l would lie

[Mrs.Sidhe]

I would obey, but an order of that nature would have to come directly from the Pope.

I have a question about this...

I understand that the Pope is looked upon as the Vicar of Christ and the leader of the Catholic Church and his statements made on faith and morals are infallible..

However, this is not a matter of faith and morals. Given that there have unfortunately been "Anti-Popes" in history, wouldn't you question the integrity of a man who has ordered you to kill a child?

 

[JesusWalks78]

Are you saying if the Pope sais for you to kill a child, you would do it since its coming from the Pope?

Yes.

How in any possible way can the Pope be above God's law and ordain a murder??? [/quote

The Pope has the power to loose and bind, he would just have loosed that childs life.

If in such one would occur based on what you stated. And it would be murder. And by the pope saying so, that makes it ok? I am really really curious about this.

Murder in this case, I guess so......but I am sure that God had his reasons for wanting the child gone.

Now, by what argument could/would you use in court to defend your action of killing a child based soley on some man's saying that its ok?? The only thing that comes to my mind and its the only thing is the so-called "Nuremberg Defence". And that didnt work so well for those trying to use it.

I would use whatever defence the Pope said I should.

 

[JesusWalks78]

Hang on. You'd kill a child if you were told to by the Pope?? I have been frightened by some things I've seen on these forums but this has to be the worst. Some things are just wrong no matter what other people have to say about it. And this is one of them.

I guess that is youropinion and you are entitled to it.

 

[JesusWalks78]

I have a question about this...

I understand that the Pope is looked upon as the Vicar of Christ and the leader of the Catholic Church and his statements made on faith and morals are infallible..

However, this is not a matter of faith and morals. Given that there have unfortunately been "Anti-Popes" in history, wouldn't you question the integrity of a man who has ordered you to kill a child?

I wouldnt question God, and God in his omniscience would have forseen it.....I have faith that for whatever reason that the child had to die, it had to die.

Sure I could be wrong, but would the sin be mine...or the Popes?

 

[Mrs.Sidhe]

And what if you and the Pope where wrong? What then? The Pope is a human..a human is capable of making mistakes.

 

[JesusWalks78]

And what if you and the Pope where wrong? What then?

There would be one dead child.

The Pope is a human..a human is capable of making mistakes.

Not in his official office.

 

[Mrs.Sidhe]

I assume you know the Pope is only infallible on matters of Faith and Morals? How would the killing of a child being a matter of faith and morals?

Also, exactly where does it say just because a person is elected the Pope that they are all of a sudden not a human capable of making human mistakes?

 

[justanobserver]

Originally Posted by justanobserver

Are you saying if the Pope sais for you to kill a child, you would do it since its coming from the Pope?

Yes.

How in any possible way can the Pope be above God's law and ordain a murder???

The Pope has the power to loose and bind, he would just have loosed that childs life.

If in such one would occur based on what you stated. And it would be murder. And by the pope saying so, that makes it ok? I am really really curious about this.

Murder in this case, I guess so......but I am sure that God had his reasons for wanting the child gone.

Now, by what argument could/would you use in court to defend your action of killing a child based soley on some man's saying that its ok?? The only thing that comes to my mind and its the only thing is the so-called "Nuremberg Defence". And that didnt work so well for those trying to use it.

I would use whatever defence the Pope said I should.

The Nuremburg defence is based on the argument that the nazis tried to use in their crimes against humanity/genocide trial after WW2 - "I was only following orders" and am not responsible.

Am not calling you a nazi - please dont think that - but the argument you are using to kill a child at the Pope's request reminds of of this one example and its the only thing I can think that one could try to use to try to justify to the murdering of a child.


This mindset troubles me very very deeply.

 

[rosewaning]

If I was living alone, I may lie to save the child's life, depending on the circumstances. However, if I had a husband, or children living there with me, I absolutely would not lie (directly). I have no right to put their lives at risk for the life of a stranger. I would do everything I could to help the child.

 

[Mling]

This mindset troubles me very very deeply.

I believe that nearly all atrocities which have occured in the world are the result of this mindset. The Tuskegee Study, the Holocaust...anything you can think of.
How difficult would it have been to convince every person involved in these things that what they were doing was ultimately good, if each person was being careful to evaluate the situation and come to an informed decision?
How much easier was it, in reality, to convince people that they just had to just do what they were told? As Dumbledore says, ultimately, we must all make a decision between what is right, and what is easy. It is much easier to believe that somebody else will take the responsibility for your actions and just do what you were told, rather than evaluate the situation, do what is right and accept the consequences of your own choices--Milgrim showed us that much.