Perceivence said:
That is precisely what I was talking about. When I say "follow the law" I, like everyone else who knows what that phrase means, refer to following the Torah as the way of life. I speak of doing what the Torah commands one to do, of following its commandments, of following its law.
Let me answer that with you question below.
Perceivence said:
God gave the Jews the law as a prequel to Jesus. As for its purpose within that purpose, I do not know as yet. Based on what Paul was saying, it sounds as if the Jews thought it was a guideline that would eventually lead to righteousness.
Both Paul and Jesus have a big problem with the Jews who had turned Torah into legalism, in many cases adding many regulation to Gods simple law, making it so complex that no man could bear it. Some Jews thought (incorectly) that if they kept the laws they would win salvation. They missed some escential lessons. God saves us by faith outside of works o the law. Like Abraham, saved through aith. Then after being saved abraham was obedient to God perhaps in graditude for haing saved and blessing him
Perceivence said:
What's your defintion of legalism?
Legalism, is the process of using Gods Torah as a check list of things you mustr DO in order to gain salvation. A legalistic observance of Torah commands. Where keeping the law, obligates God to accept you like paying wages to a servant or doing his job. This is legalism.
Using the law correctly, as reproof establishing doctrine, for training in righteousness is what we should do. See II tim 3:16 It tells us what behaviors or practices are aceptable to God and which are not. As in the example of marrying a near relative, homosexuality,or how and when the Lord wants your attention for fellowship. Even the first gentiles to be saved were given orah instruction in how to separate from pagan practices and to observe some basic Kosher laws. See Act 15:20-21
Perceivence said:
If the Temple was still erected today and there were sacrifices for sin, would you believe that those are being sacrificed for your sins?
Sacrifices never did remove sin. The brought to light in rich object lesson what the cost of sin was. So I can not say how I or you for that matter might relate to them if they were still in operation. Long after the resurection, Paul took part in a nazzarite vow with a couple of other believers and provided their sacrifices in the temple as required by the law. So Paul still saw some realivance to them. He also was anxious to join the belevers in Jerusalem to take part in the feast days which of course would include emple sacrifices. In the Millennial Kingdom, the sacrifices and temple service will be re-instated. So you might want to think for youself, how will you deal with that. We all will have to rethink a few things. Me included.
Perceivence said:
And you choose to follow him by following the letter of the law?
Not by letter of the law, beause Paul uses that term in relationship to legalism. I follow Torah as a guideline for my life. I do this joyfully because it is done freely out of my love for the Lord. I am able to take part in te same things that the Lord himself did and what the disciple did. I can live as they lived to a great extent, except for this coputer and that TV over there. There are many things that a rabinical Jew does that I do not do. I am biblical Messianic. For example on Sabath the Jews light candles and they say a prayer (the woman) which says hat the Lord has commaded us to light the shabbat candles. Well that is not true. God didn't tell us light shabbat candles. It is simply a tradition which grew out of a need to transfer the lost temple service to the home and synagogue. I do not deny them their doing this. In fact it is quite beautiful, beause it realy helps separate the sabbath as a special day, just as refraing from work, and using the finest table setting and wearing nice cloths and going to synagogue. But I do not take part in the candle cerimony simply beause it is not biblical and not a commandment as stated in the prayer.
Perceivence said:
I am fully aware of Jesus' direct message and the Holy Spirit's message through Paul. I know that Jesus came to fulfill the law, that the law was instituted until Jesus' arrival. I know that Jesus has come, died, been resurrected and has ascended to heaven. Thus, I know that I am no longer under the law.
Read Matt 5:17 again. Yeshua says that he did not come to destroy the prophets or the law. Destroy in the Greek means "to rend ineffective, to make null, to abolish, to make of no function". (see strongs) So he did not make the law or prophets of no effect. Now most believers will say that he put an end to the law, but they believe all the prophecy is still for today. duplistic thinking. Then Yeshua goes on to say, I have not come to destroy but to fulfil. Fulil in the Greek means "to bring to it full measure, to fill up, to make full to supply liberally, to correctly interpret". So. we see that is what he did.
and christians agree that he is speaking of the Old testament laws no arguement with that, But Jesus goes on to say, "for whosover breaks the least of one of these commandments and teaches others to do the same shall be the least in the kingdom of heaven".. Now the christian usually changes his opinion and says that he is now speaking of HIS own commandments and not the OT.
No he is speaking of the OT all the way through the passage.
Yeshua sets the law back on track. He discredits legalism, and makes the law something that speaks to the heart in spirit. It is in this way that I follow the law. Just as Jesus and Paul for that matter explained the law.
CIF
Just wondering...
