Lust

[emilylauren]

So just a general question-- what is the biblical definition of lust? When does it go from just "thinking someone is attractive" or even being physically attracted to someone to lusting after them.

What about couples? How do you differentiate between loving that person and feeling physically attracted to them and lusting. Would feeling sexually attracted to someone you were dating be wrong in and of itself, or only when you indulge those thoughts/feelings or act on them?

 

[K9_Trainer]

IMO, attraction and desire are normal, but they cross the line when it becomes an obsession. It shouldn't interfere with your life and it shouldn't be the dominant thing you think about when you see or think about that person.

As for love vs lust, lust is a feeling, love is a choice.

 

[TertiusC]

Hi Emily.

In my opinion, thinking about other people when you're in a relationship or married etc. is wrong. If you're attracted to someone then you need to stay away from them. In my mind the bible is very clear about this, your eyes should only be for the one you love.

It's perfectly normal and needed to be sexually attracted to your boyfriend/girlfriend, but acting on that is wrong, you need to wait for marriage.

 

[Luther073082]

Lust and attraction are different levels.

I think a good rule of thumb (at least for guys) is that if you start thinking about what you would like to do with her, you've crossed into the area of lust.

Attraction just by itself is more or less a recognition within your mind.

 

[emilylauren]

I think these are all good point, but maybe I'm looking for more answers that are more specific? That is, does lust occur when a sexual thought and sexual arousal occur in tandem, sexual thoughts by themselves, and/or sexual arousal by itself.

 

[max1120]

I think the whole lust thing has been blown out of proportion by various religions. Basically lust natural and something we just are going to do. Everyone does it, no one yet has stopped lusting. Its about as universal among humans as anything could ever be. As long as it is not obsessive or interfere with your life its harmless. I think we stop lusting until sometime after they slip the sheet over your head (maybe/maybe not..lol)

Max

 

[emilylauren]

I think the whole lust thing has been blown out of proportion by various religions. Basically lust natural and something we just are going to do. Everyone does it, no one yet has stopped lusting. Its about as universal among humans as anything could ever be. As long as it is not obsessive or interfere with your life its harmless. I think we stop lusting until sometime after they slip the sheet over your head (maybe/maybe not..lol)

Max

Yes and no. I don't think you can say "everybody does it" as an excuse for doing so. People still steal, lie and murder, but that doesn't "justify" those actions either.

That being said, I think the point of lust is that it is obsessive! There is a difference between thinking people are attractive and taking that thought to the obsessive and lustful level, imho.

 

[Luther073082]

I think these are all good point, but maybe I'm looking for more answers that are more specific? That is, does lust occur when a sexual thought and sexual arousal occur in tandem, sexual thoughts by themselves, and/or sexual arousal by itself.

Sexual thought either way.

Arosal without thought typically an involintary body function. Men often wake up in the morning physically aroused no matter what they are thinking about or feeling. Its completly involuntary that this happens.

 

[The Nihilist]

This isn't the forum. You're getting opinions here, but not any good answers. There should be a theology section somewhere that should have people who are familiar with the original greek.

 

[Luther073082]

This isn't the forum. You're getting opinions here, but not any good answers. There should be a theology section somewhere that should have people who are familiar with the original greek.

From my discussions with those who are familliar with the origional greek Lust is a pretty 1 to 1 translation of the word.

Eventually it comes to the question of "What does he mean by that".

While I think being familiar with the origional greek is important, especially for anyone who pastors a church, one does not necessarily have to know greek to try to learn, study or understand the scriptures.

 

[max1120]

The difference is only in degrees. If you find someone attractive the next logical step is to feel sexual thoughts regarding them. Most people begin to feel sexually attracted to people they find attractive. It may be a short thought or it may be a thought that last or occurs often. This is normal. It is almost an instinct. Your comparison to stealing for example because stealing is not natural. Lust is natural because sex is a natural aspect of life. It as nearly a universal act as anything I can point to and again with extremely extremely number of people (most likely on life support) of exceptions everyone does/has done this and does it with some degree of frequency. I would love to find those who deny this and see if we could arrange a polygraph examination to validate their claims. I would bet heavily against any of them passing...lmao.

Max

There are two types of liers:

1. Those who say they don't
2. Those who say they quit

 

[Northwoods Snowman]

I don't know as though I can define a specific point as which lust begins but I would like to throw a couple thoughts out there. One is in response to the people that say that lust is any sexual thought...I don't think this is the case. If that were true an engaged couple could not talk about what their sexual expectations are for their marriage. You have to "think" about sexual things to be able to discuss them in an objective manner. Second is that I think you cross over into lust when the sexual thoughts start to consume you. By that I mean when you see or talk to the person, you think about wanting to do sexual things with them, as opposed to just talking, hanging out, enjoying each other's company with out the sexual drive. Basically you are more focused on their body, and not on who they really are as a human being. I hope that makes sense.

 

[Bootstrap]

So just a general question-- what is the biblical definition of lust? When does it go from just "thinking someone is attractive" or even being physically attracted to someone to lusting after them.

The main verse people are thinking of when they use the term "lust" is here:

“You have heard that it was said, ‘Do not commit adultery.’ 5:28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to desire her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 5:29 If your right eye causes you to sin, tear it out and throw it away! It is better to lose one of your members than to have your whole body thrown into hell. 30 If your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away! It is better to lose one of your members than to have your whole body go into hell.

The two crucial words here are "adultery" and "lust". Adultery can only happen when one of you is married.

Lust is any strong desire where you set your heart on something, and would get it if you could. It once had this meaning in English, but in modern English the meaning has changed, it now means something sexual and negative. German still uses the term "lust" more like the older English, but for desires that are not necessarily as strong. I once had a woman ask me the equivalent of "do you have lust to go on a picnic with me?", and in German this meant simply, "would you like to go on a picnic with me?"

The King James used the term "lust" where the NET translation (above) uses the phrase "to desire her". There's a reason for this - the Greek word can be used for many kinds of desire. For instance, Jesus "eagerly desired" to share the Last Supper with his disciples - it's the same word.

The same word is also used in the Septuagint for Exodus 20:17, part of the Ten Commandments:

Exodus 20:17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife; thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house; nor his field, nor his servant, nor his maid, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any of his cattle, nor whatever belongs to thy neighbour.

I think that it's misleading to use the word "lust", because most of us don't think of lusting after someone else's house or field. In the meaning of the original Greek word, I think that you are "lusting" when you say, "I want that!" It doesn't have to be something sexual. You can want to be close to God. You can want to be obedient.

I think anyone who heard Jesus and knew the Ten Commandments in the Septuagint would have been reminded of so I would personally translate this word "covet" in Matthew 5:28:

Matthew 5:28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman in order to covet her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

But "desire" is also a good translation.

Back to your original question: I think it's helpful to use the term "covet". Thinking someone else is attractive is not coveting them. Thinking you want them, and would get them if you can, is coveting them. Being physically attracted to them is not coveting them - growing up in the country, we used to say "you can't keep the stray dogs out of your yard, but you can decide whether to feed them." If you feed the dogs, I think that's coveting. My parents use the three second rule - my father is allowed to look for three seconds. That's long enough to notice, but not long enough to start feeding the dogs.

What about couples? How do you differentiate between loving that person and feeling physically attracted to them and lusting. Would feeling sexually attracted to someone you were dating be wrong in and of itself, or only when you indulge those thoughts/feelings or act on them?

If you're dating someone and it's going well, you will be physically attracted to them, and you'll say to yourself, "I really want him!" (or "her", in my case)

That's the way it's supposed to be. If you don't have that feeling, I'd be concerned. That doesn't mean you can go ahead and have sex before marriage, boundaries are important, but of course you'll really want anyone you are in love with.

Hope this is helpful ....

Jonathan

 

[dayhiker]

There are a few different words that are translated lust in the NT. The one that we often hear refered to in a sexual context is in Mat.5:28. This is a generic Greek work for lust and is used in both a good way and a bad way. Actuallt is used more often of a good desire than an evil desire. Both Jesus and good angels are said to lust, desire.

Now the interesting way this word is used in Mat.5:29 and related verses. Jesus says in regard to adultery we aren't to even lust after a woman. Now when Paul uses this word he is quoting the 10 commandment that says thou shall not covet. So I see Jesus is saying we aren't to commit adultery for desire to commit adultery. He is showing how two of the 10 commandments are related to each other.

Ya, I think a lot of people try to make what Jesus is saying much broader than what Jesus is actaully saying.

dayhiker

 

[Stravinsk]

So just a general question-- what is the biblical definition of lust? When does it go from just "thinking someone is attractive" or even being physically attracted to someone to lusting after them.

What about couples? How do you differentiate between loving that person and feeling physically attracted to them and lusting. Would feeling sexually attracted to someone you were dating be wrong in and of itself, or only when you indulge those thoughts/feelings or act on them?

Lust is:

1. Sexual *forbidden* desire - such as David's lust for Bathsheba

2. A sexual desire that is not in the context of a committed, loving relationship

3. (The worst kind) - Sexual desire that is alone, and/or tinged with malice - such as what happens between a man and a prostitute.

There can be lust even when the two people are married. The presence or absence of a ring and ceremonial vows doesn't magically mean a bad type of desire called lust disappears.

*But this needs to be differentiated between sexual desire, and sexual desire that is inconsiderate of the other person*. For instance, a wife may have a very good reason for not wanting to have sex (she is sick, on her period, just after a major argument) - and if the husband forces his way - he is, IMO - putting his need above her welfare - and this is lust.

In my own marriage experience(I'm a widower now) - there were times we both felt desire, times she felt desire and I didn't but accommodated her, and times where I felt desire and she didn't but accommodated me. All of this, however, was in the context of a committed relationship and in sex were being sensitive to each other's needs.

There are people that I know that have lived with another person for years, with regular sexual intercourse and even children - but no ring or ceremony or vows. These people *are* married, even by law - a common law marriage. Some, including a friend of mine, recently did the exchange ring/ceremony/vow thing - but had for years already referred to his partner as his wife and was loyal to her.

 

[shantystar]

Lust and attraction are different levels.

I think a good rule of thumb (at least for guys) is that if you start thinking about what you would like to do with her, you've crossed into the area of lust.

Attraction just by itself is more or less a recognition within your mind.

you answers correctly!

 

[Johnnz]

it is really important to distinguish between sexual arousal and lust. Sexual arousal can happen for a variety of reasons. Lust is when we deliberately set out to break a moral standard if we had opportunity to. Even a strong sexual urge is not automatically lust.

A couple in love should experience sexual arousal at times. That is perfectly normal. But that also requires boundaries and values to come into play.

John
NZ

 

[GraceDaily]

Sorry to bring up an old thread but I was looking for one on this very topic. A lot of references to lust seem to be related to if you or the other person is married. What if you're single and looking for a partner? Surely you must think of them in a sexual way to some degree to know you have that sort of attraction to them? And that can be different to lust as I take the word lust as a bad thing, a craving for something that's wrong. Wanting a sexual relationship with a husband or wife isn't wrong.

I've tried to find a good definition of the word lust, but it's difficult, as someone mentioned, it's been changed over time to mainly refer to sex. The Bible seems to use it to describe a desire for something that's wrong. If you think about sex with someone outside marriage or with someone you can't be with for whatever reason then that would be wrong. If you think about sex with someone who is available and you see as a potential partner, is that wrong? Also what if you just think about sex generally, not even fixating on a particular person or even yourself?

Sorry to blab on! I hope someone can answer this.

 

[Johnnz]

That's a great post bootstrap.

John
NZ

 

[Luther073082]

Sorry to bring up an old thread but I was looking for one on this very topic. A lot of references to lust seem to be related to if you or the other person is married. What if you're single and looking for a partner? Surely you must think of them in a sexual way to some degree to know you have that sort of attraction to them? And that can be different to lust as I take the word lust as a bad thing, a craving for something that's wrong. Wanting a sexual relationship with a husband or wife isn't wrong.

I've tried to find a good definition of the word lust, but it's difficult, as someone mentioned, it's been changed over time to mainly refer to sex. The Bible seems to use it to describe a desire for something that's wrong. If you think about sex with someone outside marriage or with someone you can't be with for whatever reason then that would be wrong. If you think about sex with someone who is available and you see as a potential partner, is that wrong? Also what if you just think about sex generally, not even fixating on a particular person or even yourself?

Sorry to blab on! I hope someone can answer this.

Colossians 3:5
"Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry."

1 Peter 4:3
"For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable idolatry."

1 John 2:16
"For everything in the world—the cravings of sinful man, the lust of his eyes and the boasting of what he has and does—comes not from the Father but from the world."

The theological answer is that it is still a sin to lust after a boyfriend or a girlfriend. As well as even a fiance.

Now the real world answer is this. It is unlikely that a person could have a relationship of that close of nature for a long time without falling into Lust. In this case it must be reminded that we are forgiven and a reminder that our sinful nature makes it impossible for us to live up to the standard God has for us. And the closer you get to a person the more of a struggle this becomes.

In which case 1 Cor 7:9 applies
"But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion."

So basically this tells us in a sense why and when its better for us to marry.

Now that being said, this does not mean that one should run off and get married without thinking about it. However this does tell us that we shouldn't purposefully avoid marriage when we know that we are burning in lust.