Kerry on 2nd amendment

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Stat101 said:
I have not had any formal training with guns, yet I have never injured myself with a gun. I read a news article where a cop blew his brains out with a shotgun while taking it out of his squad car.

This is not about individuals but about the whole. Perhaps you're competent or lucky or an accident waiting to happen, I don't know. And of course some cops or soldiers have accidents. But I'll wager the statistics behind firearm accidents would show it is unqualified people who have the highest rates of firearm accidents.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Stat101 said:
Booze and guns don't mix

Duh! But that doesn't stop drunks messing around with guns. Jayson Williams anyone?

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

I don't believe in luck and I treat guns with respect. They are similar to chain saws or other tools. If you don't respect them, they can hurt or kill you. I'm a Statistician by profession and statistics can be manipulated to prove any point

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

Same with cars

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

No stats cannot be made to prove any point. You can shade an argument with stats but if the numbers are overwhelming one way you cannot paint an opposite. Change the degree of an effect yes, wholesale change no. The only way that is accomplished is by duping the uneducated.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Stat101 said:
Same with cars

This is a terrible analogy because cars are made for a purpose and it is using them incorrectly that deaths occur. Guns are made to kill people (well handguns are.) If used correctly they kill people, it's only when they are used poorly they don't do that.

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

Exactly

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

I have 5 handguns of various calibers and I have never killed anyone.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Why do you need 5? You get lonely if one is not within 10 feet?

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

Various calibers, they are kinda like shoes. They serve different purposes. I plan on buying more in the future.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Stat101 said:
Various calibers, their are kinda like shoes. They serve different purposes. I plan on buying more in the future.

LOL. Different purposes? If they are handguns they have one purpose. I take it you are male. What's that phallus substitute argument I've heard?

Hey as I said before, I am not particularly against ownership but I laugh when people claim it maintains their freedom and they are also not willing to admit that America to satisfy it's gun obsession also has to put up with a crazy murder rate of it's citizens. Such a caring place.

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

Yes I am male and you must be female. " phallus substitute? "
Most of the murders committed in this country are either drug related or the person is killed by someone they know. Crazy murder rate, well maybe, but it's actually going down.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Drug related I wouldn't be so sure. Someone they know, undoubtedly. This is probably true of every crime in the book. Yes the murder rate has dropped, Wow and coinciding with more curbs on gun ownership in the last 20 years. Duh. That's a shock isn't it.

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

Gun ownership is at an all time high, more than 260 million estimated.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Ah here goes the stats we talked about. Come on if you are a statistician (and I use statistics in my job all the time) then you know that since the population is greater than ever is one factor, that guns usually don't disappear and people collect them (like you) but the number of gun owners as a percentage of the adult population may have not gone up. Also certain groups are more prone to gun violence or accidents than others. Ah, statistics.

Walther · Sep 8, 2004

I'm a Christian. I'm a gun owner. I'm an American. I'm a husband. I'm a father.

Do I want to live... want my wife to live... my child to live... friends, Americans, Christians, anyone to ever need a gun? No. If we lived in a time and in a place where I could go to the mall and not fear for my safety I would love it. If my wife could go to work and me not have to pray all day for her so as to not fear for her in the safety of a Christian school, I would be ever thankful. I dare not even think of the world where my daughter will have to grow up.

The Bible says there is a time and season to everything under heaven. Reading that passage of scripture makes me think that there is indeed and time and place for everything. With that, here is my two cents.

I advocate gun ownership, gun awareness, gun saftey. I also advocate regulation. To my CCW, firearm loving brothers and sisters - please don't write me off quite yet.

I don't believe everyone should be able to own a weapon. I don't believe anyone should own every type of weapon. I think some weapons are best left to those sworn to protect us, but at the same time there are times when we need to be able to protect ourselves. I don't think it's right to make every weapon owner to register their weapons. Most people who own and carry weapons legally don't even talk about it, many people around them besides their immediate friends and family don't even know. One reason is out of respect, and two is because Americans have been taught to fear guns. People should not fear guns. People should fear people with ill will because even if you pulled every gun off the street, criminals would still find weapons for their purpose.

I think reform does need to come to current gun legislation. The assault weapons ban is ****. I have seen guns available in stores more dangerous than some banned weapons. But our founding fathers gave us the right to keep and bear arms to protect ourselves from any tyranny that could threaten our freedom and right to that freedom. I pray noone on this forum would ever have to face down someone intent on taking their life, and their families life simply because of their faith or the failings of their country, but that is what terrorists are trying to do - and if a terrorist, or a criminal wants to take the life of my family by whatever means neccesary I want someway to defend my family. It doesn't take a bazooka, or a tank - though I do like things that to BOOM! for entertainment, that doesn't mean I need one - it doesn't take a fully automatic gun, either. But I sure would like another options besides watching my wife and unborn daughter killed by a bullet while I'm holding a knife all because people have been taught to fear something and not respect it.

Tachocline · Sep 8, 2004

Walther said:
I'm a Christian. I'm a gun owner. I'm an American. I'm a husband. I'm a father.

Do I want to live... want my wife to live... my child to live... friends, Americans, Christians, anyone to ever need a gun? No. If we lived in a time and in a place where I could go to the mall and not fear for my safety I would love it. If my wife could go to work and me not have to pray all day for her so as to not fear for her in the safety of a Christian school, I would be ever thankful. I dare not even think of the world where my daughter will have to grow up.

The Bible says there is a time and season to everything under heaven. Reading that passage of scripture makes me think that there is indeed and time and place for everything. With that, here is my two cents.

I advocate gun ownership, gun awareness, gun saftey. I also advocate regulation. To my CCW, firearm loving brothers and sisters - please don't write me off quite yet.

I don't believe everyone should be able to own a weapon. I don't believe anyone should own every type of weapon. I think some weapons are best left to those sworn to protect us, but at the same time there are times when we need to be able to protect ourselves. I don't think it's right to make every weapon owner to register their weapons. Most people who own and carry weapons legally don't even talk about it, many people around them besides their immediate friends and family don't even know. One reason is out of respect, and two is because Americans have been taught to fear guns. People should not fear guns. People should fear people with ill will because even if you pulled every gun off the street, criminals would still find weapons for their purpose.

I think reform does need to come to current gun legislation. The assault weapons ban is ****. I have seen guns available in stores more dangerous than some banned weapons. But our founding fathers gave us the right to keep and bear arms to protect ourselves from any tyranny that could threaten our freedom and right to that freedom. I pray noone on this forum would ever have to face down someone intent on taking their life, and their families life simply because of their faith or the failings of their country, but that is what terrorists are trying to do - and if a terrorist, or a criminal wants to take the life of my family by whatever means neccesary I want someway to defend my family. It doesn't take a bazooka, or a tank - though I do like things that to BOOM! for entertainment, that doesn't mean I need one - it doesn't take a fully automatic gun, either. But I sure would like another options besides watching my wife and unborn daughter killed by a bullet while I'm holding a knife all because people have been taught to fear something and not respect it.

I don't disagree with most of this.

InnerPhyre · Sep 8, 2004

I used to live in Washington DC. It has the highest murder rate and the strictest gun control laws in the US. All the criminals have guns and the average citizens have no way of defending themselves.

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

Guns hold their value better than most items. That 260 million was an estimate made by the ATF who are supposed to be the experts. People are injured by everyday items and guns make up a very small percentage. Yes these are statistics, but they come from the government, who is hopefully not too biased.

Stat101 · Sep 8, 2004

The Brady campaign ranks states based on gun laws, with A being the most strict and F being the most gun friendly. Funny how the states with the most stringent laws have the highest murder rates.

Kerry on 2nd amendment

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Active Member

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency