Israel's future and Pat: Your view

Oblio · Jan 8, 2006

I agree with Michael Savage who opined that it could just as well be that God has kept Sharon alive (given that his age/physique should probably killed him long ago) this long in order to begin the peace process.

Albion · Jan 9, 2006

Oblio said:
I agree with Michael Savage who opined that it could just as well be that God has kept Sharon alive (given that his age/physique should probably killed him long ago) this long in order to begin the peace process.

Of course...and considering the timing, this makes much more sense.

Edial · Jan 9, 2006

Pat Robertson is known for making statements that he thinks cannot be Scripturally "double-checked".
He thinks that his "opinions" are free from Scriptural judgement.

I was told that he made similar-type of statements concerning God causing the 9/11 and the Katrina as a judgement, an expression of his wrath.

Scripturally speaking, God's wrath will never be against believers. Never.
So, if believers died during the 9/11 or Katrina - it was not God's wrath.
Impossible.

And, if it was not God's wrath then Pat is walking a tight-rope in preserving himself against accusations of being a false prophet.

Thanks,
Ed

Bobber · Jan 9, 2006

Archbishop 10-K said:
I have to admit, I'm a little disturbed at how much American Christians give support to "Israel". Israel is a mostly secular state, made up by mostly secular people, with immigration policies that discriminate against Christians and non-Jews. There have been many Hebrew couples that could not invoke "right to return" to Israel because they converted to Christianity.

Yes but even though this may be true I think its very evident that God brought them back into the land to be a nation that Jesus becomes King over when he comes back....so I think its good to support Israel for that very reason....there's a bigger picture in mind...

Tonks · Jan 9, 2006

OnTheWay said:
The old covenant is no more, and the new covenant is what Christ brought. As St. Paul tells us, there is neither Jew nor Greek anymore.

I think there are far too many Christians have have taken up an incorrect near worship of the secular state of Israel. Which is in reality just one government among the nations. When you take the birth rate of the Arab population vs that of the Jewish population and combine it with the fact more Jews leave Israel every year that move in the secular state of Israel will probably cease to exist. The Church of Christ, that new Israel and royal priesthood is not affixed to any geographic location, as Christ restored the world and all places are now suitable for prayer.
Christians would do well to worry about the Great Commission and less than faulty interpertations of the book of Revelations.

There is not much more that needs to be said in this thread. The best, and only, answer.

Albion · Jan 9, 2006

Bobber said:
Yes but even though this may be true I think its very evident that God brought them back into the land to be a nation that Jesus becomes King over when he comes back....so I think its good to support Israel for that very reason....there's a bigger picture in mind...

In order to contemplate this question, it's necessary to know "What Land?"
and "Which boundaries?"

The claim of those most passionate about "Israel's land" see it as extending to the Euphrates. Who here (I wonder) supports that?

If not, what does that do to the idea that God has brought his people back to 'the land he gave them?'

Archbishop 10-K · Jan 9, 2006

Bobber said:
Yes but even though this may be true I think its very evident that God brought them back into the land to be a nation that Jesus becomes King over when he comes back....so I think its good to support Israel for that very reason....there's a bigger picture in mind...

One problem: Israel is just as anti-Christian at heart as other Middle Eastern nations. The way I see things, is that until the Israelis stop persecuting or discriminating against Palestinian Christians and other Christians, I will not give Israel a cent. Israel is a secular state that doesn't care much about God at all, much less His divine Son. Many Orthodox Jews are anti-Zionists because they see Israel as more of a nationalist entity than a religious one. I am inclined to agree. Just because that country has the name of "Israel" does not make it the real deal.

nephilimiyr · Jan 9, 2006

horuhe00 said:
What do your Christian belives sway towards?

Once the land was legally given back to the Jewish people it is written that it will never again be given up or taken away. The land is now and ever will be owned by God and given to Abraham and his seed, both physical and spiritual seed.

Edial · Jan 9, 2006

nephilimiyr said:
Once the land was legally given back to the Jewish people it is written that it will never again be given up or taken away. The land is now and ever will be owned by God and given to Abraham and his seed, both physical and spiritual seed.

And that will be in the future, when the Messiah comes.

Ed

Oblio · Jan 9, 2006

The Holy Land belongs to Christians, if those of Jewish decent would like to repent and accept Christ as their Lord and Saviour and the Son of God born of the Virgin Mary, great, otherwise they have no claim to it.

Edial · Jan 9, 2006

Oblio said:
The Holy Land belongs to Christians, if those of Jewish decent would like to repent and accept Christ as their Lord and Saviour and the Son of God born of the Virgin Mary, great, otherwise they have no claim to it.

Well, ... they "kind of" have a claim to that, since they will become believers in the future.
Christ also lamented concerning them (Jerusalem) and their stubbornness.
So there is a long spiritual history between God and the descendants of Abraham.

But, ... yes, you are correct.
Thanks,
Ed

nephilimiyr · Jan 9, 2006

Edial said:
And that will be in the future, when the Messiah comes.

Ed

In 1948 the land was given back to them legally. After 2,000 years the Jews have ownership of the land. This is a direct confirmation of fulfilled prophecy. Once the land is given back to them they will not lose it, that is also part of the prophecy.

Edial · Jan 9, 2006

nephilimiyr said:
In 1948 the land was given back to them legally. After 2,000 years the jews have opwnership of the land. This is a direct confirmation of fulfilled prophecy. Once the land is given back to them they will not lose it, that is also part of the prophecy.

But they lost it.

And isn't that supposed to happen when the Messiah comes?

Thanks,
Ed

nephilimiyr · Jan 9, 2006

Edial said:
But they lost it.

And isn't that supposed to happen when the Messiah comes?

Thanks,
Ed

No, prophecy says that the Jews will have ownership of the land during the second coming of Jesus.

nephilimiyr · Jan 9, 2006

Edial said:
But they lost it.

The Jews lost the land in 70. In 1948 they regained the land.

BarbB · Jan 9, 2006

nephilimiyr said:
The Jews lost the land in 70. In 1948 they regained the land.

LOL, and in 1967 they got control of more of it!

nephilimiyr · Jan 9, 2006

newlamb said:
LOL, and in 1967 they got control of more of it!

Yah!

horuhe00 · Jan 9, 2006

But Israel gave back part of their land to Egypt.

cygnusx1 · Jan 9, 2006

I am pro - Israel , have been for over 25 years.

A careful read of Romans 9-11 will show God has NOT cast off His people (Israel) whom He foreknew , all Christians are grafted into the vine (Israel) not the other way about.

Likewise The gifts and the calling from God are without Repentance , God's covenant in certain respects cannot be abolished , do I need to start quoting scriptures about the longevity of God's Covenant with Israel and His promise to give them a land forever.

It is just so easy and wrong to fall into the trap of being proud (which Paul warned against) and thinking we 'Christians' are superior to the Jews , that we can so easily cast them off ...........to be careless and become partisan to a Spirit which has been hostile to the Jews throughout history.

OnTheWay · Jan 9, 2006

Ah, how silly it is that men should wage war and murder one another over hunks of dirt or sand.

How equally silly it is that Christians would chose to read the Old Testament not as it relates to the New Testament, but as a individual canon. The old covenant that God made with Abraham was not done away with, in the New Covenant made possible by Christ in His reconciling God and man it is extended to ALL MEN.
As it was on the first day after creation so it is again that to God there is neither Jew nor Greek, but only one mankind. All whom can be saved by Jesus Christ. Outside of Jesus Christ none could be saved. As Scripture tells us all who believe in Christ and are of His Church are made heirs to Abraham, are made into Israel.
Christ has also redeemed the whole world, there is no longer places that are "profane" and places that are "sacred" as the whole world is now suitable for prayer. In other words, it doesn't matter who controls a hunk of land. We are to love each other and become one body in Christ. It is not accepted for Arabs to blow up pizza places nor is it acceptable for Jews to kill men, women, and children in rocket attacks. Neither of these things follows the command of Christ that we love one another as we love our selves. Once again, as Christians we need to tend to the Great Comission, and not concern ourselves of bad interpertations of Revelations. Christ needs to be brought to Jew and Muslim alike, for without Him neither the followers of Judaism or Islam can hope to be saved.

Israel's future and Pat: Your view

On Israel(in alphabetical order):

I don't know.

Israel should have it's land back.

Peace in the Middle East.

Something else.

Creed or Chaos

Facilitator

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

No longer here

Facilitator

Archbishop 10-K

Guest

I've Been Keepin My Eyes Wide Open

Well-Known Member

Creed or Chaos

Well-Known Member

I've Been Keepin My Eyes Wide Open

Well-Known Member

I've Been Keepin My Eyes Wide Open

I've Been Keepin My Eyes Wide Open

I stand with my brothers and sisters in Israel!

I've Been Keepin My Eyes Wide Open

Contributor

Jacob the twister.....

Well-Known Member

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency