Israel-Hamas Thread II

Benaiah468 said:

Hamas terrorists invaded Israel, carried out a massacre and took hostages. In addition to several thousand rockets fired from the Gaza Strip, Hezbollah attacked from the north. The mullah regime in Iran is behind these terrorist movements. Iran's large-scale attack on Israel was anything but proportionate. The fact that little damage was done does not make it any less reprehensible. An existential threat to Israel.

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This is like saying AQ posed a threat to the existence of the US through 9/11 - clearly nonsense.
And you still have not responded to the video which clearly shows an incendiary device being ignited in mid air before falling onto the vessel. What weapons was the vessel carrying?

Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez's attack on Israel was not a diplomatic slip-up, but an open slap in the face. This time, however, there was a response.



When the head of government of a European country accuses Israel of genocide, when he claims that the Jewish people are bombing hospitals and letting children starve, this is not sober criticism, but a revival of ancient, deeply rooted anti-Semitic narratives. This is precisely what Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez has done and Israel has responded as it had to respond.

Foreign Minister Gideon Sa'ar did not dismiss the words from Madrid as a misunderstanding, but placed them in the context of centuries-old hostility. The memory is sharp: from the Inquisition to forced baptisms to the expulsion of all Jews in 1492. It was an act of ethnic cleansing that robbed Spain of Jewish life for centuries. The fact that this country of all countries now wants to preach morality to Israel leaves a bitter taste in Jerusalem's mouth.

But Sa'ar did not stop at historical parallels. He spoke of a Spanish government that is embroiled in corruption scandals and is therefore looking for scapegoats in foreign policy. He called Sánchez's words inflammatory and poisonous and pointed out the double standards: while Spain flirts with regimes such as Iran and Venezuela, it directs its full indignation against Israel, the only country in the Middle East where civil liberties and democracy apply.

This resulted in concrete measures. Two Spanish ministers were sanctioned, and Israel's diplomacy will put Spain's line on the agenda at the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA). Jerusalem is thus making it clear that it is not only responding bilaterally to Madrid, but is treating the incident as part of an international debate on modern anti-Semitism.

The Spanish government reacted with outrage and recalled its ambassador. Israel had not had its own ambassador in Madrid since the end of 2023. Diplomatic relations have thus reached a low point.

A glance at Dublin and Paris shows that Sánchez's course is not an isolated episode. Ireland also felt the full force of Israel's wrath when the embassy in Dublin was closed. France faces similar adversity if it continues to go it alone diplomatically in recognising a "Palestinian" state.

Symbolic politics?

Yes.

But symbolism counts in the diplomatic arena. It sends a signal: Israel is not a doormat, it is a state that defends its dignity.

This has an impact both internally and externally. For Israel's citizens, it is a sign that their government will not allow the country to be demonised as a perpetrator on the world stage. For other governments, it is a warning: those who play with old anti-Semitic clichés and apply double standards will pay the price.

The key lesson is this: anti-Semitism in diplomatic guise must not go unpunished. Criticism of Israel is legitimate, even harsh criticism. But those who engage in demonisation, delegitimisation and double standards, the three criteria of the IHRA definition, are crossing a red line. Spain has crossed that line. Israel has responded.

And so it is clear: the Jewish state is not prepared to be silenced again. Not in the Middle Ages, not in the 20th century, and certainly not in 2025.

Hentenza said:

This is nonsense. Have you not seen the videos and news articles through the years Iran, Hamas, and Hezbollah chanting death to Israel? You do know who that Iran was one of the main monetary supporters of both Hamas and Hezbollah, right?

By this logic then Palestine doesn’t have a right to exist. Got it.

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Chanting does not pose an existential threat to any state. It's complete nonsense to state that. And by that "logic" neither the US or the UK has a right to exist in law. So you can put your gotcha in the bin where it belongs. You do know that according to Shin Bet Netanyahu enabled the funding of Hamas prior to October 7.

Shin Bet hints Netanyahu's policies motivated Hamas's October 7 attack | The Jerusalem Post

Benaiah468 said:

Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez's attack on Israel was not a diplomatic slip-up, but an open slap in the face. This time, however, there was a response.

View attachment 369842

When the head of government of a European country accuses Israel of genocide, when he claims that the Jewish people are bombing hospitals and letting children starve, this is not sober criticism, but a revival of ancient, deeply rooted anti-Semitic narratives. This is precisely what Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez has done and Israel has responded as it had to respond.

Foreign Minister Gideon Sa'ar did not dismiss the words from Madrid as a misunderstanding, but placed them in the context of centuries-old hostility. The memory is sharp: from the Inquisition to forced baptisms to the expulsion of all Jews in 1492. It was an act of ethnic cleansing that robbed Spain of Jewish life for centuries. The fact that this country of all countries now wants to preach morality to Israel leaves a bitter taste in Jerusalem's mouth.

But Sa'ar did not stop at historical parallels. He spoke of a Spanish government that is embroiled in corruption scandals and is therefore looking for scapegoats in foreign policy. He called Sánchez's words inflammatory and poisonous and pointed out the double standards: while Spain flirts with regimes such as Iran and Venezuela, it directs its full indignation against Israel, the only country in the Middle East where civil liberties and democracy apply.

This resulted in concrete measures. Two Spanish ministers were sanctioned, and Israel's diplomacy will put Spain's line on the agenda at the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA). Jerusalem is thus making it clear that it is not only responding bilaterally to Madrid, but is treating the incident as part of an international debate on modern anti-Semitism.

The Spanish government reacted with outrage and recalled its ambassador. Israel had not had its own ambassador in Madrid since the end of 2023. Diplomatic relations have thus reached a low point.

A glance at Dublin and Paris shows that Sánchez's course is not an isolated episode. Ireland also felt the full force of Israel's wrath when the embassy in Dublin was closed. France faces similar adversity if it continues to go it alone diplomatically in recognising a "Palestinian" state.

Symbolic politics?

Yes.

But symbolism counts in the diplomatic arena. It sends a signal: Israel is not a doormat, it is a state that defends its dignity.

This has an impact both internally and externally. For Israel's citizens, it is a sign that their government will not allow the country to be demonised as a perpetrator on the world stage. For other governments, it is a warning: those who play with old anti-Semitic clichés and apply double standards will pay the price.

The key lesson is this: anti-Semitism in diplomatic guise must not go unpunished. Criticism of Israel is legitimate, even harsh criticism. But those who engage in demonisation, delegitimisation and double standards, the three criteria of the IHRA definition, are crossing a red line. Spain has crossed that line. Israel has responded.

And so it is clear: the Jewish state is not prepared to be silenced again. Not in the Middle Ages, not in the 20th century, and certainly not in 2025.

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Has it ever occurred to you that it's Israel that is at fault rather than all these countries?

Benaiah468 said:

Hamas terrorists invaded Israel, carried out a massacre and took hostages. In addition to several thousand rockets fired from the Gaza Strip, Hezbollah attacked from the north. The mullah regime in Iran is behind these terrorist movements. Iran's large-scale attack on Israel was anything but proportionate. The fact that little damage was done does not make it any less reprehensible. An existential threat to Israel.

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Vanellus said:

This is like saying AQ posed a threat to the existence of the US through 9/11 - clearly nonsense.

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Since its establishment in 1948, Israel's existence has been challenged by a series of wars, political conflicts and threats from neighbouring states and other actors.

Immediately after independence was declared on 14 May 1948, the Arab states of Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq attacked Israel, triggering the first Arab-Israeli war. From the outset, the "Palestinian" leadership and many Arab states rejected the partition of "Palestine" and the establishment of Israel. To this day, some states and organisations question Israel's existence. Since then, Israel has been involved in several other wars and military conflicts, including the Six-Day War in 1967 and the Yom Kippur War in 1973. The Israeli-"Palestinian" conflict has led to numerous armed conflicts and uprisings, such as the First Intifada. The constant conflict and threats have forced Israel to build up a strong military force to secure its existence.

While the world has been discussing the fate of "Palestinian" refugees for decades, there has been silence about the disenfranchisement and expulsion of nearly one million Jews from Arab states. A new UN report now reveals the extent of the expulsion, expropriation and destruction of communities that had existed for thousands of years.


Iraqi Jews arrive at Lod Airport in Israel

Since 1948, the United Nations has adopted countless resolutions and reports on the situation of "Palestinian" refugees. However, hardly a word has been said about the other side of the story: the systematic expulsion of Jewish communities from the Arab world. Now, for the first time, comprehensive documentation is available that reveals the extent of this suppressed chapter of history.

The international organisation Justice for Jews from Arab Countries (JJAC) has spent years compiling eleven detailed country reports, which were presented on the opening day of the UN Human Rights Council in Geneva, Sep 8th, 2025. The findings are shocking: over 99 per cent of the Jews who had lived in North Africa and the Middle East for thousands of years have been forced to leave their homes since 1948. Entire communities, older than Islam itself, disappeared within a few decades.

In 1948, around 140,000 Jews lived in Algeria, today, there are none left. In Iraq, once home to 135,000 Jews, only five remain. In Tunisia, the number fell from 105,000 to around 1,500. In Egypt, Syria, Yemen, Libya and Lebanon, the same picture repeats itself: thriving communities have been reduced to empty synagogues, destroyed cemeteries and forgotten traces of a lost culture.

The report describes the region today as effectively ‘free of Jews’. This term, which recalls the darkest chapters of European history, describes the reality of a millennia-old presence that has been violently eradicated, by Arab nationalism, Islamist fanaticism and state-organised persecution.

In addition to the human tragedy, the study also documents the material losses: expropriated houses, confiscated shops, looted synagogues, stolen libraries and community assets. At today's values, these losses amount to 263 billion dollars (approximately 244 billion euros). In Iran alone, the damage amounts to 61 billion dollars, in Egypt to 59 billion and in Iraq to 34 billion dollars.

The scale of the losses becomes clear when one looks at the per capita losses: in 1948, they ranged between 4,800 and 15,000 dollars depending on the country, for many families, this meant complete economic ruin.

While the "Palestinian" refugee issue has dominated UN debates for over 75 years, the Jewish tragedy has been systematically ignored. No aid organisation was established for these refugees, no billion-dollar programmes were launched, no ‘rights of return’ were demanded. Most of the 850,000 displaced Jews found refuge in Israel, where they were integrated without international assistance.

"The extent of the losses has hardly been acknowledged until now,"

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explains Rabbi Elie Abadie, co-chair of JJAC. "

This history belongs to the Middle East like any other. Only through truth and recognition can reconciliation come about."

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His co-chair, Sylvain Abitbol, adds:

"The Abraham Accords have shown that the peoples of the region can come together if history is viewed with courage and honesty. Without recognition of the Jewish refugees, any discussion of justice remains incomplete."

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The issue of Jewish refugees is not a footnote, but a central component in the struggle for truth and justice. Those who only talk about "Palestinian" refugees are concealing half of the reality. Those who demand reparations, rights and recognition must not exploit some victims while ignoring others.

The silence surrounding the expulsion of Jews from Arab states is no longer tenable. The new UN report is a step in the right direction, but only if it is followed by political action. For only when the suffering of both peoples (Jews and Arabs) is acknowledged can a basis for genuine peace be established.

France has stopped all evacuations from the Gaza Strip. The trigger: a "Palestinian" student, Nour Atallah, who was brought into the country on humanitarian grounds, had previously spread anti-Semitic and Nazi content on social media, including a picture of Adolf Hitler with calls for the murder of Jews. French Foreign Minister Jean-Noël Barrot responded decisively:

"This woman must leave the country."

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This also marks the end of France's participation in the humanitarian reception of people from Gaza for the time being, a dramatic change of course that goes far beyond this individual case.

The Atallah case raises fundamental questions about the seriousness of French admission procedures, political blindness to Islamist hatred of Jews, and a moral dilemma that has kept Europe in suspense since 7 Oct 2023. The shock runs deep: France, which has been taking in hundreds of Gaza refugees for months, is suddenly confronted with the question of whether its humanitarian aid has provided a platform for anti-Semitic ideologies.

Atallah, a student who was brought to France from Gaza through the French-Israeli evacuation programme, had already published anti-Semitic posts before her arrival, according to official sources. Nevertheless, she remained undetected, a failure of preliminary checks, as Barrot called it. Neither French nor Israeli authorities had recognised the relevant content in time. Screenshots from her X/Twitter account, shared by pro-Israeli observers, show Adolf Hitler and explicit calls for violence against Jews, among other things. Her admission to the prestigious Sciences Po Lille was immediately revoked, her statements blatantly contradict the values of our republic, according to the university administration.



The scandal has sparked a debate that is dividing French society. Interior Minister Gérald Darmanin spoke of Hamas propaganda that had seeped into the public sphere via social networks. The judiciary is investigating for incitement to hatred and glorification of terrorism. At the same time, criticism of the evacuation programme itself is growing: were too many refugees allowed into the country without sufficient screening?

How many of them may share similar radical views?

Barrot announced that all Gazans currently in France will be subjected to a second, more intensive review. This amounts to nothing less than a complete breach of trust in the existing humanitarian aid mechanisms. Until the ongoing investigation is complete, no further evacuations will take place, this is not an isolated case, but a political dam burst.

This decision is remarkable because it does not come from right-wing hardliners, but from a pro-European, centrist foreign minister. It shows that anti-Semitism from Arab countries is no longer accepted as a cultural peculiarity, but is perceived as a threat to open society. And it highlights a problem that has been ignored for years, the rampant hatred of Jews among some Muslim immigrants, which has spread through social media, universities and activism.

France is not alone in this. In Germany, Sweden and the United Kingdom, too, there are growing calls for a reassessment of asylum procedures, especially when applicants come from regions where anti-Semitic ideologies are not only tolerated but promoted by the state. The Gaza evacuations were well-intentioned, but the Atallah case shows how naivety can become a gateway to hatred.

Vanellus said:

There weren't over 60,000 Gazans, including mostly women and children, taking part in the October 7 attack.

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Don't forget that the Arab side started the current war in a cruel manner. Don't forget that the Arab side even took hostages, of whom are still being held captive by Arab fighters? Many of these early victimsm, whether women, young people, elderly people or men, were brutally raped or killed by Arabs.

How many "Palestinian" civilians are innocent?

Ninety-eight percent of "Palestinians" said they felt more proud of their "Palestinian" identity after the Oct 7 massacre.

Those who believe such things may not be guilty of terrorism, but they are definitely not innocent.

Neither are the thousands of civilians in the Gaza Strip who cheered as kidnapped Israelis were paraded through the streets, many of whom had clearly been raped and abused. Nor are the Palestinian civilians who were exposed as Hamas spies.

Numerous Israel-hating individuals and non-governmental organizations like to regard these terrorists as civilians in order to slander Israel.

What about the "Palestinians" who wear civilian clothing, emerge from underground tunnels, and fire rockets at Israeli civilians?

Are they not guilty of war crimes?

Are they terrorists or civilians?

The Western world believes that women and children, when killed, are by definition innocent. Certainly, young children are innocent, but it is well known that Hamas uses teenagers as child soldiers. Under international law, child soldiers are legitimate targets, as their bullets are just as deadly as those fired by adults. As for women, "Palestinian" female terrorists, including suicide bombers, have been commonplace for decades. Today, "Palestinian" women push baby carriages through areas they have been warned to evacuate, providing cover for the cowardly terrorists hiding in tunnels.

And what about the civilian families who allow rockets and hostages to be kept in their homes?

What about the imams who allowed tunnels to be dug under their mosques, even though they knew the tunnels would be used to murder Jewish civilians?

Where do they stand on the continuum of guilt?

What about the UNRWA employees who participated in the Oct 7 massacre, who teach hatred of Jews and Israel, and who allow their schools to become weapons depots and rocket launch pads?

Israel is at war. A war that Hamas did not declare, but started with a surprise attack. In which Hamas not only killed over 1,000 Israeli civilians in a single day, but brutally murdered them. Once again: civilians. Elderly people. Children. Mothers. Those who were not murdered were desecrated, abducted and dragged through the streets to the cheers (!) of the "Palestinians". Whether babies were beheaded or not, whether people were burned alive or not, is no longer relevant. Even without such atrocities, these acts are barbaric enough. Will these actions by Hamas, Hezbollah or other "Palestinian groups" ever stop?

Yes.

When the last Israeli is dead. Not before. Incidentally, this is what Hamas itself says, and it is written in its founding charter. Anyone can read it. Therefore, if Israel wants to survive, it must eliminate Hamas once and for all. Completely. Without a trace. You cannot negotiate with your murderer. There will be no second Holocaust, no second Shoah. Fact.

Yes, there will be casualties. Yes, innocent people will be affected. Yes, it's terrible. But it's unavoidable, because Hamas fighters don't reveal themselves and don't fight according to the Hague Convention on Land Warfare. Because they are basically cowardly pigs. And they hate Jews and, unlike the Israelis, they don't give a damn about their own people.

Yes, but what about the "Palestinian" children? They can't help it!

Correct, but neither can the Israeli children.

As we have seen and demonstrated, Hamas is not known for its aesthetic sensibility and differentiation. Using the same argument, the cities of the Third Reich should not have been bombed either. And according to Hamas's argument, there would be attacks every week in Wroclaw, Gdansk and Königsberg. These are also illegally occupied territories.

That's what happens when you start a war and then lose spectacularly.

Yes, children will die too. Children who are not to blame for learning to hate all Jews as early as nursery school. Whose cartoon characters shout ‘kill the Jew’. In whose schools hatred of all Jews is taught. With European tax money and donations. They can't help it. Their parents can, because they are unable or unwilling to counteract this hatred of Hamas.

But when push comes to shove, it will be Israeli doctors who will care for the young victims in Israeli hospitals. The reverse is hardly to be expected. On the contrary:

Here, cakes were distributed on the street for dead Jewish children. Yes, these sacrifices are terrible, but they are unavoidable if there are to be no more sacrifices, on either side, for eternity.

What else must Hamas, Hezbollah, Fatah and Iran do before the apologists for "Palestine" finally show solidarity with Israel?

How many murdered Jews will it take? 100,000? 500,000? Or all 9,136,000?

What many have failed to understand and do not want to understand, so let it be repeated here: Hamas, Hezbollah and Fatah are not concerned with land or justice; they are not even concerned with the welfare of their own people, their sole concern is the radical destruction of Israel.

To finish what the Nazis started. And what many of the friends of cultivated entertainment and differentiated perspectives have also failed to understand:

Even IF the Israelis were to collectively throw themselves into the sea today, the "Palestinians" would simply find another subject to hate.

Vanellus said:

Chanting does not pose an existential threat to any state. It's complete nonsense to state that.

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Did you not read the players that I stated? One of them, Iran, is still trying to produce nuclear weapons. Is that not existential enough for you?

Vanellus said:

And by that "logic" neither the US or the UK has a right to exist in law. So you can put your gotcha in the bin where it belongs. You do know that according to Shin Bet Netanyahu enabled the funding of Hamas prior to October 7.

Shin Bet hints Netanyahu's policies motivated Hamas's October 7 attack | The Jerusalem Post

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So according to your logic, Hamas killed over 1200 people because Israel was sending them money to take care of civilians? How about the people Hamas killed between 2008 and 2014? How about all the people that Hamas killed with their suicide bombers right after they took over the government in 2007?

Hamas IS a terrorist organization that uses Gazans as cover to create casualties so that they can play the media against Israel. It seems that you drank their kool aid. All Hamas had to do was to return the hostages and negotiate but instead they decided that civilians must pay with their lives. Israel is under the obligation to completely destroy Hamas.

It is no secret that Doha has been providing shelter to Hamas leaders for years. Men who planned massacres, financed terrorism and directed the war against Israel from safe ground lived in luxury hotels. Qatar always justified this as a mediating role. But the reality is clear: those who provide terrorists with accommodation, money and an international stage bear responsibility.

Now, following the Israeli operation, Qatar is presenting itself not as a self-critical partner, but as a victim. Prime Minister Al-Thani used a CNN interview to denounce Netanyahu as the cause of the chaos. He went even further, saying that Netanyahu should be brought before the International Criminal Court. A country that offers protection to Hamas leaders is thus calling for the prosecution of the Israeli prime minister, a grotesque reversal of roles.

Diplomatic circles speculate that Israel chose the operation in Doha as an alternative to a previously planned action in Turkey. Ankara, as a NATO member, would have been a risky location. Qatar, on the other hand, despite its close ties to the West, is considered a safe haven for Hamas, a paradox that Israel is no longer willing to accept. Netanyahu made it clear:

"Drive them out or put them on trial. If not, we will do it."

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The planned conference in Doha shows one thing: while Israel is deliberately attacking terrorist structures, Arab-Islamic states are trying to turn the tables and portray Jerusalem as the aggressor. It is the old pattern: terrorism is hushed up, Israel's self-defence is scandalised.

But this time the situation is different. 7 Oct showed that there can be no status quo as long as Hamas operates from safe havens.

Qatar can convene conferences. But Israel will continue to target the terrorists' safe haven.

Benaiah468 said:

Since its establishment in 1948, Israel's existence has been challenged by a series of wars, political conflicts and threats from neighbouring states and other actors.

Immediately after independence was declared on 14 May 1948, the Arab states of Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon and Iraq attacked Israel, triggering the first Arab-Israeli war. From the outset, the "Palestinian" leadership and many Arab states rejected the partition of "Palestine" and the establishment of Israel. To this day, some states and organisations question Israel's existence. Since then, Israel has been involved in several other wars and military conflicts, including the Six-Day War in 1967 and the Yom Kippur War in 1973. The Israeli-"Palestinian" conflict has led to numerous armed conflicts and uprisings, such as the First Intifada. The constant conflict and threats have forced Israel to build up a strong military force to secure its existence.

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Hmm quite an expansion from Hamas to all the surrounding Arab states. Now what could unite the normally disunited Arab countries against Israel? Slaughtering over 60,000 Arabs in Gaza maybe?

Hentenza said:

Did you not read the players that I stated? One of them, Iran, is still trying to produce nuclear weapons. Is that not existential enough for you?

So according to your logic, Hamas killed over 1200 people because Israel was sending them money to take care of civilians? How about the people Hamas killed between 2008 and 2014? How about all the people that Hamas killed with their suicide bombers right after they took over the government in 2007?

Hamas IS a terrorist organization that uses Gazans as cover to create casualties so that they can play the media against Israel. It seems that you drank their kool aid. All Hamas had to do was to return the hostages and negotiate but instead they decided that civilians must pay with their lives. Israel is under the obligation to completely destroy Hamas.

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Ok so now you tacitly admit the "chanting" which you brought up is irrelevant. Right!
You haven't answered the point that Netanyahu enabled the support of Hamas and by his own confession that was done to divide the Palestinians. The human shield lie has been used before. Israeli leaders had vowed to wipe out Hamas (and Gaza) whatever happened to the hostages.

Israel has nuclear weapons. Doesn't mean that Israel poses an existential threat to the surrounding Arab countries: first Gaza, next ...

On Thursday, the Israeli army announced the end of a large-scale operation in Khan Yunis. The goal was to destroy Hamas' underground infrastructure, a network of tunnels, weapons depots, and command centers that stretched beneath the ground like a second shadow state.

The IDF's 36th Division led the operation, supported by the Golani Brigade, the 188th Armored Brigade, and the 900th Brigade. They secured the area and established the so-called Magen Oz Corridor, a strategic connection from west to east through the city.

At the same time, the 282nd Brigade fought terrorist positions with artillery and air support. According to the IDF, hundreds of fighters were killed, including men who had participated in the massacres and infiltrations in Israel on Oct 7.

The Yahalom special forces finally blew up the heart of the Hamas structure: dozens of kilometers of tunnels that served not only as weapons depots and logistics centers, but also as living quarters for terrorists.



In addition to the tunnels, hundreds of Hamas facilities were destroyed, including weapons depots, storage facilities, and operational bases. As a result, the terrorist organization has lost a significant part of its infrastructure in the south.

But the operation was not only military in nature: the army issued leaflets and warnings urging civilians to leave the area. At the same time, Israel prepared to mobilize reserves to secure the ground forces.

The fighting in Khan Yunis is part of a series of operations that have also hit the northern Gaza Strip in recent weeks. In Zeitoun, IDF soldiers recently discovered and destroyed a tunnel several hundred meters long, while in Gaza City, high-rise buildings used by Hamas as observation posts and operational centers were targeted.

In addition, there have been targeted strikes against leaders of Hamas and Islamic Jihad. Several high-ranking terrorists have been eliminated by combined ground and air strikes.

The operation in Khan Yunis shows how deeply Hamas has buried its infrastructure in the Gaza Strip literally. But with every tunnel destroyed, with every weapons depot blown up, the organization loses its ability to act.

Israel is thus pursuing a clear strategy: to eliminate Hamas's retreat areas step by step, to crush its leadership, and to strip the coastal strip of its terrorist infrastructure.

The message is clear: Khan Yunis, once a stronghold and refuge, is no longer a safe place for Hamas.

An Israeli precision strike in the heart of Qatar has killed at least five senior Hamas officials, including the son of Politburo member Khalil al-Hayya. Nevertheless, the terrorist organization announced that it would continue negotiations on a possible hostage deal.

The air strike hit several villas in the Al-Qatifiyah district, including a property belonging to Khalil al-Hayya and adjacent offices formerly used by Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh. Haniyeh had already been killed in Tehran at the end of July in an Israeli operation.



According to sources within Hamas, two members of the Politburo were seriously injured, but their identities are being kept secret. Al-Hayya's son, Hammam al-Hayya, his office manager Jihad Lubad, three bodyguards, and a Qatari security official were killed. Israel is said to have used several high-precision explosive devices to destroy the entire complex network, which housed the offices and residences of the Hamas elite.

It is still unclear whether the strike completely eliminated its main target, parts of the Hamas leadership. What is certain, however, is that Israel's intelligence services have detailed knowledge of Hamas' infrastructure in Doha. According to reports, the meeting may have been located using cell phone signals, although Hamas usually leaves phones outside during high-level meetings.

For the terrorist organization, the attack not only means a significant loss of personnel, but also a breach in symbolic security: even in Doha, long considered a safe haven, the leaders are no longer untouchable.

It is noteworthy that, despite the attack, Hamas is sticking to its plan to continue talks on a ceasefire and a hostage deal. According to the Arab newspaper Asharq Al-Awsat, the Politburo decided in internal consultations to contact mediators as soon as the security situation had calmed down.

The demands remain unchanged: complete withdrawal of Israeli troops from Gaza, a permanent ceasefire, and international guarantees for the future administration of the coastal strip. Hamas is thus setting conditions that would amount to a de facto surrender by Israel – a prospect that Jerusalem categorically rejects.

Immediately after the strike, a meeting between the Hamas leadership and Qatar's Prime Minister Mohammed bin Abdulrahman Al Thani had to be canceled. Al Thani was supposed to present a proposal supported by US President Donald Trump. Instead, Hamas accused Washington of complicity and spoke of an "American-Israeli trick" designed to lure its leadership into a trap.

The fact that several Hamas officials flew in from Turkey and Egypt specifically for this purpose shows how important the planned meeting in Doha was. The strike is therefore likely to have not only caused personnel losses, but also severely disrupted the terrorist organization's internal operations.

For Israel, the attack is more than a tactical success. It shows that the Israeli army is capable of precisely targeting Hamas commanders even abroad – whether in Tehran, Beirut or now in Doha. At the same time, this increases the pressure on Hamas, as it must recognise that its leadership structures are not safe in any capital city in the region.

However, Hamas' decision to remain at the negotiating table despite heavy losses indicates that it needs a diplomatic stage in order to remain politically relevant.

Vanellus said:

Ok so now you tacitly admit the "chanting" which you brought up is irrelevant.

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Nope. Did not say that.

Vanellus said:

Right!
You haven't answered the point that Netanyahu enabled the support of Hamas and by his own confession that was done to divide the Palestinians.

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Sure did. Please read my post again.

Vanellus said:

The human shield lie has been used before. Israeli leaders had vowed to wipe out Hamas (and Gaza) whatever happened to the hostages.

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“An interviewer recently posed a logical question to Mousa Abu Marzouk, a senior member of the Hamas politburo: “Since you have built 500 kilometers of tunnels, why haven’t you built bomb shelters where civilians can hide during bombardments?”

Abu Marzouk said the tunnels are “meant to protect us” from Israeli aircraft and facilitate attacks on Israeli targets.

“Us” meaning Hamas. Not civilians.

Hamas chooses not to build bomb shelters in Gaza because that would undercut its ability to use the population as human shields.

By putting civilians in or above its military positions, Hamas knows it cannot lose.”


The FACT that Hamas uses civilians as human shields is well documented since the 2008 terrorist attacks on Israel.

Vanellus said:

Israel has nuclear weapons. Doesn't mean that Israel poses an existential threat to the surrounding Arab countries: first Gaza, next ...

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Israel has had nuclear weapons since the 1960’s and would never, and have never, use them offensively. Iran, on the other hand, would use it to destroy Israel the first chance they get. Israel has not used a nuclear weapon in Gaza nor had there ever been a plan to use one anywhere in the Middle East, so your answer is a just in case fallacy.

Protecting terrorism is awful.

The genocide lie: Genocide researchers contradict anti-Israel propaganda.



A resolution by the International Association of Genocide Scholars (IAGS) condemns Israel's military action in Gaza as genocide. Many media outlets reported on this anti-Israel resolution. The IAGS is portrayed as the leading authority on genocide research.

Contrary to what is claimed, the IAGS is not a reputable scientific association. For a membership fee of 30 dollars, anyone can become a member of this dubious association of ‘genocide scholars’ without any verification of their identity or knowledge of history, international law or genocide. The membership directory also includes numerous obvious fake names, including ‘Adolf Hitler,’ according to research by The Times of Israel.

More than 500 reputable scientists and institutes now disagree with the resolution and are calling for the genocide accusation to be withdrawn, including well-known professors, entire faculties, memorials and museums (Scholars for Truth about genocide). They emphasise that only the terrorist attack by Hamas on 7 Oct 2023 meets the definition of genocide and point out that the deaths of civilians in the Gaza Strip are not attributable to Israel's intention to kill civilians, but to Hamas' tactic of using its own population and civilian infrastructure as a shield for attacks. The IAGS genocide resolution absolves Hamas of its responsibility, distorts the facts and violates the most basic scientific standards. Furthermore, this genocide resolution does not take into account that the war could be ended if Hamas laid down its arms and released the hostages.

After being exposed as a fake organization the IAGS has blocked access to its public membership directory.

Will there be any accountability for the lies this fake association spread?

For two and a half years, Israeli-Russian researcher Elisabeth Zourkov was held captive by the terrorist group Kata'ib Hezbollah in Iraq. Now she is free, visibly scarred, but smiling. Her release was achieved through months of secret negotiations and massive pressure from Jerusalem and Washington.


Elisabeth Zourkov, supported by paramedics, her family by her side, in Tel Hashomer Hospital.
She moves with difficulty, but she smiles.
It is her first public appearance after more than 900 days in hiding from Iraqi terrorists.

In March 2023, Zourkov, a doctoral student at Princeton University with Israeli and Russian passports, was abducted in Baghdad. Behind the kidnapping was the Iranian-backed Kata'ib Hezbollah militia, one of the most radical groups in Iraq. She disappeared for more than two years. All her family knew was that she was alive but suffering.

Now relatives report that Zourkov suffered under harsh conditions while in captivity: back pain that now limits her movements, sleep patterns disrupted by heat and imprisonment. Her only connection to the outside world was a radio, through which she listened to news from Israel.

Her release was no coincidence, but the result of lengthy secret negotiations. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu spoke with Zourkov after her return and emphasised that enormous efforts had been invested over a long period of time to bring her home and that the same determination applies to all hostages still in captivity.

Washington also played a key role. President Donald Trump declared on social media that Zourkov was now safe after months of torture. He said he had signed a presidential decree containing comprehensive sanctions threats against terrorist groups, a decisive lever that apparently persuaded Kata'ib Hezbollah to back down.

Adam Boehler, Trump's special envoy for hostage affairs, reported on months of intense behind-the-scenes work. The breakthrough came when the US sent a clear signal that it would do ‘everything in its power’ to secure Zourkov's release.

The message conveyed by this case is clear: terrorist groups respond to pressure. Boehler put it plainly: Kata'ib Hezbollah has understood the seriousness of the situation. Hamas must now understand the same thing. All hostages must be released, otherwise there will be consequences.

For Israel, Zourkov's return is not only a human triumph, but also a political signal. After 7 October, dozens of Israelis are still in the hands of Hamas. Netanyahu took the opportunity to reassure the families of these hostages:

"We will act tirelessly until every single one of them returns."

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For Zourkov herself, a long road to recovery now begins. At Sheba Hospital, she is receiving medical and psychological care, similar to that given to former Hamas hostages. Her family described the first encounters as moments we will never forget.

Her return is more than just a private joy. It is a reminder that Israel does not abandon its citizens and that the international community must clearly distinguish between perpetrators and victims.

Hentenza said:

Nope. Did not say that.

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I think you need to look up "tacitly"

Hentenza said:

Sure did. Please read my post again.

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Your post #4690 did not refer to Netanyahu

Hentenza said:

Israel has had nuclear weapons since the 1960’s and would never, and have never, use them offensively. Iran, on the other hand, would use it to destroy Israel the first chance they get. Israel has not used a nuclear weapon in Gaza nor had there ever been a plan to use one anywhere in the Middle East, so your answer is a just in case fallacy.

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Pure speculation by you.

It is the IDF who use Palestinians as human shields:
https://www.btselem.org/topic/human_shields

Over the years, the military practiced an official policy of using Palestinians as human shields, ordering them to carry out military activities that put their lives in jeopardy: Palestinians were forced to remove suspicious objects from roads, tell other Palestinians to come out and surrender themselves, physically shield soldiers while they fired, and more. In 2005, the High Court of Justice ruled the practice unlawful, yet soldiers still occasionally used Palestinians as human shields, particularly during military operations. In most cases, no one was held accountable.

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There are more recent examples described in the above Jewish website.

e.g.

Israeli soldiers shot and killed a pregnant woman, used her relative as a human shield, and killed another woman when they blew up her front door​

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Bilal Abu Shu’lah was held by the soldiers for about 20 hours, during which they used him as a human shield several times. Among other things, around noon he was taken to the home of the al-Ashqar family, where 17 family members were staying at the time due to the raid on the camp. The Israeli forces entered the yard and attached explosives to the door leading into the living room. Rahaf al-Ashqar (21) and her father Fouad al-Ashqar (51) were in the room at the time. When they noticed the soldiers in the yard and saw through the window the wires running to the door, they tried to escape to the back of the house, but before they could get away, the soldiers blew up the door. Rahaf sustained severe injuries all over her body. She managed to call for help once before passing. Her father, Fouad, was injured in the legs by fragments.

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Vanellus said:

I think you need to look up "tacitly"

Your post #4690 did not refer to Netanyahu

Pure speculation by you.

It is the IDF who use Palestinians as human shields:
https://www.btselem.org/topic/human_shields

There are more recent examples described in the above Jewish website.

e.g.

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You have indeed drank the kool aid. We are never going to agree so no sense on wasting my time. Have a blessed day.