Macroevolution:

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

My problem with evolution is that I believe everything was created by an outside force, not an inside force.

Do you have to believe a theory before you can understand what it means?

That would make science pretty much impossible...

 

[Speedwell]

Beside believing that evolution is "voodoo science" accepting it means rejecting creation, and thus rejecting God.

Only if you tie creation to a literal reading of the Genesis stories. There is nothing inherent in the theory of evolution which requires the rejection of God.

 

[bhsmte]

Beside believing that evolution is "voodoo science" accepting it means rejecting creation, and thus rejecting God.

Using principles of science, what makes the TOE voodoo science?

 

[Obliquinaut]

Beside believing that evolution is "voodoo science" accepting it means rejecting creation, and thus rejecting God.

If that is your understanding of your faith I will leave it at that. I know how sensitive you get when people talk about faith things.

I am interested though, how you have constructed a "voodoo science" concept so you can lay the blame on the science so you don't have to question the faith of the many, many Christians who also believe in evolution.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Only if you tie creation to a literal reading of the Genesis stories. There is nothing inherent in the theory of evolution which requires the rejection of God.

I rejected evolution long before I got religion. I don't believe there has been enough time for evolution to successfully provide what we see around us today. Science compresses the time to an unrealistic extent. The only way it could work within a reasonable time frame is by metamorphosis; radical overnight changes. Science presents the process like a child's puzzle with a dozen or so easily fitted pieces. But if evolution were true the puzzle would be enormous, with trillions upon trillions of pieces; each piece representing a single successful process.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

If that is your understanding of your faith I will leave it at that. I know how sensitive you get when people talk about faith things.

I am interested though, how you have constructed a "voodoo science" concept so you can lay the blame on the science so you don't have to question the faith of the many, many Christians who also believe in evolution.

I have no quarrel with the belief of others.

 

[AV1611VET]

Using principles of science, what makes the TOE voodoo science?

Science claims creatio ex materia, which is how Adam was created, is magic.

Science believes people are walking around without a soul or spirit.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

And no evidence will change your desire to believe this outside source is responsible. Would the be correct?

I'm unclear why this question is phrased this way.

 

[Obliquinaut]

I have no quarrel with the belief of others.

You just said that it would be a denial of God. Ergo, you do. But if it helps you feel better about your own comments then fine. If you posts don't actually mean anything then that's another thing altogether.

 

[Obliquinaut]

I rejected evolution long before I got religion. I don't believe there has been enough time for evolution to successfully provide what we see around us today.

This we can work with.

4.5billion years is a very long time to work with. Or do you not believe the earth has been around for 4.5billion years?

But if evolution were true the puzzle would be enormous, with trillions upon trillions of pieces; each piece representing a single successful process.

There are a HUGE number of pieces. If you were to spend time actually learning geology, paleontology and biology you'd realize it. And even then it is hampered by the ability to preserve those pieces of evidence.

 

[Speedwell]

I rejected evolution long before I got religion. I don't believe there has been enough time for evolution to successfully provide what we see around us today.

Interesting--three billion years (at least) is not time enough?

But if evolution were true the puzzle would be enormous, with trillions upon trillions of pieces; each piece representing a single successful process.

Which is exactly what we observe.

 

[Obliquinaut]

Can you give an example.

Well, from my personal experience there's all the fossils in the different strata showing clearly the change in life over time.

But then there's all of these: 29+ Evidences for Macroevolution: The Scientific Case for Common Descent

 

[tevans9129]

Phylogenetic tree:

It's the thing that creationists want to pretend is fiction, yet it's the very thing that has real-world application.

There is a major gap between the reality of modern evolutionary biology and what creationists choose to believe about modern evolutionary biology.

That is interesting, do you have a graph that shows from the very beginning? I find it interesting that evolution, cosmic or biological, never seem to start at the very beginning, why is that?

 

[tevans9129]

If species on Earth were independently designed, they were designed to appear as though they share common ancestry.

I wonder why that is...

Could it be like a Ferrari and a Peterbilt? Do they share the same ancestry? Or like a Chevy and a Cadilac that even share some of the same parts? Are they similar but different?

 

[Speedwell]

That is interesting, do you have a graph that shows from the very beginning? I find it interesting that evolution, cosmic or biological, never seem to start at the very beginning, why is that?

Why should they? Science can only go back as far as the available evidence allows.

 

[tevans9129]

in the southern states of America, the extent of their scientific education is probably none at all. It can hardly be otherwise, given some of the stuff which gets posted on here.

I agree, from goo to you by way of the zoo, now that is real science.

 

[JacksBratt]

Not a complete mystery - How Does A Caterpillar Turn Into a Butterfly?

How does a Baltimore Oriole, the bird not the baseball team, know how to make a beautiful sack for a nest.... every single one of them build the same nest. No college or university, no home school and probably hasn't seen it's parents from a few days after it fledged. Yet, it builds the same nest ever single Baltimore oriole builds.

How does the monarch butterfly, that hatched in a field behind my house, know to fly to the exact same field it's mother hatched in, to lay it's eggs. And, it's eggs will hatch and fly to the field behind my house to lay their eggs??

How do any of these amazing animals know how to do the amazing things they do, generation after generation without any training..... while man cannot even build a tea pot that doesn't drip?????

Tell me that these creatures were not designed already programed just as God created them....
no blue jay version 102.0.1-5

 

[JacksBratt]

Well, from my personal experience there's all the fossils in the different strata showing clearly the change in life over time.

But then there's all of these: 29+ Evidences for Macroevolution: The Scientific Case for Common Descent

Ya.... but then there are trees.... petrified, fossilized trees...... standing straight up through your billions of years of sediment.

I don't know of any tree that would not decay in less than 10 short years, if it was underground...

Certainly not going to stand there for a million even...

And, as someone already stated, they found soft tissue of a dinosaur. Now we watch as all these "experts" in fossils and the grand delusion of billions of years, scramble to deny that it is, in fact real soft tissue, and then start the baffle-gab necessary to avoid the fact that fossils are not even 100 thousand years old.

All will be revealed.

 

[tevans9129]

I believe in micro evolution , but not macro .

I do not know of any creationist that does not believe in "microevolution", adaptive change. Neither do I know any Bible believing Christian that believes one "kind" has ever evolved into a different "kind".

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

How do any of these amazing animals know how to do the amazing things they do, generation after generation without any training..... while man cannot even build a tea pot that doesn't drip?????

Tell me that these creatures were not designed already programed just as God created them....
no blue jay version 102.0.1-5

Programmed by evolution. Their environmental niches are such that they can survive as species with relatively rigid and inflexible behaviour patterns - very economical.

We have adopted lifestyles that favour flexible, creative behaviour, with foresight and planning, which requires an understanding of how the world and society works, so we need a long period of learning and development to acquire the knowledge and understanding to function effectively in our environment.