Loss of Hope

[Terri]

Can anyone help me understand why a Christian would loss hope.

If a Christian says that they don't have hope is it something that they are doing wrong, is it God not giving them the gift of hope, or is it something else?

This is very, very important to me guys and I would appreciate your help. I know I can trust the opinions of ya'll that truly understand grace!

 

[jbarcher]

For some people, "hope" is a feeling that things will get better. There is no rationality to this kind of "hope".

For our ancestors in the faith, hope was interchangable with expectation. Big difference.

People "lose hope" because they no longer feel things will go well. So, one simple answer (and there are several) is that the person needs to change some beliefs around.

 

[pinkieposies]

If a Christian says that they don't have hope is it something that they are doing wrong, is it God not giving them the gift of hope, or is it something else?

How can a Christian not have hope for all that which has been promised to them by Christ? All the things that are promised to them as a child of God? We all feel down sometimes and sometimes feel hopeless {Some of us struggle more than others}. But surely we know that we are NOT hopeless. I would probably question whether someone who said this was really a true Christian in the first place, but as brothers and sisters in Christ we should be lifting one another up, encouraging each other not to forget the hope we have within us.

I don't know if that made sense. I am kinda tired today! . I am sure that there are others here who have some better, more eloquent answers!

God Bless,
Erin

 

[Terri]

For some people, "hope" is a feeling that things will get better. There is no rationality to this kind of "hope".

For our ancestors in the faith, hope was interchangable with expectation. Big difference.

People "lose hope" because they no longer feel things will go well. So, one simple answer (and there are several) is that the person needs to change some beliefs around.

Thank you jbarcher for your reply.

Jbarcher could you help me see what you believe the biblical definition of hope would be?

Do you feel that we as Christians or simply as human beings should not always expect things to get better.

 

[Terri]

How can a Christian not have hope for all that which has been promised to them by Christ? All the things that are promised to them as a child of God? We all feel down sometimes and sometimes feel hopeless {Some of us struggle more than others}. But surely we know that we are NOT hopeless. I would probably question whether someone who said this was really a true Christian in the first place, but as brothers and sisters in Christ we should be lifting one another up, encouraging each other not to forget the hope we have within us.

I don't know if that made sense. I am kinda tired today! . I am sure that there are others here who have some better, more eloquent answers!

God Bless,
Erin

Thank you pinkieposies. I think your reply was very eloquent. I believe that you answered the question I was asking jbarcher to elaborate on--the biblical definition of hope!

 

[pinkieposies]

Do you feel that we as Christians or simply as human beings should not always expect things to get better.

I think that is missing the whole point of hope. To hope is to believe that come good or bad, the promises Christ made to us are ours forever and will be fulfilled, whether it be here or in eternity, and to find comfort in them.

I personally like to try to look at the bright side of things, but optmism is not the same thing as hope. Hope is based on a belief and comes from faith, while optimism is just a way of looking at things. You don't neccessarily have to be an optimist to have hope in Christ...Though I can't see why anyone wouldn't be after they find their hope in Jesus!

Erin

 

[Jon_]

For some people, "hope" is a feeling that things will get better. There is no rationality to this kind of "hope".

For our ancestors in the faith, hope was interchangable with expectation. Big difference.

People "lose hope" because they no longer feel things will go well. So, one simple answer (and there are several) is that the person needs to change some beliefs around.

That's a good answer.

Soli Deo Gloria

Jon

 

[pinkieposies]

Thank you pinkieposies. I think your reply was very eloquent. I believe that you answered the question I was asking jbarcher to elaborate on--the biblical definition of hope!

Well thank you for asking the question! I am glad to be of help! I love questions. I believe God gave us inquistive spirits in order for us to seek Him and His truth, and I am glad to see someone doing that!

Erin

 

[Terri]

I think that is missing the whole point of hope. To hope is to believe that come good or bad, the promises Christ made to us are ours forever and will be fulfilled, whether it be here or in eternity, and to find comfort in them.

I personally like to try to look at the bright side of things, but optmism is not the same thing as hope. Hope is based on a belief and comes from faith, while optimism is just a way of looking at things. You don't neccessarily have to be an optimist to have hope in Christ...Though I can't see why anyone wouldn't be after they find their hope in Jesus!

Erin

That's great Erin! Thanks!

So what do you think Erin someone is saying when they say that they are without hope? I know the person was a Christian. Are they just depressed you think?

 

[JJB]

It could be, Terri, that the person is no longer seeking Christ. When we look upon Him, all else fades away.

Or it could be a biological depression.

 

[pinkieposies]

That's great Erin! Thanks!

So what do you think Erin someone is saying when they say that they are without hope? I know the person was a Christian. Are they just depressed you think?

Well, it is hard to say. It could be.

I have had first-hand experience with clinical depression {Before I became a Reformed Christian}, and I can see that being a factor, but now that I know Christ, even though I may have feelings of depression sometimes, I do not let it take my hope from me. God is greater than even serious depression, and the hope He has given me is greater than any doubt that the devil or my own sinful nature may stir in my heart.

Then again maybe this person just wasn't really thinking too hard about what they were actually saying.

Erin

P.S. Glad to oblige! Keep the questions coming!

 

[Terri]

It could be, Terri, that the person is no longer seeking Christ. When we look upon Him, all else fades away.

Or it could be a biological depression.

It must have been depression JJB because I know that they were definitely seeking God.

 

[Terri]

Well, it is hard to say. It could be.

I have had first-hand experience with clinical depression {Before I became a Reformed Christian}, and I can see that being a factor, but now that I know Christ, even though I may have feelings of depression sometimes, I do not let it take my hope from me. God is greater than even serious depression, and the hope He has given me is greater than any doubt that the devil or my own sinful nature may stir in my heart.

Then again maybe this person just wasn't really thinking too hard about what they were actually saying.

Erin

P.S. Glad to oblige! Keep the questions coming!

Erin I am so happy that you have faith to the point that even feelings of depression can not shake it.

I will have to work on thinking up a new question Erin, because this one has been answered to my complete satisfaction! Thank you so much!

Thanks everyone for your help. I feel much better knowing the answers you all have given me here.

 

[pinkieposies]

Erin I am so happy that you have faith to the point that even feelings of depression can not shake it.

I will have to work on thinking up a new question Erin, because this one has been answered to my complete satisfaction! Thank you so much!

Thanks everyone for your help. I feel much better knowing the answers you all have given me here.

Your welcome!!! And I'm glad you are happy with the answers you received. There are many intelligent and experienced people here in this forum. I'm sure all of your questions will get many fine answers here!

So glad to have you with us!

God Bless,
Erin

 

[jbarcher]

Thank you jbarcher for your reply.

Jbarcher could you help me see what you believe the biblical definition of hope would be?

Sure. I'll draw from two sources, whatever concordance the default e-sword comes with, and my loving friend, the social sciences.

Here's a good one to contrast modern vs biblical concepts of hope:

[bible]Acts 24:15[/bible]

Moderns would naturally interpret this to think that people "just hope" that there'll be a res. When you get down to the original text this is not so:

G1680
elpis
From ἔλπω elpō which is a primary word (to anticipate, usually with pleasure); expectation (abstract or concrete) or confidence: - faith, hope

Paul is not giving some vague, blind shot in the dark with a "hope" that he'll hit something, but rather he is so confident before his opponents that he uses elpis: expectation.

Second, from the Handbook of Biblical Social Values, by Malina and Pilch, p.202

Relative to persons, trust (also known as hope or allegiance) is rooted in the security that derives from a solidly reliable, interpersonal relationship. The nouns "hope," "trust," "confidence," "allegiance," as well as the verbs "to have hope" and "to hope," refer to the social experience of security and trustworthiness that characterize relationships. As a social bond, it works along with the value of (personal and group) loyalty (translated "faith").

Consider this understanding in various places. I'm going go contrast positive and negative uses of this word--you'll see that it's used in a sort of a fortori way.

Certain things that people trust in are said not to be trustable: riches: Proverbs 11:28, Psalm 62:10, Luke 18:18-25; fortified cities: Jeremiah 5:17, Deuteronomy 28:52. I could put a bunch more but you get the idea.

God is the only thing that is wholly trustable: Blessed is the man who trusts in the LORD And whose trust is the LORD. (Jer 17:7, cf. 17:5-6)

In this sense, a few more places of the NT can be understood:

Therefore having such a hope, we use great boldness in our speech (2 Cor 3:12) / Why would people use 'great boldness' if they had some vague blind-shot-in-the-dark? And lo, anachronized interpretations do violence to the text...

Christ was faithful as a Son over His house--whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end. (Heb 3:6) / So hope really isn't some vague desire. It's a pretty concrete expectation.

according to my earnest expectation [i.e. watching] and hope, that I will not be put to shame in anything (Philippians 1:20) / If you know about honor and shame in the Mediterranean world, Paul's statement in Philippians is REALLY bold. Compare with the honor-shame aspects of Jesus' trial, crucifixion, and resurrection. I suspect Paul is alluding to God's riposte.

---

As for your question about whether we should expect things to get better or not... I am completely split on the issue. There is that line in Romans 8 about things working for the good of those who serve Him, but that does not mean we should expect that things will get "better". Then there is the problem of what constitutes "better", because the only ideal I can think of is heaven and I assume that is not attainable on earth. There is the theme of doom which I have yet to fully grapple with, but nevertheless it overshadows some of my thinking. Consider also how the depravity of humanity factors into personal relationships, and if you can, look at how personal relationships tie into social conditions. Then consider the economic structure of some poverty-striken countries--the economy is so messed that the main thing it "produces" is poverty. For this, we need to change the social structure. There are a lot of historical causes for this, such as underdevelopment or a failure to diversify the economy (think of how imperial powers exploited a country for a single product).

It is not an easy question as there are hordes of questions that are relevant to it. I lean towards no, but this is perhaps qualified with a strong belief that if there are true Christians, their effect must be significant--not recognized, but significant. In other words, I believe that from the gospel necessarily comes a better world.

 

[Terri]

Thank you jbarcher in your efforts to help me understand. And, I am understanding alot better.

I really like when you said, "God is the only thing that is wholly trustable." I was just praying the other day about a house I need to sell to carry me over for a while until I can get a job. I was so worried about that house selling and what would happen to me if I didn't get the money. Well, I have been praying for along time that God wouldn't let me serve created things as the bible warns us not to do. But, I don't even understand how it is that one can serve created things. God made it clear to me that I should not be concerned with that house. That He would take care of me regardless of what happened to that house. So now, I'm wondering if I wasn't trusting in the money that I would get from the house to take care of me more than I was trusting in God to take care of me. Do you think Jbarcher that what I was doing is what God meant about serving created things?

One other question please:

Jbarcher do you think that the expectation that the biblical hope means would be the same as faith. It almost seems to me that hope and faith in the biblical meanings would mean the same thing.

 

[jbarcher]

Faith is loyalty; hope is expectation. (Interestingly both are not held to be irrational )

As for serving created things. I may come back to further qualify this... This is a sticky topic because people often repeat things like "put your trust in God" without stopping to think what that entails. Try asking someone what it means to "put your trust in God" and what a life would look like if someone did that. They will likely refer to Jesus, which is not quite helpful. What does it look like, in this society? It's not an easy question by any means. The difficulty of discussing this question is that when you ask, people can get defensive really easily, as if you were questioning WHY one should trust God, rather than WHAT it looks like.

But to put your trust in riches means, roughly, that money is your savior and redeemer. It means that you don't acknowledge the Creator: you believe that everything that happened was purely your doing. The story of the rich man who planned to tear down his barns to build bigger ones, comes to mind. There is prospering as a servant of God, and there is prospering as a non-servant. There also managing what God has given you with wisdom and prudence, and there is managing what you have.

Consider it from another angle. If you serve God, all your dispositions will be informed by that fundamental, all-encompassing inclination. This isn't to say that we'll be sinless, of course, but there is a difference between life as a servant and life without that servanthood. In this sense, Luther's "Love God and live as you please" is correct. When you are regenerate (to use a theological term), you begin to change.

Or another angle. Suppose that selling a house will allow you to continue for six months. If you think, "This will let me get by, apart from God", you are trusting in what? But if you think, "This will let me get by, Lord willing", what is the difference?

It is also like the idea of soli deo gloria (glory to God alone). Does this mean that we cannot excell at something, utilize and hone the gifts God has given us? Rhetorically, no. It does mean that we recognize who the Master is, and whom we serve. Also your excellence serves as a glorifying reflection of your Master.

 

[strengthinweakness]

Can anyone help me understand why a Christian would loss hope.

If a Christian says that they don't have hope is it something that they are doing wrong, is it God not giving them the gift of hope, or is it something else?

This is very, very important to me guys and I would appreciate your help. I know I can trust the opinions of ya'll that truly understand grace!

Terri, as others have, I can speak from my own personal experience with loss of hope (both before, and after, becoming a Reformed Christian). I have experienced deep pain (physical and mental), grief, and trauma in my life. My mother was clinically depressed, and I have also struggled with severe depression. I also have a physical disability, and that has been very hard (although it has also been a deep gift in many ways).

My faith has greatly helped to keep me from losing hope. Before I became Reformed though, I constantly looked at my circumstances in life and allowed them to "shake me" emotionally, and even spiritually, at times. I don't know that I ever lost ultimate (i.e. eternally-minded) hope, but my depression nearly did bring me to despair of my earthly life. (My own history with non-Reformed theology leads me to think that it leaves one more open to loss of hope, both temporally and eternally.) Because I did not understand (and/or accept) God's sovereignty over all things, I experienced a much greater degree of anxiety and depression. I saw myself as being at the mercy of people and circumstances which were outside of my control. I was partially right about that-- I didn't have control (at least not the kind of control that I wanted), but that was not a cause for despair! When God brought me to understand and accept the doctrines of grace, as taught in the Bible, I finally saw the awesome truth that He is in control! No harm-- nothing painful in any way, in fact-- can come to me unless He allows it, and if He allows it, then I can know that it is for my ultimate good! This knowledge has been an unspeakable comfort to me. Now that I am Reformed, I also understand that I had nothing to do with my salvation. God could have justly chosen to leave me dead in my sins, damned for all eternity, but He graciously chose to save me! He saved me, and He will keep me! The former has contributed greatly to my general thankfulness in life, while the latter has lessened my anxiety. Part of my earlier, ongoing depression had been a lack of gratitude toward God. I did not understand just how much He had blessed me and just how indebted I was to Him. Although I wouldn't have admitted it at the time, I thought that, since I had "chosen" Him, He was somehow "obligated" to save me! (I find this to be one of the greatest problems with non-Reformed understandings of Christianity.) He basically owed me salvation! Oh, how wrong I was was... praise God for setting me right on that crucial point!!! I now have much more gratitude to God (and hence, much less resentment and depression) than I once did.

Now, having said all of the above, there are still times when I struggle with depression. Even knowing what I know about God, I can still lose my perspective and look too much at my circumstances and at how "badly" certain things seem to be going in my life. However, God is merciful to me. He always realigns my view to Him and His good purposes. I may not always understand the painful things that He allows in my life, and in the lives of others, but I know that He is in control of all things (even the evil acts of people). Being Reformed (which really just means, being Biblical!) in my theology, I now have peace and comfort that I have never had before in my life. Even better, I have a deeper, more true understanding of the God of the Bible! All glory belongs to Him!

 

[McWilliams]

I did a study on 'Living a Life of Hope' by Nathan Busenitz which was very helpful. The back cover states it is '31 days to true hope'. It covers how to remain 'hopeful'. Some of the chapters are,
A Hope that Will Not Disappoint, Unlocking Your Spiritual Hope Chest, A God You Can Trust, Where is Your Hope Built.

I guess what I mostly gained from the study were the special scriptures and the fact that as a christian our hope is personified. It is Christ! We are now His forever!
1John 3:2, Beloved, now we are the children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is, v3 And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure!

He is our purifying hope! The Holy Spirit is even now working us into the image of Christ. We are living in the reality of Christ's return.

I suggest reading the book of 1John and pondering the great truths in the verses there and asking our sweet Lord to show you His peace!
Isaiah 26:3 You will keep him in perfect peace whose mind is stayed on You, because he trusts in You.
We, as Christians are not to worry or agonize about our feelings but are to place all of our hope in our Savior. He has great keeping power!

He is our Hope!
This book, Living a Life of Hope tells us how to stay focused on what really matters.

 

[Terri]

Faith is loyalty; hope is expectation. (Interestingly both are not held to be irrational )

As for serving created things. I may come back to further qualify this... This is a sticky topic because people often repeat things like "put your trust in God" without stopping to think what that entails. Try asking someone what it means to "put your trust in God" and what a life would look like if someone did that. They will likely refer to Jesus, which is not quite helpful. What does it look like, in this society? It's not an easy question by any means. The difficulty of discussing this question is that when you ask, people can get defensive really easily, as if you were questioning WHY one should trust God, rather than WHAT it looks like.

But to put your trust in riches means, roughly, that money is your savior and redeemer. It means that you don't acknowledge the Creator: you believe that everything that happened was purely your doing. The story of the rich man who planned to tear down his barns to build bigger ones, comes to mind. There is prospering as a servant of God, and there is prospering as a non-servant. There also managing what God has given you with wisdom and prudence, and there is managing what you have.

Consider it from another angle. If you serve God, all your dispositions will be informed by that fundamental, all-encompassing inclination. This isn't to say that we'll be sinless, of course, but there is a difference between life as a servant and life without that servanthood. In this sense, Luther's "Love God and live as you please" is correct. When you are regenerate (to use a theological term), you begin to change.

Or another angle. Suppose that selling a house will allow you to continue for six months. If you think, "This will let me get by, apart from God", you are trusting in what? But if you think, "This will let me get by, Lord willing", what is the difference?

It is also like the idea of soli deo gloria (glory to God alone). Does this mean that we cannot excell at something, utilize and hone the gifts God has given us? Rhetorically, no. It does mean that we recognize who the Master is, and whom we serve. Also your excellence serves as a glorifying reflection of your Master.

Thank you jbarcher. I agree with what you said about the serving of created things. It really helps clear it up for me. I think that God was just getting on my case a little for the worrying and I thought perhaps it might have a deeper meaning. He did make His feelings known about it and I have taken heed and relaxed some about if and when the house sells.

I expecially agree with you about soli deo gloria!

The only think I'm a little confused on is the "faith is loyalty." I've never thought of or heard anyone else describe faith as loyalty. Could you explain that to me--pretty please.

Your a real blessing jbarcher and so kind to take your time to help me understand.