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Madagascar and Australia, a question for creationists.

USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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why? you cant make a prediction about your theory? its just prove my claim- evolution isnt a scientific theory.

Sorry, I'm here to have a discussion, not attend a dance.

Either poop or get off the toilet. Do you have a supposed example like you are alluding:
>> so if i will show you such a case, <<
or not?
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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There are cases of convergent gene evolution. Apo(a) is an example of the "same" gene evolving separately: Convergent evolution of apolipoprotein(a) in primates and hedgehog. That said, the sequences and path of evolution are clearly not identical.

That paper references a few other examples of convergent gene evolution.

Indeed. I'm aware that there are plenty of examples of analogous genes and genes that function similarly in different beings, but I'm not aware of any that are completely homologous, for example gene pathways for cetacean flippers and bat wings being exactly the same.
 
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pitabread

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Indeed. I'm aware that there are plenty of examples of analogous genes and genes that function similarly in different beings, but I'm not aware of any that are completely homologous, for example gene pathways for cetacean flippers and bat wings being exactly the same.

Indeed. Blatant genetic chimeras in nature would instantly turn common descent upside down, but mysteriously we never seem to find any...
 
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xianghua

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Sorry, I'm here to have a discussion, not attend a dance.

Either poop or get off the toilet. Do you have a supposed example like you are alluding:
>> so if i will show you such a case, <<
or not?
so your theory doesnt make any predictions?
 
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pat34lee

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Have you never heard the saying "we live and learn"? remember the old radios and TV's they were huge? today we have smart sleek radio's and TV's that do exactl the same thing as the old ones only much better, the basics of the radio and TV didn't change just the application, instead of valves we now use transistors and micro chips but Radio and TV were never proven to be wrong, thankfully things change as our knowledge increases and we learn more if we hadn't we would all be dead by now from influenza.

Moving from transistors to silicon chips and then to microchips were big changes in technology. Every generation, they learned to make them better and smaller and faster. Right now, they have reached a limit as to how fast you can push electricity through a circuit and how small you can make switches with current technology. What do they have that evolution doesn't? Intelligent people working toward a goal; faster, smaller computers.

As for the flu, you're better off with the advances in nutrition and vitamins than anything in medicine.
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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so your theory doesnt make any predictions?

Still dancing I see. That tells me you don't have an example and were lying when you claimed you could provide one.

I'm not surprised.
 
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xianghua

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pat34lee

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I was going to note that ironically applies to Creationism, but Creationism isn't even a theory. As far as evolution goes it's never been "proven wrong" (I think you mean falsified.)

How many times does it take?
Soft tissue. Impossible over millions of years.
The 'simple' cell. About as simple as a space shuttle or an automated city.
DNA. No information system just happens. It takes applied intelligence.
Proteins. In nature, the ratio of L to R hand is about 50:50. In living creatures, they are 100% left handed.
Mutations are incapable of causing evolution. They do not stack, and having too many cause death of sterility.
Abiogenesis.
Nothing short of gene splicing can make organisms pass the boundaries inherent in their kind.
Falsification. No matter what evidence is found, it will either be discarded or some story will be made up to incorporate it into the theory. That includes precambrian rabbits or humans in the Jurassic period. Or living T-Rex's.
CEH: Genetic Evolution Falsified
 
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xianghua

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No matter what evidence is found, it will either be discarded or some story will be made up to incorporate it into the theory. That includes precambrian rabbits or humans in the Jurassic period. Or living T-Rex's.

yep:

Tikiguania and the antiquity of squamate reptiles (lizards and snakes) | Biology Letters

""Tikiguania would have been evidence for an anomalously early (i.e. Triassic) age for what molecular studies suggest is a highly derived squamate clade (Acrodonta), implying that all major clades of squamates such as iguanians, anguimorphs, snakes, scincomorphs and gekkotans had diverged in the Triassic. However, none of these groups appear unequivocally in the fossil record until substantially later [5]. Indeed, some recent palaeontological and molecular studies of squamate divergence dates have not mentioned Tikiguania, presumably because of its problematic nature"
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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Soft tissue. Impossible over millions of years.

Nope. We've discovered we were wrong and that heme in the blood will preserve collagen. Do try and keep up.

The 'simple' cell. About as simple as a space shuttle or an automated city.

Prokaryotic cells aren't that complicated.

DNA. No information system just happens. It takes applied intelligence.

Begging the question - Wikipedia

Proteins. In nature, the ratio of L to R hand is about 50:50. In living creatures, they are 100% left handed.

The so-called chirality problem exists in the minds of Creationists only.

Mutations are incapable of causing evolution. They do not stack, and having too many cause death of sterility.

A falsehood you've been corrected on enough times to warrant my calling this a fib.

Abiogenesis.

Same here. You've been told repeatedly that origin of life has nothing to do with evolution.

Nothing short of gene splicing can make organisms pass the boundaries inherent in their kind.

You've never defined "kind" so this claim is meaningless. As far as basal organisms evolving characteristics very different from the basal form, that has been observed in the fossil and genetic record.

Falsification. No matter what evidence is found, it will either be discarded or some story will be made up to incorporate it into the theory. That includes precambrian rabbits or humans in the Jurassic period. Or living T-Rex's.

A falsehood you've been corrected on previously. As far as the part in bold, it's a great example of how Creationists simply do not understand evolution. There's nothing in evolutionary theory that demands that a lineage go extinct. So-called Lazarus taxa are not a problem for evolution, but Creationists don't understand that because they don't understand how evolution works. A living T-Rex walking down the streets of Bozeman, Montana today would be less problematic for evolution than a single T-Rex tooth in Jurassic strata.
 
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USincognito

a post by Alan Smithee
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why not? here is one:

Discovery pushes back date of first four-legged animal : Nature News

evolution predict this order: a fish--> a missing link (fishpod)--> a tetrapod. instead we find a fish--> a tetrapod-->a missing link. the wrong order.

so again we see why evolution cant make any prediction.

I thought your "example" was going to be from genetics? Did you dance around for so long that you forgot your own claim?

As far as the Polish tracks, did you even read your own link?
>> But controversy surrounds 400-million-year-old fossilized tracks. <<

It's still not clear if the tracts are from a tetrapod or not.
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10420940.2015.1063491
Further, there are no "finger" impressions in the Zachelmie "tracks" so it's hard to say exactly what type of being made the impressions. Without body fossils, the find remains controversial.

What's hilarious about your citing of these "tracks" is that if it were any other paper using provisional language Creationists would be all over the uncertainty screaming that it undermined the claim. It's a typical, dishonest modus operandi from Creationists.
 
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pitabread

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A living T-Rex walking down the streets of Bozeman, Montana today would be less problematic for evolution than a single T-Rex tooth in Jurassic strata.

And not to mention infinitely more awesome.

Now I want a pet T-rex.
 
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pitabread

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If something is found to be wrong with a particular science who works to correct that problem? scientists.

Not only that, but creationism is effectively useless beyond being used as a tool for evangelism.

The Botanical Society of America has a rather pointed statement on this:

"Creationism has not made a single contribution to agriculture, medicine, conservation, forestry, pathology, or any other applied area of biology. Creationism has yielded no classifications, no biogeographies, no underlying mechanisms, no unifying concepts with which to study organisms or life. In those few instances where predictions can be inferred from Biblical passages (e.g., groups of related organisms, migration of all animals from the resting place of the ark on Mt. Ararat to their present locations, genetic diversity derived from small founder populations, dispersal ability of organisms in direct proportion to their distance from eastern Turkey), creationism has been scientifically falsified." - Statement on Evolution, Botanical Society of America
 
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TagliatelliMonster

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No, dogma is refusing to drop a theory when it is proven wrong

Yes, you have successfully repeated what I just said: refusing to alter explanations when data shows your ideas to be wrong and/or incomplete.

Instead, they add pixie dust to make the facts and theory seem to still agree.

Right. A common incarnation of this "pixie dust" is "god-dun-it".

Throwing out data that does not match the paradigm is another way to prevent progress, and it happens all the time in archeology.

https://www.evolutionnews.org/2006/04/the_dogma_of_darwinian_evoluti/

That article doesn't say what you pretend it says.
It's just another cdesign proponentsist rant, from sources that are exposed fraudulent, dishonest liars.
 
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TagliatelliMonster

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if he eternal he dont need a designer. simple. in the other hand: we know that nature have a beginning.
No. Space-time, as we currently know it, had a beginning. Space-time isn't the same as "nature".
 
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Armoured

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And not to mention infinitely more awesome.

Now I want a pet T-rex.
park.png
 
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TagliatelliMonster

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Right now, they have reached a limit as to how fast you can push electricity through a circuit and how small you can make switches with current technology.

While I wonder how this is related to the topic, that statement is not true at all.
It certainly becomes increasingly harder to make things even smaller, but we haven't bumped into any limits yet...

What do they have that evolution doesn't? Intelligent people working toward a goal; faster, smaller computers.

Indeed. Evolution doesn't have any of that. Instead, evolution is a "blind" process with no "end goal" in mind or any "planning" or "intent".

As for the flu, you're better off with the advances in nutrition and vitamins than anything in medicine.

lol
 
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pat34lee

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Nope. We've discovered we were wrong and that heme in the blood will preserve collagen. Do try and keep up.

False. When it became necessary, a story was concocted to explain away soft tissue. It is no more a scientific explanation than 'aliens kept the fossils from completely mineralizing' by application of pixie dust.

Prokaryotic cells aren't that complicated.

Not complicated compared to what, a space shuttle?


Then this should be easy. Name one known information system that just happened and prove it.

The so-called chirality problem exists in the minds of Creationists only.

You should proof-read some of these articles for "may have" "could have" "possible" "might" "possibly", all denoting "we have no idea, so we're guessing wildly."

A falsehood you've been corrected on enough times to warrant my calling this a fib.

Sorry, but "you're wrong" doesn't prove anything. Can you prove that any organism can mutate dozens or hundreds of time in such a way as to complement the earlier mutations in order to form a new form that is functional? An example would be a non-flying animal growing wings that actually work, along with less dense bones and the types of muscles and ligaments that would be needed, not to mention the ability to perch and see like a bird.

Same here. You've been told repeatedly that origin of life has nothing to do with evolution.

Of course it does. Nothing dead is going to evolve.

But even starting just after, how did some frankenvirus live long enough to breed, much less evolve, when they were supposedly slapped together so haphazardly?

You've never defined "kind" so this claim is meaningless. As far as basal organisms evolving characteristics very different from the basal form, that has been observed in the fossil and genetic record.

Not quite. Different bones have been observed. None have been seen having offspring that were different than themselves, just as nothing living has been observed giving birth to a different type of animal. Different animals are just that; different. They don't come with paternity papers stating their lineage. Scientists have a hard time even telling juvenile from adult specimens, so how are they going to tell two different animals are related when all you have is some bones, and rarely a whole skeleton?

A falsehood you've been corrected on previously. As far as the part in bold, it's a great example of how Creationists simply do not understand evolution. There's nothing in evolutionary theory that demands that a lineage go extinct. So-called Lazarus taxa are not a problem for evolution, but Creationists don't understand that because they don't understand how evolution works. A living T-Rex walking down the streets of Bozeman, Montana today would be less problematic for evolution than a single T-Rex tooth in Jurassic strata.

Be glad I'm in a positive mood, or I'd report you for your false claim that creationists do not understand evolution, when we know it better than most evolutionists, clearly. But you have to be willing to dig past the deception and the just-so stories told as fact.

Notice you dismissed 2/3 of my examples to focus on one you thought was wrong. Yet, if dinosaurs were living anywhere today, there would be bones from the past millions of years since they supposedly died out just lying around. Not a big problem for a coelacanth possibly, but a big problem for a T-Rex or a Brontosaur. And those from the last 50,000 years or so would be testable by carbon-14 dating.[/quote][/QUOTE]
 
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