John 12:25

[fishing]

Don't equate eternal life with living forever as contrived by the earthly mind, but knowing our Father that is this life.

and

I love my life that is Christ and thus I lost my old life.

But isn't it that everything we can conceive of as beyond this life is really just extrapolation from our earthly life? When we conceive of everlasting life, all we are doing is juxtaposing it with the earthly life we are trapped in, and we generally juxtapose by creating opposites / binaries:

transient vs. eternal

limited vs. unlimited

empty vs. full

meaningless vs. meaningful

restless vs. at rest

I'm not sure there's anything that we conceive about eternal life that is not either (1) an imagined fullness of some sort of earthly experience / concept or (2) the imagined opposite of some sort of earthly experience / concept.

With regard to (1), think about love. We tend to experience love in bursts, and it is not spread evenly throughout our time here. We do not love evenly. But when we do experience it to a large degree, we tend to find so much joy and truth in it that we perceive it as a little taste of heaven. God is Love, after all. So when we conceive of eternal life, we conceive of it as a fullness of love - a fullness of something that we can only experience in a limited way in our earthly lives.

With regard to (2), consider all the binaries already listed, but especially that of "transient vs. eternal." We have conceived of this concept of 'eternity' only as an opposite of our earthly human experience of 'transience.'

So, the way that I see it, all things that are conceptualized when thinking about eternal life vs. earthly life are only conceptualized from an earthly perspective. If that is the case, how can anyone say that she is in touch with the "eternal" and has become "dead" to the old earthly life? The eternal is dependent on the transient; the everlasting is dependent on the earthly - from our human perspective, at least.

 

[x141]

This is most certainly the logical conclusion, based on our five senses, as individuals, five which give us the sixth, or the one who we are, or is our husband, so to speak.

When we are no longer with these, the journey ends, and everything we contrived of or birthed by our soul through the measured image our five sense have given us ends, being of the creation and finite, and becomes the sum of our life, dust.

But there is a difference between conceiving, or the coming of it, and being it, which is to what end our soul was given to us, to reveal our nakedness, but we never embraced this as light, therefore we oppose self by our soul becoming an adversary to the life that is in us that was seeded from without (God finding no truth outside of himself/like father like son), our soul being caught, or lifted up between heaven and earth.

The same imagination based on without that ensnares us, is the same imagination when based on the image within that free us from this captivity, where we become captive to this same image as we were brought into captivity to the one without.

Eternal life is knowing the Father, and we know him by being his son (gender being a picture of something) ... Adam, the son of God ...

In some respects, the earth is the womb we walk in.

Father is a measured picture of something that has no measure, just as creation is this same measurement of Truth that has none.

One is a descending forever the other an ascending forever.

Will the two become one, I believe they have always been one, and this is what we are being raised up to see, or to live in his sight, we by our soul are the one who divided the two, which without we would have never come to the understanding of what is.

Unless a seed falls to the ground, it abides alone.

Truth is always present and never changes, and this is the foundation our house is built upon, which is the house of God, God not being some distant truth, but the truth of self, all of it having come out from him, therefore only finding it's identity in relationship to him as being the only truth or light, hence a son.

God only has one son, not two, and we can go as far as we want to into this truth of self.

 

[Noxot]

the thing is that we are already in eternity. time is a kind of perception or a created law which exist within eternity. we may grasp that which seems beyond us because in reality it is not truly beyond us. it is true that we are hindered to various degree by various things and those desiring to become more spiritual will learn to let go of that which is holding them back. but to get greater and higher degrees of spiritual insight is not our job, that is Gods job. our job is to become a spotless mirror that we may more clearly reflect the image that shines in it. this is how we obtain higher knowledge, by prayer and seeking God and not depending on our self. not leaning on our own understanding. it is possible to start seeing the world through the eyes of God. it's just that humans are so used to seeing the world through the eyes of the devil and themselves in a blinded state. all of the physical reality has the spiritual reality manifesting itself though it. things don't really have such a built in meaning, we humans have just decided this means this and that means that ( sometimes it is true too ). humanity has conformed too much to a certain law of this physical universe, that of objective reality. if the Spiritual reality is more archaic in it's nature then objectifying infinity would put our perception into a box of this or that size. but the nature of our soul is one of constant growth of capacity for Spiritual reality. the more into the spirit the soul is, the more attached to the Holy Spirit whom births all the angels and our own spirit, the more beautiful our soul becomes. but when the soul is attached to evil and lower concepts of reality, she becomes darkened and cold and ugly. the soul is the part of us that will infinity experience and growth. the spirit is that eternal part of us in God, the highest part of who we are, the part closest to God. the soul and spirit are one thing but the soul functions as a lower so that she can rejoice forever in experiencing who God made her to be while the spirit is the higher part that constantly with the soul becomes manifest rather than being fully absorbed into the complete ineffable of God, of which we do at times experience but we go through both modes of eternity forever and ever. of multiplicity and of oneness with God.

God is simple and from his simpleness comes an endless ocean of complexity due to how he manifest himself in his children and in so-called creation, which is just a part of God that was objectified to some degree even though he himself can't be defined. but that part of him being more crystallized as opposed to being a water state made it possible for himself to shine a while light which shone through a clear crystal which created the colors of the rainbow, kind of like a language. the children of God always existed inside of God but they could not be manifest until they themselves were shone in eternal nature, or the fathomless abyss of God or that part of him that he objectified. so basically everything exist within God and when God speaks a word it becomes unveiled inside of him. basically God is infinity and eternally contemplating everything and we are his thoughts or we are each an eye of God, we are a special thing of him, he calls us his children and apparently all of the kingdom of heaven is to be enjoyed with Father and all his children, this is the inheritance, the everlasting joy and we have found ourselves in a world called earth and become blinded to reality ( the kingdom of heaven ), but not many can see the great story being played out in this world because humans have certain ideas about what reality and this world is. part of this world is overcoming the blindness and plus we learn all kinds of thing in being in such a blinded mode, we could not otherwise go through things such as this world unless we were hindered.


the truth is that we are born from God and have his same nature since God does not produce something different from what he is, thus our highest nature is unchanging love and whatnot. because God literally made us out of himself. thus evil and all those things are more of a illusion than actual reality and when we function in the normal mode of Spirit we are naturally more joyful, loving and ect. the human condition was bound in chains but the Holy Spirit is what makes us free from all the bad and then the veil of sin is removed and we function according to how children of God really are and we see how God sees. the whole point of this world is to overcome it and experience and go through things. we overcome it and are still in it, but we see the world more close to it's true nature, we see from heaven instead of the earth. a main problem is that we must first seek the kingdom of heaven and be conformed anew by the Holy Spirit, then all those things shall be added to you. out of place "all those things" of the world become traps and hinder us from being spiritual, when we are spiritual they become our aids and helpers, even evil and darkness constantly teaches us that we don't want to be that again.

 

[fishing]

Thanks x141,

But there is a difference between conceiving, or the coming of it, and being it, which is to what end our soul was given to us, to reveal our nakedness, but we never embraced this as light, therefore we oppose self by our soul becoming an adversary to the life that is in us that was seeded from without (God finding no truth outside of himself/like father like son), our soul being caught, or lifted up between heaven and earth.

But how do we discern that difference?




Noxot,

That was beautiful, thank you. What type of Christianity do you subscribe to if you don't mind me asking?

 

[x141]

It's hard to relate this without being face to face.

The image within each of us, or this life, is not measurable (this is the revelation of what Christ is, a tree of life, whereas the soul is the tree of knowledge (though in Truth, they are one, and have always been one or they would not come together as one again), and is referenced as the feminine in scripture, though this garden is us, it has to do with what tree is the tree to you in the midst of the garden that tells you of self. When the tree of knowledge is the tree in the midst of your garden, it reveals your nakedness). It was this life that Jesus understood to be granted of God, or something given and not earned, a name. The other end of the issue is the image without, which is measured, and found in every way, in the end to be wanting so to speak. The path of Life is within, and when your eye is single you become filled with this light or life that God is. Here the same imagination that lead you into captivity based on the seed that is without (which is a constant wandering between two opinions, or mountains, sons, or two fruits of one tree. Where you labor to enter in, and there is a laboring to keep it, it not being yours to begin with), is the very same one that brings you into the captivity of one, it is here where your fruit remains, or you become a pillar and go no more out. It is a present truth, not one coming, but one that opens like a book in you, as it did in Jesus. But the key is the forsaking of the soul based on it being seeded from without, not thought by thought, but the whole soul, which is not any different then the picture painted in the garden of Eden, or keeping the feast of Passover, which is part of the process of God, and ties in with the creative week, which speaks to this same process in us. The price seems steep, therefore not many want to pay it, it seeming foolish.

This is the chosen fast spoken of in Isaiah. It's something we come to in us, which then becomes something that flows out of us.

The difference is one fruit (of the mind, thoughts, children) is of labor, the other is free, and opens of it's own accord, here you see fifty things at once, like a universe going off in you, and it all is of one, and it is this that you walk in, this is the path of life, where God walks in you (these words are very measured), or where the spirit leads you into ... this all truth.

 

[Tammuz14]

Those who are one with Christ will be hated by this world and they will feel that hatred to the point where they will long for their departure.

 

[Noxot]

Noxot,

That was beautiful, thank you. What type of Christianity do you subscribe to if you don't mind me asking?

I don't subscribe to anything. I am simply a child of God and no one is going to make me their slave because my master is the one who made me out of his great love. I suppose any spiritual person filled with the Spirit of God is the type of Christianity I subscribe to. the type of Christianity where the innocence of the child must rule, that child being the greatest in the kingdom of heaven, that child being the person of God. there is one Christianity according to the angels of heaven and this is the one I am part of. some saint said to me one time that "the saints hear each other" and this is another description of what the Christianity I subscribe to is. I believe in the power of the Spirit of God and that the mystics, saints, apostles, and prophets, the poor and the rich are all the same thing, the Christianity, the church, the spirit of God.

I do not conform to any particular denomination or belief system other than what i hear the birds singing in the heavens and I too chirp along. i'm sorry if my answer seems strange, I believe in a personal revolution of both new and old things coming out of the heart which is the throne of God for each human that grows deeply in the Spirit of God and that each child of God fits uniquely into the mystical construct called the heavenly church of God which is a structure of souls and unity of Spirit in Christ and in God which was spoken from the mouth of God from before the beginning.

 

[frogman2x]

I don't subscribe to anything. I am simply a child of God and no one is going to make me their slave because my master is the one who made me out of his great love. I suppose any spiritual person filled with the Spirit of God is the type of Christianity I subscribe to. the type of Christianity where the innocence of the child must rule, that child being the greatest in the kingdom of heaven, that child being the person of God. there is one Christianity according to the angels of heaven and this is the one I am part of. some saint said to me one time that "the saints hear each other" and this is another description of what the Christianity I subscribe to is. I believe in the power of the Spirit of God and that the mystics, saints, apostles, and prophets, the poor and the rich are all the same thing, the Christianity, the church, the spirit of God.

I do not conform to any particular denomination or belief system other than what i hear the birds singing in the heavens and I too chirp along. i'm sorry if my answer seems strange, I believe in a personal revolution of both new and old things coming out of the heart which is the throne of God for each human that grows deeply in the Spirit of God and that each child of God fits uniquely into the mystical construct called the heavenly church of God which is a structure of souls and unity of Spirit in Christ and in God which was spoken from the mouth of God from before the beginning.

It seems you subscribe to your own personal theology, some of which is not Biblical. How do you know for sure you theology is right?

Where did God call His church mystical?

kermit

 

[pshun2404]

Fishing...

What He is getting at here us there are two ways...

The way of the world leads to spiritual death

The way of the Spirit leads to life

The way of the world is one of cunning and rationalism...it is selfish, self centered, self indulgent, and the belief that we are the lord of our own life

The way of the Spirit is is one of faith and trust,...it is other oriented, other centered, and is concerned for the needs of others...we yield to His Lordship

The way of the world is get what you can and man is able by consensus to solve all its problems

The way of the Spirit is give of yourself and that all man;s efforts solve nothing (as the nightly news continuously proves)

The world thrills at ill gotten profit and power, lust, and money rule, and one self lord making other self lords submit is the basis of all actions even when they claim otherwise

The Spirit profits in what is essential to good mental health, joy, a clear conscience, a peace the world cannot even comprehend

The world wants you to entice and seek the desires of the flesh the fruit of it is drunkedness, envy, strife, greed, and more...the fruit of sowing to the Spirit is love, shalom, temperance, sharing, contentment....

Do if you love your life as this world sees life you will die in your sins...when you are born from above (actually, not the popularized cliche') the things of this world no longer satisfy....drugs, sex, drink, worldly philosophies of vain deceit, keeping up with the joneses, stepping on your neighbor to get ahead, petty jealousies, going along with the crowd...all have empty meaningless endings...

None of these things are the focus of my life anymore...I am a new order of creature...in the world but no longer of the world....I am blessed every day and at peace even amidst most trying times...I have hope (the eager expectation of what I KNOW is coming)...I have security (even if killed it is gain for me)...I have joy each day (even the trees and flowers are His work and they fill me with life and love)...I feel clean in mind and body (no more guilt or shame or questioning my own actions)...

Maybe this has helped a little

Paul

 

[Mark51]

It seem to me that the counsel here is not to submit to man’s laws when they may conflict with God’s laws nor do what the world is fond of. Contrarily, obey God’s laws and do things that displays honor and that which please Him-even if this means ridicule and death.-Mark 12:17.

Compare: Matthew 26:38, 39, 51-54; Hebrews 11:32-38.