Just for final clarification yes, we evolved from monkeys.

USincognito · Sep 25, 2016

rjs330 said:
Why do chimps have similar DNA to,humans? Because God,made them that way so they can use the functions given to them by God. God made them with hands and feet and eyes and brains that have some similarities to humans.

Ah, the ad hoc "common design" fallacy. Tell us rjs, if God used common design, how do we falsify that proposition? In order to be scientific we need a potential falsification. I can think of thousands of potential falsifications for common descent, but I can't think of any for common design because it's ad hoc and can explain everything.

Also, in order to be scientific, it needs have explanatory power beyond childishly obvious assertions. For instance you need to explain why God inserted 203,000 endogenous retroviruses into the human and chimp genomes in such a way that mimics common ancestry. You also need to explain why all primates have a broken GULO gene that is broken in the exact same way. You need to explain why placental mammals have gene remnants for yolk sac production. You need to explain why whales have a broken gene package for hind leg development and why embryonic whales develop hind limb buds in utero, etc. etc. etc.

Warden_of_the_Storm · Sep 25, 2016

rjs330 said:
All you have to do is read the stuff they put out. Not one thing they say is shown to be fact of common ancestor. They have not ever been able to say what the common ancestor was or found actual evidence of one. Fossil evidence has huge holes in it. There is nothing happening today that shows anything is evolving into something other than what it always was and is. Using DNA and genetics similarities to try and show that evolution from,a,common ancestor completely ignores the vast differences between creatures that exist precisely because of DNA. Evolution ignores 2nd law of Thermodynamics then claims it doesn't apply to "open systems" because of introduced energy. While completely ignoring that the sun would,actually hinder life of it introduced more energy and,cannot show that this ever occurred. Assumptions again. Its all it is. They will accept everything as evidence and ignore all the things that say it,couldn't happen.

Look I really have no issue with that. If they want to believe that, go ahead. I don't really mind. But don't foist it upon all of us as if it was fact. Just like I believe that God created all things fully formed at the time of creation but can't prove it, so the same goes for them and evolution. All the things they profess as evidence of evolution can equally be applied to common design and an intelligent designer. That God used a common design to create because he wanted all nature to work together to exist together to make an incredible world where all things work together to make life continue to exist.

Why do chimps have similar DNA to,humans? Because God,made them that way so they can use the functions given to them by God. God made them with hands and feet and eyes and brains that have some similarities to humans. But he also created the differences so they can't build cities, discover electricity, build complex machines, write amazing works of fiction and sculpt and paint beautiful works of art. It's all so obvious to me. Just like evolution is obvious to,evolutionists. But I can't definitely prove it by the evidence and they can't either.

All you have shown in this post is that you truly know nothing about science. In fact, the moment you said that evolution violates the Second Law of Thermodynamics, which is most certainly does not, shows me that you really have no intent to have an actual discussion about science or evolution.

4x4toy · Sep 25, 2016

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
All you have shown in this post is that you truly know nothing about science. In fact, the moment you said that evolution violates the Second Law of Thermodynamics, which is most certainly does not, shows me that you really have no intent to have an actual discussion about science or evolution.

Yet you believe soft tissue found in a T-Rex bone is 200 million yrs old ? Or Polonium Halos could exist in granite formed out of molten state , or that kinds only produce kinds according to information found only within boundaries of their DNA , or instincts such as migration to particular places on Earth not learned from parents . And what science does hundreds of fulfilled Prophesy recorded years before it happened that even includes specific names and places fall under ?

Warden_of_the_Storm · Sep 25, 2016

4x4toy said:
Yet you believe soft tissue found in a T-Rex bone is 200 million yrs old ? Or Polonium Halos could exist in granite formed out of molten state , or that kinds only produce kinds according to information found only within boundaries of their DNA , or instincts such as migration to particular places on Earth not learned from parents . And what science does hundreds of fulfilled Prophesy recorded years before it happened that even includes specific names and places fall under ?

I don't care that you don't accept that any of that happens and I don't care that you believe in so-called prophecies. Your own personal incredulity doesn't mean squat.

pat34lee · Sep 25, 2016

Common human ancestor (Noah)
http://www.foxnews.com/story/2006/0...ancestor-all-humans-lived-5000-years-ago.html

4x4toy · Sep 25, 2016

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
I don't care that you don't accept that any of that happens and I don't care that you believe in so-called prophecies. Your own personal incredulity doesn't mean squat.

Here's a question .. When a person goes to hell where do they tell people to go ?

SteveB28 · Sep 25, 2016

rjs330 said:
All you have to do is read the stuff they put out. Not one thing they say is shown to be fact of common ancestor. They have not ever been able to say what the common ancestor was or found actual evidence of one. Fossil evidence has huge holes in it. There is nothing happening today that shows anything is evolving into something other than what it always was and is. Using DNA and genetics similarities to try and show that evolution from,a,common ancestor completely ignores the vast differences between creatures that exist precisely because of DNA. Evolution ignores 2nd law of Thermodynamics then claims it doesn't apply to "open systems" because of introduced energy. While completely ignoring that the sun would,actually hinder life of it introduced more energy and,cannot show that this ever occurred. Assumptions again. Its all it is. They will accept everything as evidence and ignore all the things that say it,couldn't happen.

Look I really have no issue with that. If they want to believe that, go ahead. I don't really mind. But don't foist it upon all of us as if it was fact. Just like I believe that God created all things fully formed at the time of creation but can't prove it, so the same goes for them and evolution. All the things they profess as evidence of evolution can equally be applied to common design and an intelligent designer. That God used a common design to create because he wanted all nature to work together to exist together to make an incredible world where all things work together to make life continue to exist.

Why do chimps have similar DNA to,humans? Because God,made them that way so they can use the functions given to them by God. God made them with hands and feet and eyes and brains that have some similarities to humans. But he also created the differences so they can't build cities, discover electricity, build complex machines, write amazing works of fiction and sculpt and paint beautiful works of art. It's all so obvious to me. Just like evolution is obvious to,evolutionists. But I can't definitely prove it by the evidence and they can't either.

Explain the identical ERV locations we share with chimpanzees.

.

Warden_of_the_Storm · Sep 25, 2016

4x4toy said:
Here's a question .. When a person goes to hell where do they tell people to go ?

Since the topic of this thread is about science, I've no interest in apologetics.

4x4toy · Sep 25, 2016

Warden_of_the_Storm said:
Since the topic of this thread is about science, I've no interest in apologetics.

You're more fun than a barrel of monkeys .. Not !!! lol

Warden_of_the_Storm · Sep 25, 2016

4x4toy said:
You're more fun than a barrel of monkeys .. Not !!! lol

Just following the rules. Don't like it? Tough toenails.

USincognito · Sep 25, 2016

4x4toy said:
Yet you believe soft tissue found in a T-Rex bone is 200 million yrs old ? Or Polonium Halos could exist in granite formed out of molten state , or that kinds only produce kinds according to information found only within boundaries of their DNA , or instincts such as migration to particular places on Earth not learned from parents . And what science does hundreds of fulfilled Prophesy recorded years before it happened that even includes specific names and places fall under ?

Oh dear, not a bunch of PRATTs (and you even get those wrong).

MOR-1125 (the dinosaur from which Schweitzer was able to extract the collagen fragments) is 67 million years old, not 200 million. And I don't know why Creationists are still talking about it. The collagen demonstrated that birds are descended from theropod dinosaurs.
https://news.ncsu.edu/2008/04/prote...show-evolutionary-relationships-of-dinosaurs/

She provided samples of collagen from the bone to her colleagues Dr. John Asara at Harvard Medical School and Beth Israel Deaconness Medical Center, and Dr. Chris Organ of the department of organismic and evolutionary biology at Harvard. Asara sequenced the protein, and found similarities between the peptides extracted from T. rex collagen protein fragments and those of modern-day chickens.

The researchers then conducted multiple phylogenetic analyses by comparing the sequence data from T. rex and a mastodon fossil, to a database of sequence data from 19 animals, including living animals. The results place the non-avian T. rex within the class Archosauria between the ancestors of modern-day alligators and their avian relatives, the modern-day chicken. The mastodon, as expected, was found to be a relative of modern elephants, proving that the genetic material was authentic, and that trait evolution can be traced at the molecular level.

Gentry's polonium halos were debunked long ago.
http://apps.usd.edu/esci/creation/age/content/creationist_clocks/polonium_halos.html

And please provide us with a definition of "kinds" that has both explanatory and predictive power.

rjs330 · Sep 25, 2016

SteveB28 said:
Explain the identical ERV locations we share with chimpanzees.

.

Because there are similiarities. However there are great differences too. Accept the,similarities and dismiss the differences. That's fine. But don't say it shows a common ancestor when the,differences are so,significant.

4x4toy · Sep 25, 2016

USincognito said:
Oh dear, not a bunch of PRATTs (and you even get those wrong).

MOR-1125 (the dinosaur from which Schweitzer was able to extract the collagen fragments) is 67 million years old, not 200 million. And I don't know why Creationists are still talking about it. The collagen demonstrated that birds are descended from theropod dinosaurs.
https://news.ncsu.edu/2008/04/prote...show-evolutionary-relationships-of-dinosaurs/

She provided samples of collagen from the bone to her colleagues Dr. John Asara at Harvard Medical School and Beth Israel Deaconness Medical Center, and Dr. Chris Organ of the department of organismic and evolutionary biology at Harvard. Asara sequenced the protein, and found similarities between the peptides extracted from T. rex collagen protein fragments and those of modern-day chickens.

The researchers then conducted multiple phylogenetic analyses by comparing the sequence data from T. rex and a mastodon fossil, to a database of sequence data from 19 animals, including living animals. The results place the non-avian T. rex within the class Archosauria between the ancestors of modern-day alligators and their avian relatives, the modern-day chicken. The mastodon, as expected, was found to be a relative of modern elephants, proving that the genetic material was authentic, and that trait evolution can be traced at the molecular level.

Gentry's polonium halos were debunked long ago.
http://apps.usd.edu/esci/creation/age/content/creationist_clocks/polonium_halos.html

And please provide us with a definition of "kinds" that has both explanatory and predictive power.[/INDENT]

Ya think that T-Rex was learning to fly and the accident killed him 67 million yrs ago ?

USincognito · Sep 25, 2016

4x4toy said:
Ya think that T-Rex was learning to fly and the accident killed him 67 million yrs ago ?

You think this response made sense? Why don't you try again.

4x4toy · Sep 25, 2016

USincognito said:
You think this response made sense? Why don't you try again.

How about he learned to fly but didn't know how to land yet and his testicles hung down farther than his feet complicating the problem .. Better ?

USincognito · Sep 25, 2016

4x4toy said:
How about he learned to fly but didn't know how to land yet and his testicles hung down farther than his feet complicating the problem .. Better ?

How about you go play in your sandbox and let the adults have a conversation?

4x4toy · Sep 25, 2016

USincognito said:
How about you go play in your sandbox and let the adults have a conversation?

It's raining and mom won't let me ..

USincognito · Sep 25, 2016

pat34lee said:
Common human ancestor (Noah)
http://www.foxnews.com/story/2006/0...ancestor-all-humans-lived-5000-years-ago.html

That article (and the paper it's based on) are problematic. First off their analysis was not based on genetics, but on statistics. It also doesn't take into account that there was a large population in reproductive isolation from about 12,000 years ago - Native Americans. There's no way for them to thus have a shared common ancestor 5,000 years ago. Spencer Wells did some actual genetic work and concluded the human MRCA lived in Africa 60,000 years ago.

And did you actually read the article? It doesn't claim that there was a single individual. Their calculations are based on counting members of family trees backwards.

USincognito · Sep 25, 2016

rjs330 said:
Because there are similiarities.

Have you not been paying attention? Species don't share 203,000 ERVs because they are merely similar. They share them because they are related. Do we need to give you the Little Golden Book version to help you understand?

rjs330 said:
However there are great differences too. Accept the,similarities and dismiss the differences. That's fine. But don't say it shows a common ancestor when the,differences are so,significant.

You're still conflating human technology with biology. Biologically we are much more similar to chimpanzees than we are different.

SteveB28 · Sep 25, 2016

rjs330 said:
Because there are similiarities. However there are great differences too. Accept the,similarities and dismiss the differences. That's fine. But don't say it shows a common ancestor when the,differences are so,significant.

"Similarities"...????

There are over 200,000 of those IDENTICAL LOCATIONS, in a genome containing 3 BILLION possible location sites!

The probability of all of those insertions lining up with a 99.98% level of accuracy is approximately 1:9x10^13...!!

In other words, for all practical purposes, it's virtually impossible!

The ONLY viable explanation is that both ourselves and chimpanzees have a common genetic link. It is through that link that these insertion remnants have been passed down.

It is the same process by which we can be 99% sure that you are your father's son.....!

Just for final clarification yes, we evolved from monkeys.

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