Leviticus 20:13...

[Frankarmendariz]

deleted post

 

[Hentenza]

God can certainly judge and put to death those that are an abomination to Him. He can effect death both in this life and in the next. All that die in sin will perish, consequently, whether He effects death in this life or in the next will not change that fact.

And in answer to your last question, no. It applies to lesbians also.

 

[dfw69]

the purpose of the law is to point sin out....what sin is....and the punishment of sins....yes the law condemns.....for all have sinned and fall short...no one is righteous in the sight of Gods perfect law...thus we all need a savior...to atone for our sins that we may find forgiveness....Jesus paid the penalty for sin....thus setting us free from the power of the law.....

the law is not to be obeyed.....meaning the punishments for breaking the law should not be carried out by man.....only God will judge those under the law.....and Christ will judge those under him for all things are given to him.....but those that put themselves under the law....then the law will judge them....sadly they will be found not worthy for the law saves no one .....the law only condemns its followers....thus the need of Christ ....and rejection of the law.....

look into the law to see what sin is and repent if you fall short and practice any of its sins ....and ask God for help to deliver you from any sin.....God is able to deliver.....but believe the Gospel....salvation in Jesus teachings alone.....faith in him alone saves and unites us with God.....peace

 

[Frankarmendariz]

deleted post

 

[granpa]

If a man lies with a male, as with a woman, both of them are committing a life threatening action: It will surely end with their death; their blood shall be upon their own hands.

 

[C R F]

in this passage it say

'If a man lies with a male, as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.'

does this mean God wants us to kill people who are gay? i find that insane, i feel that we are not to judge or take a life, that is God's job to take someones life away through natural cause or car accident or something, passages like these often make me nervous to continue to read the bible in fear of reading something else that ma cause me to over think it (i have OCD) one of the ten commandments also say thall shall not kill, but in this passage it is telling us to kill gays, i find this very contradictory, it also makes me think that the bible may have been altered in someways, im not against gays nor do i support them, what is your say about this passage?

P.S. it doesnt say anything about a women and women, does this mean being a lesbian isnt a sin?

It is an abomination to the Lord if a man born of the spirit of God sits in church being converted into the flesh. That is what it means. It says lay because the spirit child is conceived that way threw the teachings. If people judge gay as men with men they themselves are men with men and by their own judgement they have judged themselves and the proof is in their understanding of the matter.

 

[Fireinfolding]

Men born of the Spirit shouldnt be in the Church of Jesus Christ (His body) to be converted to the flesh and thats what you believe it means?

A spirit child is thus conceived through teachings of the Spirit man in the church of Christ (he should not be in)?

Why do I even ask...

 

[C R F]

Men born of the Spirit shouldnt be in the Church of Jesus Christ (His body) to be converted to the flesh and thats what you believe it means?

A spirit child is thus conceived through teachings of the Spirit man in the church of Christ (he should not be in)?

Why do I even ask...

If a man lays with a male as with a woman. So I suppose you think its talking about homosexuality, or if not, you explain it. I'll put it in simply words. Men teaching men in church as apposed to men teaching the spirit.

 

[Fireinfolding]

If a man lays with a male as with a woman. So I suppose you think its talking about homosexuality, or if not, you explain it. I'll put it in simply words. Men teaching men in church as apposed to men teaching the spirit.

You said...

It is an abomination to the Lord if a man born of the spirit of God sits in church being converted into the flesh.

That is what it means.

It says lay because the spirit child is conceived that way threw the teachings.

If people judge gay as men with men they themselves are men with men and by their own judgement they have judged themselves and the proof is in their understanding of the matter.

'If a man lies with a male, as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination:


So your saying a man not born of the Spirit (who has his own understanding, which he has naturally as anyone does) until he is born of the Spirit is an abomination going to church where a man born of the Spirit is (or might be) and where a man who (perhaps) is still yet carnal in his understanding (might be) and both should be afraid any of church for fear (either one of then may bump into the other) because one of them will conceive a spirit child (if either open their mouth to teach the other) because its through a spiritual kind of homosexually (or ie being in contact with a human teacher) which is laying with him (in contrast to as with a woman). Thusly both should run from any church because both should be able to discern what you have judged this to mean and therefore either/or could get pregnant with a spirit child if either passes words from his lips and a teaching is present?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

in this passage it say

'If a man lies with a male, as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.'

does this mean God wants us to kill people who are gay? i find that insane, i feel that we are not to judge or take a life, that is God's job to take someones life away through natural cause or car accident or something, passages like these often make me nervous to continue to read the bible in fear of reading something else that ma cause me to over think it (i have OCD) one of the ten commandments also say thall shall not kill, but in this passage it is telling us to kill gays, i find this very contradictory, it also makes me think that the bible may have been altered in someways, im not against gays nor do i support them, what is your say about this passage?

P.S. it doesnt say anything about a women and women, does this mean being a lesbian isnt a sin?

The message is the wage of sin is death.

But the same God that said thou shalt not commit adultery, also said thou shalt not kill.

All judgment is given unto the Son(Word of God.)

But you must also keep in mind the Lord first shows things in the natural, to be a reflection of the greater spiritual.

Just as Jesus declared to lust in your heart after strange flesh is also considered a sin.

Also keep in mind there is a natural death(which is to the body), and there is a spiritual death(which is to the soul.)

All transgression of the law is sin, but grace comes by faith in Jesus Christ.

Those who do not accept the remission of sins by Grace through faith in Jesus Christ, shall die in their sins.

John 1:17
For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Those who love the Lord by faith shall keep his commandments, those who do not shall be judged by the law.

John 5:45
Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.

For it is determined for all men once to die, and then comes the judgment.

http://www.christianforums.com/passage/?search=John+5:44-46&version=KJV

 

[C R F]

You said...

It is an abomination to the Lord if a man born of the spirit of God sits in church being converted into the flesh.

That is what it means.

It says lay because the spirit child is conceived that way threw the teachings.

If people judge gay as men with men they themselves are men with men and by their own judgement they have judged themselves and the proof is in their understanding of the matter.

'If a man lies with a male, as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination:


So your saying a man not born of the Spirit (who has his own understanding, which he has naturally as anyone does) until he is born of the Spirit is an abomination going to church where a man born of the Spirit is (or might be) and where a man who (perhaps) is still yet carnal in his understanding (might be) and both should be afraid any of church for fear (either one of then may bump into the other) because one of them will conceive a spirit child (if either open their mouth to teach the other) because its through a spiritual kind of homosexually (or ie being in contact with a human teacher) which is laying with him (in contrast to as with a woman). Thusly both should run from any church because both should be able to discern what you have judged this to mean and therefore either/or could get pregnant with a spirit child if either passes words from his lips and a teaching is present?

Now your going way out in left field. If you are eating another man's teaching you are at his table and his church is his table when he teaches. It would be an abomination for an Israelite to eat at the table of the Egyptians or you could say it would be an an abomination for an Israelite to go to an Egyptian church and eat of those teachings. If you are born of the Spirit of God and eat of the grace and truth and go to church where the teach the law ( like moses ) that is the same abomination as men with men.

 

[Fireinfolding]

So the ordinances contained in the law of Moses itself are speaking of a man (under Moses) lying (which means eating) with a man under the grace of God is an abomination? And is as a man lieth with a man as with a woman?


　

 

[Fireinfolding]

So its not speaking of the natural use of a woman, but the spirtual use of (eating with) verses lying with?



Lev 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.


Romans 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.


Romans 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.


Romans 2:21 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.

Romans 2:2 But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things.


Genesis 19:4 But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:


Genesis 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.


Sodom = "burning"

2Peter 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;


Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.


Romans 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.　
　
　
Theres a few　
　
　
　
　
　

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

So its not speaking of the natural use of a woman, but the spirtual use of (eating with) verses lying with?



Lev 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.


Romans 1:27 And likewise alsothe men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one towardanother; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.


Romans 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they whichcommit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.


Romans 2:21 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.

Romans 2:2 But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things.


Genesis 19:4 But before theylay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:


Genesis 19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.


Sodom = "burning"

2Peter 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;


Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth foran example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.


Romans 1:27 And likewise alsothe men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one towardanother; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.　
　
　
Theres a few　
　
　
　
　
　

And why did they do such unnatural acts?

Romans 1:28
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

Thought I would throw in my .02 cents worth.

 

[Fireinfolding]

And why did they do such unnatural acts?

Romans 1:28
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

Thought I would throw in my .02 cents worth.

Agreed thats what it says

Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Which shows the same...

Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

Verses...

Phl 1:11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

 

[Hentenza]

It is an abomination to the Lord if a man born of the spirit of God sits in church being converted into the flesh. That is what it means. It says lay because the spirit child is conceived that way threw the teachings. If people judge gay as men with men they themselves are men with men and by their own judgement they have judged themselves and the proof is in their understanding of the matter.

This interpretation is completely foreign to the text and devoid of any semblance of hermeunetics. The context of Leviticus 20 supports the author's intended meaning which is to condemn the acts of men laying with men as if they were women. There is no connection with men born of the Spirit being converted to the flesh. The verse is addressing those that are of the flesh so they are past converting to such.

 

[razeontherock]

1) No, we are not to kill homosexuals

2) Hentenza, you answered that lesbianism is ok? (I think maybe that was inadvertent?)

 

[Fireinfolding]

Speaks of women with women before men with men likewise, but speaks of the natural use, or that which is against nature. In both places names it as fornication

Romans 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:

However back in Leviticus speaks of a man lying with a man AS with a woman.

 

[Hentenza]

2) Hentenza, you answered that lesbianism is ok? (I think maybe that was inadvertent?)

Thanks Bro. I misread the question and edited my post.

 

[razeontherock]