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Judge Not Lest ye be Judged.

Discussion in 'Struggles by Non-Christians' started by AservantofGodandthelordJC, Jan 23, 2018.

  1. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    Almost everything you perceive is a judgement, every belief and opinion. It is all yours, there is only one reality, one truth which does not differ from person to person.

    “ 'If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them.' Luke 6:32"
     
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  2. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member

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    There is nothing wrong with making a judgement, provided one judges rightly and are prepared toi be judged to a similar standard.
     
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  3. com7fy8

    com7fy8 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I think when Jesus says not to judge, He means to not permanently condemn someone as having no hope.

    But He also says to use good judgment >

    "'Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment.'" (John 7:24)
     
  4. Phil 1:21

    Phil 1:21 Well-Known Member

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    This is why context is important. Folks like to throw around Matthew 7:1 as if it's a call to suspend discernment. "Who are you to tell me XYZ is wrong? Jesus said not to judge others!" It's not a call to tolerate sin. It's a call to refrain from censorious judgement. There's a huge difference.
     
  5. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    You are all finding excuses to grant value to judgement over forgiveness, this is precisely the reason so many are Godless and entirely blind to the truth.

    If you have never performed a real miracle, then you do not know God.. so why pretend? Why pretend your beliefs are real? Because they are established and shared by your peers? You should not utilize belief to think you're right, you should use it to think you're wrong.

    Anyone who is aware of the truth will agree with everything I say 100% because we all share it. It just completely blows my mind how the religious argue over fairy tales.. I'm not saying the bible is a fairy tale, but there are false beliefs in place like immovable stones, sinking the whole ship.

    Its like a scientist who just makes theory's but never sets out to prove them, what is the point other than to feed your sin. Death itself is a belief, you cannot die but physical death will not automatically save you from yourself. Getting to heaven is the same as ascending like Jesus and Elijah, you can do it before or after death but it is your responsibility either way.

    It's so convenient for your ego, your sin to just say 'I believe so I'm saved!' You could also believe that all the water in the world will turn into honey tommorro, what good is that? There's a difference between the fantasy worlds of religions and reality you need to realize this.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2018
  6. Unofficial Reverand Alex

    Unofficial Reverand Alex Look up Jason Evert on YouTube; he changed my life Supporter

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    You must remember that many different Christians have many different beliefs; last I heard, there was over 35,000 different denominations, and individuals within a denomination can have different beliefs & levels of knowledge about their faith.
    The Bible is a complicated book, filled with writing from many different authors over many different centuries across 3 different languages, none of which were English. Some Christians believe that all you need to do is believe in JC, and you'll be saved; others believe that good works are also necessary. To make the right call here, one must do a bit of research into the Bible, the context of these verses, and so on. Bible study is a complicated field; that's what makes it so much fun! (Spoken as someone who plans to be a Professor of Theology).
    Overall, you are guilty of, and many Christians of every denomination are guilty of, a simplified look on the Bible. The Bible isn't simple; you can't make it simple. The 10 commandments are the only things written in stone, and the foundation of Jesus' teachings is love: "A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another." (John 13:34) Also refer to Matthew 22:36-40, where Jesus teaches the greatest commandments, both centered on love. Simple points can be drawn from the Bible, but you can't just swing out individual verses, or certain beliefs by certain Christians, and "disprove" Christianity from that. Much time & effort must be put in to obtain a deep understanding of the Bible; I highly advise you, if you're so adamantly against Christianity, to do a deep Bible study and prove it wrong; almost everyone who has, has since converted.
     
  7. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    The bible and religion may not be simple, but what Jesus was trying to teach, the Truth is simple. So extremely simple which is why so many are blind to it, it is the base of reality, it is always there, before your thoughts before your opinions and beliefs. It never changes.

    See you say you have all kinds of different beliefs, but there is only 1 truth so only real belief you should hold is that you are unaware of the Truth but can see it for yourself if you followed God and not believe you know anything about God until you do beyond doubt. Faith and belief are meant as tools to get to God, not to hold onto guesses and think they're right.

    You can make up any belief you want to, the sun is jello, fish can talk, air is made of cotton candy.. That's what religious beliefs look like to me, they entirely disregard actual reality for their own false beliefs.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2018
  8. Kristen Davis

    Kristen Davis Member

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    Yes what your saying reminds me of Ephesians where it states that you should not care to be menpleasers but instead god pleasers who do things whether you are their or not.
     
  9. AvgJoe

    AvgJoe Member since 2005 Supporter

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    Question: "What does the Bible mean that we are not to judge others?"

    Answer:
    Jesus’ command not to judge others could be the most widely quoted of His sayings, even though it is almost invariably quoted in complete disregard of its context. Here is Jesus’ statement: “Do not judge, or you too will be judged” (Matthew 7:1). Many people use this verse in an attempt to silence their critics, interpreting Jesus’ meaning as “You don’t have the right to tell me I’m wrong.” Taken in isolation, Jesus’ command “Do not judge” does indeed seem to preclude all negative assessments. However, there is much more to the passage than those three words.

    The Bible’s command that we not judge others does not mean we cannot show discernment. Immediately after Jesus says, “Do not judge,” He says, “Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs” (Matthew 7:6). A little later in the same sermon, He says, “Watch out for false prophets. . . . By their fruit you will recognize them” (verses 15–16). How are we to discern who are the “dogs” and “pigs” and “false prophets” unless we have the ability to make a judgment call on doctrines and deeds? Jesus is giving us permission to tell right from wrong.

    Also, the Bible’s command that we not judge others does not mean all actions are equally moral or that truth is relative. The Bible clearly teaches that truth is objective, eternal, and inseparable from God’s character. Anything that contradicts the truth is a lie—but, of course, to call something a “lie” is to pass judgment. To call adultery or murder a sin is likewise to pass judgment—but it’s also to agree with God. When Jesus said not to judge others, He did not mean that no one can identify sin for what it is, based on God’s definition of sin.

    And the Bible’s command that we not judge others does not mean there should be no mechanism for dealing with sin. The Bible has a whole book entitled Judges. The judges in the Old Testament were raised up by God Himself (Judges 2:18). The modern judicial system, including its judges, is a necessary part of society. In saying, “Do not judge,” Jesus was not saying, “Anything goes.”

    Elsewhere, Jesus gives a direct command to judge: “Stop judging by mere appearances, but instead judge correctly” (John 7:24). Here we have a clue as to the right type of judgment versus the wrong type. Taking this verse and some others, we can put together a description of the sinful type of judgment:

    Superficial judgment is wrong. Passing judgment on someone based solely on appearances is sinful (John 7:24). It is foolish to jump to conclusions before investigating the facts (Proverbs 18:13). Simon the Pharisee passed judgment on a woman based on her appearance and reputation, but he could not see that the woman had been forgiven; Simon thus drew Jesus’ rebuke for his unrighteous judgment (Luke 7:36–50).

    Hypocritical judgment is wrong. Jesus’ command not to judge others in Matthew 7:1 is preceded by comparisons to hypocrites (Matthew 6:2, 5, 16) and followed by a warning against hypocrisy (Matthew 7:3–5). When we point out the sin of others while we ourselves commit the same sin, we condemn ourselves (Romans 2:1).

    Harsh, unforgiving judgment is wrong. We are “always to be gentle toward everyone” (Titus 3:2). It is the merciful who will be shown mercy (Matthew 5:7), and, as Jesus warned, “In the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you” (Matthew 7:2).

    Self-righteous judgment is wrong. We are called to humility, and “God opposes the proud” (James 4:6). The Pharisee in Jesus’ parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector was confident in his own righteousness and from that proud position judged the publican; however, God sees the heart and refused to forgive the Pharisee’s sin (Luke 18:9–14).

    Untrue judgment is wrong. The Bible clearly forbids bearing false witness (Proverbs 19:5). “Slander no one” (Titus 3:2).

    Christians are often accused of “judging” or intolerance when they speak out against sin. But opposing sin is not wrong. Holding aloft the standard of righteousness naturally defines unrighteousness and draws the slings and arrows of those who choose sin over godliness. John the Baptist incurred the ire of Herodias when he spoke out against her adultery with Herod (Mark 6:18–19). She eventually silenced John, but she could not silence the truth (Isaiah 40:8).

    Believers are warned against judging others unfairly or unrighteously, but Jesus commends “right judgment” (John 7:24, ESV). We are to be discerning (Colossians 1:9; 1 Thessalonians 5:21). We are to preach the whole counsel of God, including the Bible’s teaching on sin (Acts 20:27; 2 Timothy 4:2). We are to gently confront erring brothers or sisters in Christ (Galatians 6:1). We are to practice church discipline (Matthew 18:15–17). We are to speak the truth in love (Ephesians 4:15).

    www.gotquestions.org/do-not-judge.html
     
  10. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    That is a good copy paste, however again overly complicating a simple thing. Choose forgiveness over judgement in every circumstance, that is the path to righteousness. People try so hard to understand/learn reading and reading and reading, instead of simply doing.
     
  11. AvgJoe

    AvgJoe Member since 2005 Supporter

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    It's a thorough answer to what the Bible has to say on the matter.
     
  12. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    It does not matter what the bible says if misinterpreted. There is what the bible says, then there is reality.. if you rely on religious interpretations then you are relying on fiction or theory to be correct without evidence. If you do not believe evidence exists then you will never find it, we have free will.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2018
  13. iEye

    iEye Captain

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    You can do a thing only if you have the belief that it can be done.
    ~ Anonymous

    Fly me to the moon...
     
  14. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    The whole purpose of faith is to find evidence. The belief that one will go directly to heaven after death is a fairy tale, the only way that will happen is if you are already in heaven before death. It is like believing a broken car will magically be fixed by blowing it up, not by actually fixing it.
     
  15. iEye

    iEye Captain

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    Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.—Hebrews 11:1
     
  16. aiki

    aiki Regular Member

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    And how do you know this, exactly?

    Yes, and? Simply doing what, exactly?

    Sure it matters. We can't know if a passage has been misinterpreted if we don't check an interpretation against what the Bible says.

    Says who? The Bible reveals ultimate reality to us. You ignore it at your peril.

    Says who? How do you know this?

    ??? Who in this thread has said that they don't believe evidence?

    Again, says who? And how do you know this is correct?

    Sorry to sound like a broken record, but who says? How do you know any of what you've said here is true?
     
  17. Soyeong

    Soyeong Well-Known Member

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    There are many verses where we are told to judge righteously, such as John 7:24. A little later in the chapter in Matthew 7:15-20, we are told to judge someone by their fruit. In Galatians 6:1, we are to gently restore someone who is caught in sin, which can't be done without judging that they are caught in sin. So the issue is not that we aren't supposed to judge, but that we are to judge righteously because the same standard that we use to judge others will be used to judge us.
     
  18. theanticrash

    theanticrash New Member

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    I refute Jesus wisdom here.

    It is not healthy to love people who hate you, but better to understand them. He should have said "Understand your enemies" it's a logical reaction, not a emotional one.

    More than this, Jesus didn't actually say "Love your enemies" because it will benefit them overall.

    He said.

    "Love your enemies, for in doing so you will pile coal's upon their heads" This is not loving in a true sense, if you only care for a enemy to hurt them.
     
  19. AvgJoe

    AvgJoe Member since 2005 Supporter

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    What does it mean?

    "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head." Romans 12:20

    In Romans, Paul talks about how to deal with our enemies and those who have wronged us. He says many wise things about dealing with others in this passage:

    Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord. On the contrary: "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head." Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. Romans 12:17-21

    As we read this, one sentence sticks out to us that doesn't make sense - about heaping burning coals on an enemy's head. We wonder what Paul meant by this. It helps to know that Paul is quoting Proverbs 25:21-22: If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat; and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink; for you will heap burning coals on his head, and the LORD will reward you. Understanding this proverb will unlock Paul's words as well.

    That saying is in the middle of several proverbs that use physical images to describe emotional reactions. Right before it is the passage, "Like one who takes away a garment on a cold day, or one that pours vinegar on a wound, is one who sings songs to a heavy heart" (Proverbs 25:20, RSV). The physical picture of discomfort illustrates that trying to make a person in mourning happy just distresses them more. Likewise, the passage about coals, is about the emotional discomfort an enemy will feel when you waken his conscience about his conduct toward you. According to the Jewish Encyclopedia :

    The word "coal" is often used in a metaphorical sense: 2 Samuel 14: 7 speaks of the "quenching of the coal" of a man, meaning the complete annihilation of his issue; while in Proverbs 25:22 kindness bestowed upon an enemy is called "heaping coals of fire upon his head," since it tends to waken his deadened conscience and help him to realize his wrong. Ecclus. (Sirach) viii. 10 compares the smoldering and easily roused passion of the godless man to the coal that is easily lighted and breaks forth into flame.

    The picture of putting coals on a person's head initially sounds like a picture of causing burning pain, but it really is not. Instead, it seems to be a picture of stirring up the coals of a fire to rouse it back to life again. It is a picture of stirring within a person a response of remorse, when they see your kindness in the face of their meanness. This must also be the sense of Paul's passage - we cause our enemies to be remorseful for their actions toward us, and in doing so we overcome evil by doing good.
     
  20. AservantofGodandthelordJC

    AservantofGodandthelordJC Member

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    Other people are a mirror reflection of yourself because we are all part of the same singular reality which is God. So, to hate someone else is to hate yourself. This is why you can only see God through forgiveness, if you see others as not innocent, so will you see yourself. They truly are innocent and deserve forgiveness because they are only hurting themselves 'knowing not what they do.'
     
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