"Lisa"

[Ironhold]

You must disavow Joseph Smith for his blatant racism and sexism if you want a chance at respectability. Also cease and desist with the utterly insane beliefs and rituals.

Those are some pretty bold claims, and proof would be requested.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Those are some pretty bold claims, and proof would be requested.

Those things are common knowledge.

 

[Ironhold]

Those things are common knowledge.

You wouldn't believe some of the raw nonsense I've seen people make up about us.

Heck, I once read someone posit that the church had its own store of armored combat vehicles "just in case".

Hence why I was asking for details as to what you perceive the issue to be, so that we can better discuss matters.

 

[Nihilist Virus]

You wouldn't believe some of the raw nonsense I've seen people make up about us.

Heck, I once read someone posit that the church had its own store of armored combat vehicles "just in case".

Hence why I was asking for details as to what you perceive the issue to be, so that we can better discuss matters.

Joseph Smith was a drifter and a con artist. He was as racist and sexist as anyone in his time, indicating a lack of divine revelation at least in those particular regards.

And honestly I don't really care how much raw nonsense is made up about your religion. I know how Mormons go about their lives: super nice as missionaries, and then super jerks when their duty is fulfilled. I'll take the word of rumors over the word of two-faced hypocrites.

Your founder was a confirmed liar, racist and sexist. Your religion appeals to bizarre beliefs and practices. These issues are not up for debate. While these issues do not necessarily disqualify your religion as potentially true, your continued denial will disqualify you from ever conversing with me again.

 

[Ran77]

Did you think my response was to you personally?

Lets look at what you said,

Like I said don't worry about it

Though you told me never to say that again

Didn't you?

Yep, certainly looks like the response was to me personally. All the "you" in it are a dead giveaway.

 

[miknik5]

Lets look at what you said,

Like I said don't worry about it

Though you told me never to say that again

Didn't you?

Yep, certainly looks like the response was to me personally. All the "you" in it are a dead giveaway.

My lips are sealed sir
You will have to make your own judgement on what is good (and and what isn't good

May it be the right one

 

[miknik5]

Lets look at what you said,

Like I said don't worry about it

Though you told me never to say that again

Didn't you?

Yep, certainly looks like the response was to me personally. All the "you" in it are a dead giveaway.

I will no longer address you personally. However if you continue to listen and understand that in the end there will be those who will, by what they do, clearly make manifest that they do not truly know of whose SPIRIT they claim themselves to be then you will understand that I was telling you not to do the things that go against HIS SPIRIT

 

[miknik5]

I leave you with this

HE said not by power or by might

But by MY SPIRIT
Now you might want to turn to Luke 12 to make one connection between those who "go out" from those who do not go out

 

[miknik5]

There's many more connections.

Because in the end TRUTH and even natural love will be cast down

Don't love to kill and don't hate your brother but pray and wait and do not allow your hands to have a part in what is evil

 

[Ironhold]

Joseph Smith was a drifter and a con artist.

Now I have something we can look at.

The whole "con artist" bit?

A key element of the allegations is a situation in which he was on trial for fraud. Critics of the LDS faith have alleged that a document stolen by Rev. Wesley Walters from a courthouse archive is proof that he was convicted. However, more recent attempts to analyze the document show that it was nothing more than the bill for the pre-trial hearing, meaning that it merely confirms the trial actually happened... something everyone already knows about anyway.

http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDSFAQ/FQ_prophets.shtml#convict

 

[Nihilist Virus]

Now I have something we can look at.

The whole "con artist" bit?

A key element of the allegations is a situation in which he was on trial for fraud. Critics of the LDS faith have alleged that a document stolen by Rev. Wesley Walters from a courthouse archive is proof that he was convicted. However, more recent attempts to analyze the document show that it was nothing more than the bill for the pre-trial hearing, meaning that it merely confirms the trial actually happened... something everyone already knows about anyway.

http://www.jefflindsay.com/LDSFAQ/FQ_prophets.shtml#convict

What is your point?

 

[ViaCrucis]

You come across as very distant and apathetic when you say things like this or like when you said that Atonement Theory is just one possible explanation of the purpose of Jesus' death.

Your profile says you live in America. From the way you act so baffled by what is obviously the huge majority of Christianity and Christian theology, I would've guessed you live on the moon.

It's probably just a matter of style. I have been posting in religious discussion boards for about 16 years now, and over that time I have put in a large amount of effort in learning about diverse views and opinions within Christianity, learning about other religions, and trying to apply that in order to provide a larger perspective on issues.

I wasn't baffled by what Ironhold said, I was making the point that the term "mainline" has a specific use in the context of inter-Christian identification; the term "mainline" refers to Mainline Protestantism: Presbyterianism, Lutheranism, Methodism, and Epicopalianism would all be Mainline. It is used in contrast to both Evangelical and Fundamentalist. Thus, by definition, Jack Chick is not representative of "mainline" Christianity. Chick's publications are representative of a particular form of American Fundamentalism.

I'm also not baffled by what is popularly believed in American Christianity; I grew up with it. But that isn't going to stop me from being critical of it, or to explain that the peculiarities of 21st century American (usually Evangelical) Christianity doesn't exactly represent Christianity in toto. I believe in providing a broader, and more historically orthodox perspective to give better insight into the width and depth of the Christian religious tradition; I also try to bring a particularly Lutheran perspective when possible.

If I come across as distant it is because I try to be objective, and I try be as informative as possible.

And as far as my addressing Ironhold, he and I have had conversations elsewhere, and I've pointed these things out, explaining in more detail, as I did above, the distinction between Mainline and Fundamentalist.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

Crypto

Please read the story of Dinah

I'm not sure how it changes anything as to what I said.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[miknik5]

I'm not sure how it changes anything as to what I said.

-CryptoLutheran

The man loved the girl. It wasn't just to satisfy a physical urge
He wanted to marry her. And he and the whole of his people were willing to join themselves to those who were known to belong to GOD

And what did they do?
After all the men had been circumcised (signifying an outward mark and Covenant with GOD) the sins of Jacob who claimed to know GOD misrepresented GOD and killed the men

They did worse than the young man had done

And their father Jacob was offended and said you have made me a stench in the nostrils of all these people

 

[Ran77]

My lips are sealed sir
You will have to make your own judgement on what is good (and and what isn't good

May it be the right one

I didn't make any comment on what is good. Or bad for that matter. That is something you've added.

 

[Ran77]

I will no longer address you personally.

Excellent. Makes reading the rest of the post kind of pointless though.