Lost Faith

[Lynn27]

I've come here seeking guidance because I had no idea where else to go. This will no doubtedly be a very long post. Where to begin....well the basics; I've been a born-again Christian since I was about 8 years old. I've never been a very 'good' Christian. I smoke, I drink on occassion, I listen to non-Christian music and have no Christian friends. I don't attend church anymore. I do read my bible every night but its one of those things were I do it just because I feel obligated to and I don't get anything out of it.

I enjoy my life and the way I live it and have no desire to conform to a "Christian" life. I can't imagine myself giving up the music I listen to and the friends I have. I know everyone will probably say this unwillingness to conform is my fated downfall and nothing will improve if I don't conform. Maybe that is so.....maybe it isn't.

Moving on...

I used to believe in God and would occassionally go to him for guidance but nowadays I have too many doubts and too many questions. I'm not saying I don't believe in God because I do, I just don't believe that he cares about me or any of us. My life has been filled with nothing but downfalls for years upon years now. Most recently , I lost yet another job.

On to the doubts and questions:

--Without sin there would be no need for salvation. Without Jesus/God there would be no salvation. Question is, why did God allow sin into the world in the first place? Now I know that everyone is going to say that Satan is to blame for sin and right you are. However, God sees all and knows all.....even before it comes to pass. So ....God knew that Satan was going to tempt Eve, knew that Eve was going to fall into temptation. In knowing all this, why then did he allow it to happen? Why didn't he stop it? Alot of people say "free will". But when I think about it, here's how I feel.......he allowed it so that we would need him, because without sin we would need no salvation.

--Moving on now to "free will". God loves us so much, right? Or does he? In a sense I see him as a tyrant. Why do I feel this way? I'll tell you why....because God says that we must believe in him and accept him as our savior in order to get into Heaven. If we don't accept him as our savior, we burn forever in hell. Now what kind of "free will" is that? What kind of love is that? Conditional. Its either accept me (tyranny) or burn in hell.

I hope that there is someone out there who can understand the way I think/feel and alter it. I hope there is someone who can be non-judgemental. Someone who will not just condemn me and chastise me for the things I've said.

Lynn

 

[sawdust]

I hope that there is someone out there who can understand the way I think/feel and alter it. I hope there is someone who can be non-judgemental. Someone who will not just condemn me and chastise me for the things I've said.

Lynn

Hi Lynn,
I can certainly understand what you think and feel, unfortunately I don't have the power to alter it. What I can do however is talk with you on the issues. As far as condemning you for what you said, well I imagine there is hardly a person alive (past or present) who hasn't said or thought (even secretly) what you have said. So if you are going to "burn in hell" for it, you will have a great deal of company including yours truly!
You ask good questions. I say that because I really don't have good answers for them and if I don't have an answer it must be a good question. (we women have all the answers you know! ) LOL
Let's see...why would God create everthing knowing it would "crash and burn"? One reason might be so you can have those friends you talk about. If you think about it, it could be a whole lot worse. What if God didn't know things would go wrong? What if He was unprepared for sin and evil? Hmm ....that thought is too terrible to consider. The only reason I know as to why God would create everything is because there are some things that are worth having. Sometimes going beyond the risks involved is worth the trial. As far as "believe in Me or else" look at it this way. What if you had some disease that meant every day you had to have an injection to keep you alive. What would you chose for yourself? Is it tyrannical to insist upon the injection or is that compassion?
I asked my husband once: "On a scale of 1 -10, (1 being poor, 10 being well) how well do you think you understand me?" he replied 2! I asked him if he was kidding...he said no. I thought about that for awhile because I know how deeply my husband loves me. I came to the conclusion that loving someone was not conditional upon understanding them. If you think it's unfair God asks you to love Him, then just be very, very grateful He doesn't ask you to understand Him in order to get into heaven!
take care

 

[SegaMorph]

I will try and answer your questions.

Why did God allow sin into the world in the first place? I don't believe God allowed sin. Sin has always been a possibility. Who knows what happened before our time and who knows what happened but Sin is like God always there God didn't just allow it and he can't just destroy it.

God knew that Satan was going to tempt Eve, knew that Eve was going to fall into temptation. In knowing all this, why then did he allow it to happen? Why didn't he stop it? God has alot of reasons to not to have stopped it. I'm very glad he didn't there is so many wonderful people that have come along because God made free will. Think that God also knew that he would have a son. Can imagin how wonderful that would be even if some one else took a plunge. You know in out lives to that happens. Something bad happenes and something good comes out of it. You might not see it now or you might never see it but it will come. Another reason is God wanted us to not be drones or a bunch of little ants with one thing on our mind. Why do you think he mad us in his image? Thats why He didn't stop Adam and Eve because he wanted us to have a choice and be able to live with our choices.

God loves us so much, right? Or does he? In a sense I see him as a tyrant. Why do I feel this way? I'll tell you why....because God says that we must believe in him and accept him as our savior in order to get into Heaven. If we don't accept him as our savior, we burn forever in hell. Now what kind of "free will" is that? What kind of love is that? Conditional. Its either accept me (tyranny) or burn in hell.

You know I do see God as a Loving God the one that not only said heaven or Hell but gives us so many chances to come back to him. You have no idea how much pain we have put him through and put have put him through. Let me tell you a story because I'm so good at those.

I love this verce because I can really relate to it. The theif comes to steal kill and destroy but I come so that they may have life.

No I call that Love if you never do. You might look at God as a Big Mean with a gavel in his hand looking down at you but what he really wants is be so much less. He wants to be a father a friend a guide. The person who you can sit down and talk to and love you. He loves you so much he wants you to spend the rest of your life with him. I know if he didn't love me I wouldn't be where I am. If I haven't ever felt Gods love I would be so much worse then you. (Yes I did get close to it)

I chalenge you if you church has some fun activities like youth group or any thing. Get into it. Go once awhile. You don't have to drop you friends but just look at others and how Gods love has touched there lives and ask them how they do it.

 

[12volt_man]

I've never been a very 'good' Christian.

Well, the bad news is, you're not. None of us are. The good news is that it's not about us, it's about Jesus. None of us are the Christians we should be but Jesus has always been the Savior he promised He would be.

I don't attend church anymore.

You need to start. Have you ever looked at a fireplace? Put four or five logs in it and you can start a fire that will heat the whole house. Take one of those logs out, and the log will go out almost immediately.

People are a lot like that. This is why you need to be in a place where people can support you and hold you accountable.

I do read my bible every night but its one of those things were I do it just because I feel obligated to and I don't get anything out of it.

Do you have a reading plan or do you just flip open to a random page and start reading?

I enjoy my life and the way I live it and have no desire to conform to a "Christian" life. I can't imagine myself giving up the music I listen to and the friends I have. I know everyone will probably say this unwillingness to conform is my fated downfall and nothing will improve if I don't conform. Maybe that is so.....maybe it isn't.

What is the "Christian life" in your opinion? I mean, you must have some desire to grow in "the grace and knowledge of Christ" or else you wouldn't have come here "seeking guidance".

I used to believe in God and would occassionally go to him for guidance but nowadays I have too many doubts and too many questions. I'm not saying I don't believe in God because I do, I just don't believe that he cares about me or any of us. My life has been filled with nothing but downfalls for years upon years now. Most recently , I lost yet another job.

Didn't you know when you signed up for this that Jesus told us that we were going to have to take up our cross and that we were going to have hardships?

You're going to lose jobs. You're going to lose friends. You're going to get sick. People around you are going to die.

Jesus told us that we were going to face these things but He also promised us that He had overcome them.

On to the doubts and questions:

Let's stick to you for the moment. There will be plenty of time for doctrinal discussions later. Right now, they'll only muddy the waters.

I'm understand where you're coming from because most of us have been there, ourselves.

I don't want to preach at you but the biggest thing you could do right now to turn it around is to find a good church and go there.

 

[pmarquette]

I've come here seeking guidance because I had no idea where else to go. This will no doubtedly be a very long post.
Where to begin....well the basics; I've been a born-again Christian since I was about 8 years old. look at proverbs 24.16 ... when you fall , get back up again and go ... as many times as it takes ....

I've never been a very 'good' Christian. I smoke, I drink on occassion, I listen to non-Christian music and have no Christian friends. I don't attend church anymore. there are many who teach : i don't drink , smoke , or chew or run with those who do .... ( malarky..... ) the fact that you have 1-2 things that need improvement within your walk does not invalidate your faith ( look at proverbs 6.16 6 things God's frowns on ( none of them are tobacco or alcohol ) ; nor are any of them the 7 deadly sins sloth , gluttony , fornication, etc. ( 1 cor. 6.9 )
might check out www.oncecatholic.org a restoration site for backslidden catholics ... might be surprised at the posts .... many are like yours [ offense , weariness , disappointement , emptiness ]

I do read my bible every night but its one of those things were I do it just because I feel obligated to and I don't get anything out of it.
read ephesians chapters 1 and 2 , when it speaks of they , he , you put in your name -- predestinated you , purposed you , seated you ... all past tense promises ....
I enjoy my life and the way I live it and have no desire to conform to a "Christian" life. I can't imagine myself giving up the music I listen to and the friends I have. I know everyone will probably say this unwillingness to conform is my fated downfall and nothing will improve if I don't conform. Maybe that is so.....maybe it isn't. I like some pentecostal music we listen to at church , but also like the Eurythmics and a couple of secular bands .... again , does not invalidate your faith [ there is a couple of music areas here you can check out ] if your " friends " are walking the wrong walk .... will be difficult for you to walk right ; or you can demonstrate by your walk and the truth of the gospel , that your " sinner friends " might become " saved friends "-- romans 10.8-9

Moving on...

I used to believe in God and would occassionally go to him for guidance but nowadays I have too many doubts and too many questions. I'm not saying I don't believe in God because I do, I just don't believe that he cares about me or any of us. My life has been filled with nothing but downfalls for years upon years now. Most recently , I lost yet another job.
daddy god i am a mess , i ask that you demonstrate your love for me , open my eyes that I might see you , that i might repent before you , that you will restore , protect , and provide for me .... in jesus name ...
Jhn 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with [their] eyes, nor understand with [their] heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
Mar 9:24 And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.
On to the doubts and questions:

--Without sin there would be no need for salvation. Without Jesus/God there would be no salvation. Question is, why did God allow sin into the world in the first place? He didn't man did , we do ...
Now I know that everyone is going to say that Satan is to blame for sin and right you are. However, God sees all and knows all.....even before it comes to pass. So ....God knew that Satan was going to tempt Eve, knew that Eve was going to fall into temptation. In knowing all this, why then did he allow it to happen? Why didn't he stop it? Alot of people say "free will". But when I think about it, here's how I feel.......he allowed it so that we would need him, because without sin we would need no salvation.
can you prevent a toddler , bent on sticking a fork in a socket or playing with matches from getting shocked or burnt ? if god ran around with a paddle and a remote control ... we would be a bunch of android puppets .... to have choices , we must be permitted to blow it and walk out the consequences...that we might grow , repent , return to Him
--Moving on now to "free will". God loves us so much, right? Or does he? In a sense I see him as a tyrant. Why do I feel this way? I'll tell you why....because God says that we must believe in him and accept him as our savior in order to get into Heaven. If we don't accept him as our savior, we burn forever in hell. Now what kind of "free will" is that? What kind of love is that? Conditional. Its either accept me (tyranny) or burn in hell.
if parents say don't have unsafe sex , and you ignore them and contract aides ... who's sin produced the disease ... ; did then not love the child who disobeyed them ? did they err in not tying the child up at night ? all things have consequences good and bad ... some eternal
I hope that there is someone out there who can understand the way I think/feel and alter it. I hope there is someone who can be non-judgemental. Someone who will not just condemn me and chastise me for the things I've said.
we all wonder , we all lose ground , some of us go in reverse , some get lost in troubles , affliction , & offense ... some return and restart ...
lay your burden at the feet of the cross , crawl up in Abba's lap , and be at peace .... go forth and do better each day ...
Lynn

 

[mrversatile48]

Hi Lynn!

I must dash in @ 10 minutes...

As dad of a mid-teen girl, who moved without telling me, & ex-stepdad of 4 girls & a "special needs" boy - (now @ 19/35ish) - I assure you of my prayers, Lynn

Just time to say do click my name & see if some of the posts, including 2 song lyrics I wrote, within the last 5/6 posts, encourage your faith, OK

If anyone calls me a hypocrite - (amazingly rare!) - I say, "No: I really am a sinner, saved only by the sheer grace of God, thru faith in the once-for-all atonong sacrifice of Christ on the cross of Calvary..so..do you wannabe saved?"

I'm sure you know John 3:16, Romans 3:23, Galatians 2:15/16 & Ephesians 2:8/9 all underline that 1-&-only way of salvation, Lynn!

My testimony, "From Sheer Terror To Firm Faith", which may strike a chord, has a whole thread on it at:-

http://faithforum.myforums.net

Many testimonies, of God's path to victory thru every trial imaginable, are on:-

http://www.HeInvites.com

God bless you, Lynn!

Ian

 

[Sweetbriar]

Your questioning is normal as others have already validated and in fact it's healthy although painful.

Some things we may never fully understand b/c of our finite human minds and on those questions I will anxiously be waiting in line to ask when I get to heaven.

The one thing I did want to comment on was your thinking of God as tyrannical and that we have to accept him. That's referred to in some circles as decision theology. Not everyone believes that is the way God sees it or wants us to see it. If you look through your Bible at the stories involving the shepherd and the sheep it's always the shepherd looking for the lost sheep. He will even sacrifice the well being of the whole flock to go after the one lost. He pursues us. You are already his. You don't really have to make a "big decision" to accept him. That's too much emphasis on what you are doing..it's putting everything on you when Christ has already done it all..once and for all. Out of gratitude daily we strive to follow the law...not b/c we have to to be accepted by God...but b/c of the love he already showed us through his death and resurrection..the gospel. So now we are no longer slaves to the law b/c of the gospel. The Good News. God gives us faith and the power to live. It's not something we do on our own power. It's not like he goes ...poof..the power is all there right now for everything...but when we turn to Him daily..each day is new...asking for help.. b/c prayer is important...that each day we become more like Christ.

I hope that helps. You must be very weary and Jesus said his yoke was light and that he would give us rest. Rest your heart and mind b/c God already loves you whether you smoke, whether you have a few occasional drinks, whether you don't go to church. He's not keeping score. He just loves you. He just wants you to see it and respond. Not out of fear. Just gratitude.

 

[desi]

I've come here seeking guidance because I had no idea where else to go. This will no doubtedly be a very long post. Where to begin....well the basics; I've been a born-again Christian since I was about 8 years old. I've never been a very 'good' Christian. I smoke, I drink on occassion, I listen to non-Christian music and have no Christian friends. I don't attend church anymore. I do read my bible every night but its one of those things were I do it just because I feel obligated to and I don't get anything out of it.

I enjoy my life and the way I live it and have no desire to conform to a "Christian" life. I can't imagine myself giving up the music I listen to and the friends I have. I know everyone will probably say this unwillingness to conform is my fated downfall and nothing will improve if I don't conform. Maybe that is so.....maybe it isn't.

...

Moving on...

I used to believe in God and would occassionally go to him for guidance but nowadays I have too many doubts and too many questions. I'm not saying I don't believe in God because I do, I just don't believe that he cares about me or any of us. My life has been filled with nothing but downfalls for years upon years now. Most recently , I lost yet another job.

So far you don't follow God's lead and you experience failure. Imagine that.

On to the doubts and questions:

--Without sin there would be no need for salvation. Without Jesus/God there would be no salvation. Question is, why did God allow sin into the world in the first place? Now I know that everyone is going to say that Satan is to blame for sin and right you are. However, God sees all and knows all.....even before it comes to pass. So ....God knew that Satan was going to tempt Eve, knew that Eve was going to fall into temptation. In knowing all this, why then did he allow it to happen? Why didn't he stop it? Alot of people say "free will". But when I think about it, here's how I feel.......he allowed it so that we would need him, because without sin we would need no salvation.

God gave us free will which gives us the choice to not do what God wants, free will.

--Moving on now to "free will". God loves us so much, right? Or does he? In a sense I see him as a tyrant. Why do I feel this way? I'll tell you why....because God says that we must believe in him and accept him as our savior in order to get into Heaven. If we don't accept him as our savior, we burn forever in hell. Now what kind of "free will" is that? What kind of love is that? Conditional. Its either accept me (tyranny) or burn in hell.

Its the same choice society gives criminals, conform or else... The difference is society only offers the stick for nonconformists. God offers the carrot and the stick. Hell for nonconformists and blessings for conformists.

I hope that there is someone out there who can understand the way I think/feel and alter it. I hope there is someone who can be non-judgemental. Someone who will not just condemn me and chastise me for the things I've said.

Lynn

I agree with you. Is free will really free if we are under duress? I think it is because God is not all tyrant. He is loving when we behave ourselves and behaving ourselves is not that hard if you look at how Jesus instructs us to behave. 'Love one another as yourself.'