternal dwellings. (ESV)

Good morning. I don't have time this moment to answer the questions or expound further but I'll come back to this op when I do have the time. For now I'd like you to contemplate this truth from scripture,

Romans 3:10
"There is no one righteous, not even one..."​

The only righteousness any of us have is that commuted to us by Christ.

In the interim, I'd also like to ask you the question: Why so much inquiry about wealth and belief?

 

[public hermit]

Good morning. I don't have time this moment to answer the questions or expound further but I'll come back to this op when I do have the time. For now I'd like you to contemplate this truth from scripture,

Romans 3:10
"There is no one righteous, not even one..."​

The only righteousness any of us have is that commuted to us by Christ.

In the interim, I'd also like to ask you the question: Why so much inquiry about wealth and belief?

I appreciate the time you have taken to respond. It's not that I have so many questions, myself. It was simply these were passages I was looking at, at the time. It's been awhile, so I forgot I posted these, haha. Really, I was just curious how others read them. Trying to get a sense of how the Spirit moves in others. Not many responded, so it didn't work out quite like I was hoping.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

This parable has to be one of the more confusing parables that Jesus gives.

1. For what, exactly, is the manager being commended? Is he shrewd because he ingratiated the debtors to himself? How does that apply to followers of Christ and their use of "unrighteous wealth"?

2. Is Jesus suggestion we use our wealth to receive an "eternal dwelling?" If so, how does one square that with faith and grace? Or, is there a better way to interpret the "take away" that Jesus offers?

What is your interpretation?

Luke 16:1-9
1He also said to the disciples, "There was a rich man who had a manager, and charges were brought to him that this man was wasting his possessions. 2And he called him and said to him, 'What is this that I hear about you? Turn in the account of your management, for you can no longer be manager.' 3And the manager said to himself, 'What shall I do, since my master is taking the management away from me? I am not strong enough to dig, and I am ashamed to beg. 4I have decided what to do, so that when I am removed from management, people may receive me into their houses.' 5So, summoning his master's debtors one by one, he said to the first, 'How much do you owe my master?' 6He said, 'A hundred measures of oil.' He said to him, 'Take your bill, and sit down quickly and write fifty.' 7Then he said to another, 'And how much do you owe?' He said, 'A hundred measures of wheat.' He said to him, 'Take your bill, and write eighty.' 8The master commended the dishonest manager for his shrewdness. For the sons of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own generation than the sons of light. 9And I tell you, make friends for yourselves by means of unrighteous wealth, so that when it fails they may receive you into the eternal dwellings. (ESV)

Simple really.

At that time, the "managers" would handle the financial things and then routinely "add on" their own charges - this was their pay.

Most of them, same as today, would charge a lot more than they should, and they would get away with it.

The one Jesus commended reduced HIS OWN CHARGES - that part of the bill that was HIS OWN PROFIT. Thus saving the ones paying the bill a considerable amount.
The AMOUNT DUE to the "OWNER" was given to the "OWNER", and not reduced.

 

[public hermit]

Simple really.

At that time, the "managers" would handle the financial things and then routinely "add on" their own charges - this was their pay.

Most of them, same as today, would charge a lot more than they should, and they would get away with it.

The one Jesus commended reduced HIS OWN CHARGES - that part of the bill that was HIS OWN PROFIT. Thus saving the ones paying the bill a considerable amount.
The AMOUNT DUE to the "OWNER" was given to the "OWNER", and not reduced.

That's a nice approach, and it explains why the owner commends the manager for being shrewd. I take it he saves his job?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

That's a nice approach, and it explains why the owner commends the manager for being shrewd. I take it he saves his job?

Think about it.
(I don't remember what is written in Scripture - if it was even a real person, or a parable/ advice/ example )

Didn't the manager honestly give several or many customers a savings,
hoping they would hire him if he was fired ?

He could be their manager, if they like his honesty and /or just that he saved them money.....

 

[brinny]

It is written that what the wicked are gathering for themselves will be ultimately given to God's own righteous ones, and the wicked don't even know that they themselves are gathering it for God's own people.

On a more practical note, Oskar Schindler was a Nazi businessman (although he wasn't a soldier...he was just a German businessman, and he didn't feel one way or the other about the Jews and what was happening to them..until...) who sought profit and had no qualms if it came from Hitler or his co-horts. Until God touched his heart, and this hard-nosed, womanizing businessman, began to transform his profits into rescuing the Jewish people from death, using the Nazi's money to do so (unbeknownst to them).

God can reach any one's heart, and change its direction, even leaders and kings, and the most likeliest of people. Money that was meant for evil, surely CAN be used for God's purposes, and indeed it HAS been, and can still do so now.

This comes to mind:

"You intended to harm me, but God intended it for good to accomplish what is now being done, the saving of many lives." ~Gen 50:20

"And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose." ~Rom 8:28

"the wealth of the sinner is laid up for the just." ~Pr 13:22

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

It is written that what the wicked are gathering for themselves will be ultimately given to God's own righteous ones, and the wicked don't even know that they themselves are gathering it for God's own people.

This is it seems usually used by the false prosperity gospel or similar,
since the wicked may prosper, while the righteous are imprisoned, beheaded, refused a job, refused housing, and so forth , on a daily basis.

 

[brinny]

brinny said: ↑
It is written that what the wicked are gathering for themselves will be ultimately given to God's own righteous ones, and the wicked don't even know that they themselves are gathering it for God's own people.

This is it seems usually used by the false prosperity gospel or similar,
since the wicked may prosper, while the righteous are imprisoned, beheaded, refused a job, refused housing, and so forth , on a daily basis.

You left out the Bible verses, Jeff, especially the 3rd one.

What do you believe that 3rd verse is referring to? And what do you believe that God means as it is written in His Word about God granting recompense for those who have suffered, been targeted with evil? In addition, the blood of the martyrs cries out to God for justice, asking when it will be granted. What do you believe that means?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

You left out the Bible verses, Jeff, especially the 3rd one.

What do you believe that 3rd verse is referring to?

I did not leave out any Scripture - ALL SCRIPTURE IS TRUTH.
I merely pointed out the the prosperity (false) gospel often uses that/ those verses/ to trick people.

 

[brinny]

{quote]
brinny said: ↑
You left out the Bible verses, Jeff, especially the 3rd one.

What do you believe that 3rd verse is referring to?
[/quote]

I did not leave out any Scripture - ALL SCRIPTURE IS TRUTH.
I merely pointed out the the prosperity (false) gospel often uses that/ those verses/ to trick people.

You cut off part of my post when you quoted it.

I am referring to and was referring to, what is written in God's Word, not any "man's" philosophy, etc.

The bottom line, is that our God IS a just God, and that although there may be temporary suffering, and man and his evil intents and plans may appear to be winning at every turn, that it is temporary, and that ultimately it is GOD HIMSELF Who wins, and WITH Him, His own are lifted up in due time and recompensed.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

You cut off part of my post when you quoted it.

I am referring to and was referring to, what is written in God's Word, not any "man's" philosophy, etc.

The bottom line, is that our God IS a just God, and that although there may be temporary suffering, and man and his evil intents and plans may appear to be winning at every turn, that it is temporary, and that ultimately it is GOD HIMSELF Who wins, and WITH Him, His own are lifted up in due time and recompensed.

I quoted the part I wanted to quote and to reply to.
As you note now, in this post, the things the wicked save up are not going to be ours in this life necessarily , but "ultimately" (or rather better- what God has in store for us - MUCH MORE than all the wicked have all together !) , (thankfully you posted this!) it is a relief !

 

[Josheb]

I appreciate the time you have taken to respond. It's not that I have so many questions, myself. It was simply these were passages I was looking at, at the time. It's been awhile, so I forgot I posted these, haha. Really, I was just curious how others read them. Trying to get a sense of how the Spirit moves in others. Not many responded, so it didn't work out quite like I was hoping.

Since I see you've read my response to your op on giving away our possessions and deemed it informative I'll assume you also now understand 1) how the passage in question in this op should be treated and 2) neither wealth nor privilege are inherently antithetical to being Christian but 3) both can definitely be idolatrous.

 

[brinny]

I quoted the part I wanted to quote and to reply to.
As you note now, in this post, the things the wicked save up are not going to be ours in this life necessarily , but "ultimately", (thankfully you posted this!) it is a relief !

Leaving out BIBLE Verses? THAT is what it's all about, isn't it? Isn't THAT where our wisdom, discernment and discretion is rooted in?

The Bible verses tied up all that i posted in a pretty bow, making sense of it, in a BIBLICAL sense. The issue with Oskar Schindler was in that he rescued those who were headed for death. That verse is in the book of Isaiah. He used the wealth that he accumulated from the Nazi's (unbeknownst to them) to do this. It was not to make ANYONE "rich" (even himself) but it was to do the impossible in Nazi Germany, right there where Jewish women, men, and children were being incinerated. God does this. And He uses people to do this. It has nothing to do with "man's" philosophy, etc. It is GOD moooooving as only HE can, and using a most unlikely character, like Oskar Schindler to do so.

God could care less "whose" money it is. He can use THAT very money, in the hands of the Nazi's, drug dealers, or any other evil-intentioned person and USE that very money to accomplish what He sees fit.

The bottom line, is that it never belonged to them in the first place. It is GOD'S, along with everything here on this earth.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Leaving out BIBLE Verses? THAT is what it's all about, isn't it? Isn't THAT where our wisdom, discernment and discretion is rooted in?

The Bible verses tied up all that i posted in a pretty bow, making sense of it, in a BIBLICAL sense.

It seems impractical, if not impossible, to quote the whole Bible here.
The verses you quoted , OR the ideas in your posts , that I noted, are often used by the false prosperity gospel.
That was the simple reason for my post - in case others were not aware of it and thought that the prosperity gospel was okay (it is not).

I did not even remember reading anything today about oskar? etc ....

btw, I doubt if oskar believed the prosperity gospel either, fwiw.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

2) neither wealth nor privilege are inherently antithetical to being Christian

This can easily be debated (as it is in many threads, posts and forums).

Thus, it is not automatically accepted as true, and it is rejected by some believers, for Biblical reasons, or because of what they have observed themselves in life.....

 

[brinny]

It seems impractical, if not impossible, to quote the whole Bible here.
The verses you quoted , OR the ideas in your posts , that I noted, are often used by the false prosperity gospel.
That was the simple reason for my post - in case others were not aware of it and thought that the prosperity gospel was okay (it is not).

I did not even remember reading anything today about oskar? etc ....

btw, I doubt if oskar believed the prosperity gospel either, fwiw.

Jeff, perhaps you misunderstood my post(s)? My post have to do with GOD and that EVERYTHING belongs to Him. And that God can moooove men's hearts to do something they had no intention of doing, like rescuing those headed for death, and using every cent they have to do so, and using money for instance that was originally intended for evil, to instead use it for good.

(i mentioned Oskar Schindler in one of my posts earlier)

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

QUOTE=]Jeff, perhaps you misunderstood my post(s)? My post have to do with GOD and that EVERYTHING belongs to Him. And that God can moooove men's hearts to do something they had no intention of doing, like rescuing those headed for death, and using every cent they have to do so, and using money for instance that was originally intended for evil, to instead use it for good.

(i mentioned Oskar Schindler in one of my posts earlier)[/QUOTE
====================================
THIS IS GOOD! GREAT EVEN!

 

[brinny]

THIS IS GOOD! GREAT EVEN!

LOL! Well what did you THINK i was talkin' 'bout Jeff? Sheeesh.