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Very informative.. thanks.in Genesis the generation was measured as 100 years as the LORD told Abraham he would be 400 years in a nation that he did not know and if the 4rth generation would come out with riches to inherit the promised land. Another aspect to consider is that Dan 9 70 weeks is addressed to Daniels people and the holy city which would be Jerusalem. So did the fig tree come back in 1948 or when Jerusalem was captured? At any rate the literal nature of the return of Israel and the end of days connects great wickedness, apostacy in the church, wars rumors of wars, the return of the daily sacrifice at a time when global government is brought back at a time when a days wage sinks to a quart of wheat over the whole earth and peace is taken that men will kill one another on ethnic lines and persecution rises.
By looking at these themes we are on red alert. The depression that is coming is global. The mass migration has assured the race wars when the food supply is collapsed. The wickedness and the apostacy are at all time highs. The jews have prepared everything necessary to resume the daily sacrifices. The collapse of the global economy will bring in global government. The LORD notes these days come like a snare upon the whole earth. Seems like we are at the beginning of sorrows and are told to occupy until the LORD comes and to pray always we will escape the things that are coming upon the whole earth and to be standing before the son of man.
This is a long list of errors going back to fumbling around with Daniel. Jesus says only the born again can see the kingdom in that the kingdom is spiritual. But the physical kingdom buffs missed it thinking it did not come when it was supposed to. And they still look for it thinking it is physical = Phariseeism, Premillennialism/Dispensationalism.on the other hand if you are wrong you are certainly taking away from God's word. Your insistence of merging the kingdom of Heaven with the kingdom to come is where you have made your mistake. The kingdom that comes and covers the earth and has no end can only have one starting point. In Dan 2 when it comes it leaves no trace of man's rule and grinds the image of man's domain to powder and blows it away. Rev says the nations who have been deceived will no longer be deceived for 1000 years. Well man's kingdoms still exist and the nations have never been more deceived.
Look a bit further and Dan 7 says the kingdom that comes begins when a pompous ruler is persecuting the saints for a time times and half a time. Then one like the son of man who is standing before the ancient of days and to him is given the kingdom that covers the earth and the pompous one is given to the flame. This time frame links Rev and Dan with the final 42 months of terror before it is stopped and the kingdom comes. If you look at Zech 14 the LORD comes with his saints and is king over all the earth in a day when Jerusalem is being overrun and half the city is taken captive. The LORD slays the enemies and things are different from that time on. Jer 31 notes that the city (Jerusalem one day will be rebuilt when there are dead bodies filling the valley and from that time on it will be holy and never torn down again. Jerusalem will need to be rebuilt in Dan 7 Zech 14 and Rev all bring the battle there as does Joel and Hosea.
Eze 36-38 is directed at the mountains of Israel who were long desolate and to the people gathered back form all the nations where they were scattered. The LORD promises to remove teh reproach of the nations from them and that He will be hallowed in them and to give them a new heart. He also notes that they have profaned His name in all the nations where they were scattered. This fits modern day Israel to a T and again shows the coming conversion of Israel at the 2nd coming of Jesus.
Careful with the way you spell the name of Jesus. Some Judas-icer posters here have a problem with it. Maybe it breaks the Law you guys all follow? I dunno.Why would you say that Messiancs pick and choose?
I believe in Yahshua; when he says all of the law stands.
in Genesis the generation was measured as 100 years as the LORD told Abraham he would be 400 years in a nation that he did not know and if the 4rth generation would come out with riches to inherit the promised land. Another aspect to consider is that Dan 9 70 weeks is addressed to Daniels people and the holy city which would be Jerusalem. So did the fig tree come back in 1948 or when Jerusalem was captured?
At any rate the literal nature of the return of Israel and the end of days connects great wickedness, apostasy in the church, wars rumors of wars, the return of the daily sacrifice at a time when global government is brought back at a time when a days wage sinks to a quart of wheat over the whole earth and peace is taken that men will kill one another on ethnic lines and persecution rises.
By looking at these themes we are on red alert. The depression that is coming is global. The mass migration has assured the race wars when the food supply is collapsed. The wickedness and the apostasy are at all time highs. The Jews have prepared everything necessary to resume the daily sacrifices. The collapse of the global economy will bring in global government. The LORD notes these days come like a snare upon the whole earth. Seems like we are at the beginning of sorrows and are told to occupy until the LORD comes and to pray always we will escape the things that are coming upon the whole earth and to be standing before the son of man.
Jesus only "taught A-Millennialism in his kingdom teachings" to those who are partially blinded in that they cannot see the full counsel of His and His apostles' teaching regarding His Kingdom come and His Kingdom coming, who as a result of this their partial blindness, naturally reject any literal interpretation of our Lord's Revelation regarding the coming judgment of the world's global authorities, binding of Satan, and millennial reign, and who spiritualize half of the full counsel of God on the matter into the ether.This is a long list of errors going back to fumbling around with Daniel. Jesus says only the born again can see the kingdom in that the kingdom is spiritual. But the physical kingdom buffs missed it thinking it did not come when it was supposed to. And they still look for it thinking it is physical = Phariseeism, Premillennialism/Dispensationalism.
But the born again saw it, and continue to see it through spiritual eyes and don't expect a physical kingdom of the future. So which is it? Jesus taught Amillennialism in his kingdom teachings which means the OT kingdom prophecies are symbols for the kingdom. The Pharisees taught physical Millennialism opposing him thinking the OT kingdom prophecies are literal.
Fin one verse in Jesus' kingdom teachings in the gospel or even in the epistles that show a physical kingdom. Revelation is symbolic so you need to approach it from an Amillennial position to understand it.Jesus only "taught A-Millennialism in his kingdom teachings" to those who are partially blinded in that they cannot see the full counsel of His and His apostles' teaching regarding His Kingdom come and His Kingdom coming, who as a result of this their partial blindness, naturally reject any literal interpretation of our Lord's Revelation regarding the coming judgment of the world's global authorities, binding of Satan, and millennial reign, and who spiritualize half of the full counsel of God on the matter into the ether.
Nevertheless, Jesus does not want us becoming angry with one another over such a thing if we do not agree. A-millennialism, though not what Jesus and His apostles and the full counsel of God actually teaches, is not heresy, nor anywhere near the seriousness of the error of many other so-called "Christian" doctrines regarding obedience to the laws of Moses, praying to icons and statues, and a host of others.
Anyway great that you have picked which of the 613 Laws you need to observe and which you don't have to. I'm sure Jesus will give you a trophy for it.
Let's not take this thread off topic.Fin one verse in Jesus' kingdom teachings in the gospel or even in the epistles that show a physical kingdom. Revelation is symbolic so you need to approach it from an Amillennial position to understand it.
I'm disproving Israel is God's time clock = on topic.Let's not take this thread off topic.
1. I can do so.
2. Even if I do so, like the one who will not believe in the resurrection though one rose from the dead, so are those who will not believe in the literal millennium, though it is proved to them from the scriptures.
3. Wasting my time on it will hijack this thread by taking it off topic.
So why did I reply to your post?
Because your post brought it up, and made a false statement.
But now we must both drop that discussion in this thread because it won't be fair to the person who started it as it's off-topic from the OP.
But you started talking about the millennium, not about Israel = God's time clock. So I'm not getting into it other than correcting your false assertion.I'm disproving Israel is God's time clock = on topic.
The Millennium is where physical kingdom views end up. Rejecting Christ and returning to temple worship and animal sacrifice.But you started talking about the millennium, not about Israel = God's time clock. So I'm not getting into it other than correcting your false assertion.
Absolutely false statement. I've seen the reality of the coming Kingdom, understood why it is according to God's will and unfolding plan, and have not changed my views for decades. I will never reject Christ or support such an insult as returning to temple worship and animal sacrifice, neither would the majority of Pre-Millennilaists. You may believe you have a God-given authority to falsely accuse people with such sweeping statements, but you don't.The Millennium is where physical kingdom views end up. Rejecting Christ and returning to temple worship and animal sacrifice.
Jesus only "taught A-Millennialism in his kingdom teachings" to those who are partially blinded in that they cannot see the full counsel of His and His apostles' teaching regarding His Kingdom come and His Kingdom coming, who as a result of this their partial blindness, naturally reject any literal interpretation of our Lord's Revelation regarding the coming judgment of the world's global authorities, binding of Satan, and millennial reign, and who spiritualize half of the full counsel of God on the matter into the ether.
Nevertheless, Jesus does not want us becoming angry with one another over such a thing if we do not agree. A-millennialism, though not what Jesus and His apostles and the full counsel of God actually teaches, is not heresy, nor anywhere near the seriousness of the error of many other so-called "Christian" doctrines regarding obedience to the laws of Moses, praying to icons and statues, and a host of others.
Jesus only "taught A-Millennialism in his kingdom teachings" to those who are partially blinded in that they cannot see the full counsel of His and His apostles' teaching regarding His Kingdom come and His Kingdom coming, who as a result of this their partial blindness, naturally reject any literal interpretation of our Lord's Revelation regarding the coming judgment of the world's global authorities, binding of Satan, and millennial reign, and who spiritualize half of the full counsel of God on the matter into the ether.
Nevertheless, Jesus does not want us becoming angry with one another over such a thing if we do not agree. A-millennialism, though not what Jesus and His apostles and the full counsel of God actually teaches, is not heresy, nor anywhere near the seriousness of the error of many other so-called "Christian" doctrines regarding obedience to the laws of Moses, praying to icons and statues, and a host of others.
Excellent post. Very, very thought-provoking. You should change your handle to "Alert and awake".
Hi Israel is God's time clock and the 70 weeks theme with the 70th week bringing in so many promises at once and it is glorious to look at the before and after picture through the rest of the Bible. This might be a long post but sort of a short medley that touches just a few of the themes of the before and after picture painted throughout the scriptures.Jesus only "taught A-Millennialism in his kingdom teachings" to those who are partially blinded in that they cannot see the full counsel of His and His apostles' teaching regarding His Kingdom come and His Kingdom coming, who as a result of this their partial blindness, naturally reject any literal interpretation of our Lord's Revelation regarding the coming judgment of the world's global authorities, binding of Satan, and millennial reign, and who spiritualize half of the full counsel of God on the matter into the ether.
Nevertheless, Jesus does not want us becoming angry with one another over such a thing if we do not agree. A-millennialism, though not what Jesus and His apostles and the full counsel of God actually teaches, is not heresy, nor anywhere near the seriousness of the error of many other so-called "Christian" doctrines regarding obedience to the laws of Moses, praying to icons and statues, and a host of others.
I heard you the first time HARK, in one of your own threads, and in the only thread I ever started. You know I disagree with you, and why I don't agree (if, regardless of the fact that you disagree with them, you ever read my reasons). So no point in our "refuting" one another's statements.Like I said, all of the law stands. Anyone who breaks the law is picking and choosing.
Generation is not a life span.They say that Israel is Gods time clock and they have always added 70 years onto 1948 , however 2018 came and went. But Psalm 90:10 says , ( The years of our life are seventy, or even by reason of strength eighty. ) Now given that we now live longer due to modern tech and meds , I personally would have taken the 80 years.
Hi Israel is God's time clock and the 70 weeks theme with the 70th week bringing in so many promises at once and it is glorious to look at the before and after picture through the rest of the Bible. This might be a long post but sort of a short medley that touches just a few of the themes of the before and after picture painted throughout the scriptures.
In Isaiah 2 we see this
1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.
2 Now it shall come to pass in the latter days
That the mountain of the LORD’s house
Shall be established on the top of the mountains,
And shall be exalted above the hills;
And all nations shall flow to it.
3 Many people shall come and say,
“Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD,
To the house of the God of Jacob;
He will teach us His ways,
And we shall walk in His paths.”
For out of Zion shall go forth the law,
And the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
4 He shall judge between the nations,
And rebuke many people;
They shall beat their swords into plowshares,
And their spears into pruning hooks;
Nation shall not lift up sword against nation,
Neither shall they learn war anymore.
hosea
In the place where it was said to them,
‘You are not My people,’[fn]
There it shall be said to them,
‘You are sons of the living God.’
11 Then the children of Judah and the children of Israel
Shall be gathered together,
And appoint for themselves one head;
And they shall come up out of the land,
For great will be the day of Jezreel!
“And it shall be, in that day,”
Says the LORD,
“That you will call Me ‘My Husband,’[fn]
And no longer call Me ‘My Master,’[fn]
17 For I will take from her mouth the names of the Baals,
And they shall be remembered by their name no more.
18 In that day I will make a covenant for them
With the beasts of the field,
With the birds of the air,
And with the creeping things of the ground.
Bow and sword of battle I will shatter from the earth,
To make them lie down safely.
19 “I will betroth you to Me forever;
Yes, I will betroth you to Me
In righteousness and justice,
In lovingkindness and mercy;
20 I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness,
And you shall know the LORD.
21 “It shall come to pass in that day
That I will answer,” says the LORD;
“I will answer the heavens,
And they shall answer the earth.
22 The earth shall answer
With grain,
With new wine,
And with oil;
They shall answer Jezreel.
23 Then I will sow her for Myself in the earth,
And I will have mercy on her who had not obtained mercy;
Then I will say to those who were not My people,
‘You are My people!’
And they shall say, ‘You are my God!’ ”
For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7 Of the increase of His government and peace
There will be no end,
Upon the throne of David and over His kingdom,
To order it and establish it with judgment and justice
From that time forward, even forever.
The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.
He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
To proclaim liberty to the captives,
And the opening of the prison to those who are bound;
2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD,
And the day of vengeance of our God;
To comfort all who mourn,
3 To console those who mourn in Zion,
To give them beauty for ashes,
The oil of joy for mourning,
The garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness;
That they may be called trees of righteousness,
The planting of the LORD, that He may be glorified.”
4 And they shall rebuild the old ruins,
They shall raise up the former desolations,
And they shall repair the ruined cities,
The desolations of many generations.
5 Strangers shall stand and feed your flocks,
And the sons of the foreigner
Shall be your plowmen and your vinedressers.
6 But you shall be named the priests of the LORD,
They shall call you the servants of our God.
You shall eat the riches of the Gentiles,
And in their glory you shall boast.
7 Instead of your shame you shall have double honor,
And instead of confusion they shall rejoice in their portion.
Therefore in their land they shall possess double;
Everlasting joy shall be theirs.
8 “For I, the LORD, love justice;
I hate robbery for burnt offering;
I will direct their work in truth,
And will make with them an everlasting covenant.
9 Their descendants shall be known among the Gentiles,
And their offspring among the people.
All who see them shall acknowledge them,
That they are the posterity whom the LORD has blessed.”
God of Israel, saying: ‘Write in a book for yourself all the words that I have spoken to you. 3 For behold, the days are coming,’ says the LORD, ‘that I will bring back from captivity My people Israel and Judah,’ says the LORD. ‘And I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.’ ”
4 Now these are the words that the LORD spoke concerning Israel and Judah.
5 “For thus says the LORD:
‘We have heard a voice of trembling,
Of fear, and not of peace.
6 Ask now, and see,
Whether a man is ever in labor with child?
So why do I see every man with his hands on his loins
Like a woman in labor,
And all faces turned pale?
7 Alas! For that day is great,
So that none is like it;
And it is the time of Jacob’s trouble,
But he shall be saved out of it.
8 ‘For it shall come to pass in that day,’
Says the LORD of hosts,
‘That I will break his yoke from your neck,
And will burst your bonds;
Foreigners shall no more enslave them.
9 But they shall serve the LORD their God,
And David their king,
Whom I will raise up for them.
1 “At that time Michael shall stand up,
The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people;
And there shall be a time of trouble,
Such as never was since there was a nation,
Even to that time.
And at that time your people shall be delivered,
Every one who is found written in the book.
2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake,
Some to everlasting life,
Some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 Those who are wise shall shine
Like the brightness of the firmament,
And those who turn many to righteousness
Like the stars forever and ever.
Oh ok so what is the non literal interpretation.This is forcing a literal interpretation into Revelation which adds to God's words.
Jesus taught the kingdom is spiritual, not physical.Oh ok so what is the non literal interpretation.
Reverting to temple sacrifice = apostasy which is unforgivable according to Hebrews 6.Absolutely false statement. I've seen the reality of the coming Kingdom, understood why it is according to God's will and unfolding plan, and have not changed my views for decades. I will never reject Christ or support such an insult as returning to temple worship and animal sacrifice, neither would the majority of Pre-Millennilaists. You may believe you have a God-given authority to falsely accuse people with such sweeping statements, but you don't.