Lying

[psychoceramic]

the issue is lying..... the situation is more than just that...so here it is......any ideas would be great


my daughter, who is Seven, lives with ther mom and her moms family and boyfriend (there are four adults and two kids, the grandma is on disablity for numerous med problems, one uncle (the oldest) is gay, the other uncle is only a year old than my daughter and gets away with murder..then my daughters mom and her bf (fifth one in the past year) are pregnant (her fifth pregnacny in the past year none carried to term) they live in a two bedroom moblie home.)

My daughter is with her mom from sunday night till thursday afternooon when my wife and i pick her up and she spend the rest fo the week with us.

well due to all the things happening in my daughters life at her moms house my daughter has become a story teller, she lies about the littlest things and about the biggest things.. she has lied to police officers and to child protective services workers.

Her mom is a (clinically diagnosed) pathological liar with numerous array of other problems. (there are numerous other things that are happening in her life, but those are the most constant things that have been around since the lying began.)


we have told our daughter (my wife and myself) that the lying must stop that she will be punished for her lying from here on out and the punishment is she will be confined to her room for the duration of her time with us. and unlike the other times when we were punished due to her spending time in her room we will hire a babysitter to watch her as we go and do what we had planned.

We have also shown he numerous bible pasaages about lying and what God thinks about it, we have told her that we can't make her stop lying but we can still punish her for it and i have even told her that she needs to worry about what God thinks and feels about lying but her judgement right now comes from Us and she need to think about that the most.

We are now praying and praying and praying and we believe God will help us handle this, and i know one way God has helped us is by having people around like christiandforums to give any advice we might need.


So thanks for your help,
if anything is unclear or you might neeed more info just ask.


In HIm,
psycho and prssyprncss

 

[selune]

We have had a similar type problem, lying about anything, the "not me" syndrome around our house. Not the full situation you are experiencing. We found that punishing our daughter when she lied and not for the infraction that she lied about was the most effective. So say she took a piece of cake without permission. It was obvious who did it and when everyone was asked she also said "not me" she got punished worse for lying about it. Next time when she did something she told the truth, and was told that she shouldn't have done the bad thing, but thank you for telling the truth even though it was hard to do, yes you get a punishment but it would have been worse if you lied too. She is learning that telling the truth is important. Are you worried that your daughter is being told to lie at her other house? Or possibly she may have adopted that as a way to tell herself things aren't so unstable. Sounds like she has a tough situation. Above all, be very expressive in your love to her. My prayers go out to you.

 

[Momzilla]

In all honesty, confining her to her room for the whole weekend seems rather harsh, and it doesn't leave you with any real opportunity to model appropriate behavior for your daughter. I'm not saying you shouldn't punish her, but I would think that taking away a favorite activity (for example, a favorite TV program) would be more appropriate.

I also think you should ask her why she lies, and try to get her to see the consequences of lying vs. telling the truth--"what do you think would have happened if you had told the truth instead of lying" in a given situation.

From what you have described, her living situation during the week is not all that great, and I think it is to be expected that a child in a situation like that will act out in various ways. In other words, I think she's trying to find ways to cope, and she sees her mother lying, so she thinks it's an appropriate coping mechanism. If that's what's going on, she needs teaching and love just as much as she needs consequences for her behavior.

Good luck, and God bless.

 

[Tangnefedd]

I am most concerned about this child, not because she is lying poor little girl but the reasons why she is lying, if she is. Your way of handling it seems abusive imo. You are frightening her with God, that is WRONG. This little girl needs love and attention not punishment. She probably needs a therapist too, it sounds as if she is going through hell, the hell the adults in her life are putting her through. Please think what you are doing to this child, it doesn't sound right if the way you have explained it is true. If I sound harsh it is becuase I am very worried about your little girl!!!

 

[jenptcfan]

It's one thing to send a child to bed early for punishment, or send her to her room to think about what she's done wrong for a short period of time. It's another thing to confine her in her room for an entire weekend. I think that's a little much.

If the child's mother is a pathological liar, and your child is around her mother all the time...is it possible that your child doesn't even know the difference between the truth and a lie anymore? It could be that she's just really confused about how to tell the difference between a lie and the truth since she is in the living situation she's currently in.

I also believe that pathological lying is a type of mental disorder. You can punish someone over and over for having a mental disorder, but it won't make it go away. If your daughter has inherited this disorder from her mother, she may need some counselling/psychiatric attention.

 

[Rogue]

I also think you should ask her why she lies, and try to get her to see the consequences of lying vs. telling the truth--"what do you think would have happened if you had told the truth instead of lying" in a given situation.

You took the words right out of my mouth. Children at this age (I'd say 5 and up) need to begin to learn the consequences for their actions and words. You should DEFINATLY ask her why she is lying, even though she will most likely say she doesn't know. Be persistant. Give her a situation where she can understand that lying hurts... by that I mean teach her how to put herself in someone elses situation by saying something like "I know you wouldn't like it if someone lied to you, would you?" or "How do you think you would feel if Mommy or Daddy said >insert "lie" here<?" The key here is to support her. No matter what, let her know that you're not mad at her for it, you just want to help her make better decisions.
Other than that, pray. and pray hard. I used to be a liar when I was young (my background was vastly different though... I lied out of fear.) and I remember praying with my mom and dad for god to forgive me for lying. But you can't force her to do anything, she needs to know that it's her decision.

 

[psychoceramic]

Thank you all so much for your input.....

every one had something to say that hit me in the heart.....

to put some minds at ease.. we have not ever confined her to her room for the entire weekend.... and we wish not to do such a thing. my heart would break knowing she was in her room and we were out doing something that the family wanted to do together.

Tangnefedd
we are not trying to scare our daughter with GOD. Our daughter loves the LORD with all her heart.. she sings about His love and Glorifies His name constantly. We just told her and showed her from the word How GOD feels about poeeple who lie. i will reexamine what and how often we tell her this and see if we are "putting the fear of GOD into her."

Selune and momzilla.....
thanks you so much for your words and prayers.... i can see that it would be harsh to lock her up for the weekend... and i see that there are other ways to try and deal with this situation. we have never thought about her "lying" as a way to cope......(and i barely scratched the surface.. about her home life with her mom i didnt want it to seem unreal to anyone) with her home life....at her moms....

jenptcfan
i have tried to get her counselling on a number of things and numerous times.... but even though we have half time with her...since i am not the custodial parent i am unable to get her counseling. and her mom refuses to get her counseling....


Rogue

we have done than several times... to no avail. she says she understands it is wrong but keeps doing it. she says she would hate for us to do it to her.. but she keeps lying.
we continue to pray for an end or answer to this and to the whole thing.



Thnaks again for your time and words... i take them all to heart and to mind.

in JESUS,
psycho and prssyprncss

 

[Tangnefedd]

I think, as I said that you daughter needs therapy, not condemnation. Most kids of that age tell lies anyway, and while it is not to be encouraged, it is probably best ignored in most children. In your daughter's case it could well be a cry for help!

 

[Crofter]

We have also shown he numerous bible pasaages about lying and what God thinks about it, we have told her that we can't make her stop lying but we can still punish her for it

The Bible is refering to adults who understand what a lie is and so do this deliberately as a act of deception.


Your child is a child who is making up stories... this is normal... and is not simply telling lies. This is the age they learn to understand the difference between what is truth and what is not and why this concept matters. But the severity is not normal but please see that when the world she lives in makes no sence then what is a lie and what is truth...?

You are punishing her for being in the unbearable situation she is in... by doing that you are only causing more strife and confusion and more of a need to escape reality.

So if you can not get help you will need to work this out. Playing games is a good way... And often keeping a diary to help you see more clearly what is actually happening and is a highly useful tool for a psycologist if you find a referal is neded in the future.

 

[Tangnefedd]

You say that she has lied to police officers and child protection workers. Many kids lie with good reason to these people, because they are AFRAID of the consequences of telling the truth.

I don't think God will condemn your daughter, if he is the loving God he is supposed to be, he will have the utmost compassion for her, but maybe not quite as much for the adults who have put the poor little mite in this terrible situation!

 

[HeatherJay]

Poor little girl. I agree with much of what the other's have said. I have a 5 year old and we're going through some minor problems with lying, too.

This definitely sounds more like a coping mechanism than just a stage she's going through. She sounds as though she has a very unstable homelife with her mother...and going back and forth between parents is always somewhat stressful for children.

I think the thing you need to make sure that you express to her is that you love her unconditionally and that nothing she could ever do (break something, make a mess, tell a lie, etc.) will ever make you stop loving her. It sounds so obvious, but it's not obvious to a child. Children need to have constant reassurance (in words AND deeds) that they're loved and treasured. I have no doubt that you love your daughter, but make sure that she knows that nothing will ever make you stop.

I started making it a point to reassure my little ones of how much I love them, no matter how angry I might get. I tell them that even though I might get upset with them, that I never love them any less. And that I love them more than anything else in the world...no matter what. My daughter has stopped telling stories to cover up her mistakes...lol, well most of the time. But, I do find that she's so much quicker to tell me the truth, especially since she feels reassured that nothing could ever be bad enough for me to stop loving her. I know it's made a difference to her because now, after we get done with her punishment and our hugs, she says to me, "And I know that you always love me, no matter what." And I tickle her and say, "That's right...no matter what." I feel so much closer to her since I started reassuring her of my love even when she's made a mistake.

Like I said, it seems to us (as adults) that it should be obvious that we love our kids...but to a little girl (especially in such an unstable situation), her parents are her whole world, and when they're angry at her, it must truly seem like there's no way they can love her. Kids really see themselves through OUR (their parent's) eyes. It's so important to leave no doubt in her mind that nothing she could ever do will make you stop loving her.

I'm not sure if this will help or not. I hope that it does.

Love, Heather

 

[Crofter]

I started making it a point to reassure my little ones of how much I love them, no matter how angry I might get. I tell them that even though I might get upset with them, that I never love them any less. And that I love them more than anything else in the world...no matter what.

Very good! You can not tell them enough! And having their picture up on the walls and their paintings and so on! Love, love, love! Kids just can't get too much of it! It never runs out and it's free! Wow! Isn't that amazing too!

 

[Mary_Magdalene]

first, get her out of her mothers house and get custody.

second, deal with her issues - which living in a house like what you describe, im sure she has.

if the mom wont agree to therapy, go to court and get it mandated.

you are her father and have rights.