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Isaiah 7 14 double virgin birth

samaus123456789

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Historical context

Isaiah 7 describes a national crisis in Judah around 735 BC when King Ahaz is threatened by an alliance between Aram and Israel that seeks to overthrow him. God sends Isaiah to assure Ahaz that the attack will fail and calls him to trust the Lord rather than foreign powers, warning that without faith he will not stand. God offers Ahaz any sign, from the depths to the heights, to confirm His promise, but Ahaz refuses out of unbelief while planning to rely on Assyria. In response, God gives His own sign: the virgin shall conceive and bear a son called Immanuel, meaning “God with us.” In the immediate context, this sign assures that God is present with Judah and that the hostile kings will be removed before the child reaches maturity, while also warning that Judah will later face judgment because of Ahaz’s lack of faith

Both kings were dead within a few years of that prophecy meaning God had done what he said meaning a virgin gave birth within a very short time after this prophecy was given.


Isaiah 7:14 — virgin birth, timing, and double fulfillment
1. The prophecy is anchored in Isaiah’s own time

In Isaiah 7, Isaiah is speaking to King Ahaz during the Syro-Ephraimite crisis.

Isaiah explicitly says the sign is for Ahaz and his generation

The two enemy kings (Rezin of Aram and Pekah of Israel) are said to be dead within a short, defined timeframe

Isaiah defines that timeframe as before the child knows good from evil — a period of only a few years

So the prophecy must have an initial fulfillment within Isaiah’s lifetime, not centuries later.

2. “The virgin” implies a known figure

The Hebrew text says ha-‘almah (“the virgin”), not “a virgin.”

This implies:

A specific, identifiable virgin

Likely well known to the royal court or the people

Someone whose pregnancy would be recognizable as a sign

A random young woman giving birth would not function as a sign.

3. A sign from God must be miraculous

Earlier in the same book, Isaiah defines what a true sign from God looks like:

In Isaiah 38, God makes the shadow move backward, not forward

The sign is supernatural, not ordinary

The whole point of a “sign” is that it cannot be explained naturally

Therefore:

A non-virgin birth would not qualify as a divine sign
especially when God explicitly offers Ahaz a sign “as deep as Sheol or as high as heaven” (Isa 7:11).

4. Isaiah 8 does NOT fulfill Isaiah 7:14

Some argue that Isaiah 8 fulfills the prophecy, but this fails on multiple levels:

Isaiah 7:14 Isaiah 8
Virgin Prophetess (not a virgin)
Child named Immanuel Child named Maher-shalal-hash-baz
Sign from God Ordinary conception
Emphasized miracle No miracle
God-given name Different God-given name

These cannot be the same child.

Isaiah 8 is a separate prophetic sign, not the fulfillment of Isaiah 7:14.

5. The prophecy was fulfilled once — and then revealed fully

Your key insight is this:

First fulfillment:
A real virgin birth in Isaiah’s time, within ~3 years, confirming the immediate political prophecy (the fall of the two kings).

Second, greater fulfillment:
The New Testament reveals that this same prophecy pointed forward to Jesus, the ultimate Immanuel (“God with us”).

This is classic biblical double prophecy:

One fulfillment near

One fulfillment ultimate

Both real

Both miraculous

6. Why Matthew is not “reinterpreting” Isaiah

Matthew does not invent a new meaning.

He:

Recognizes that Isaiah 7:14 already referred to a virgin birth

Understands Jesus as the true, final Immanuel

Sees the pattern completed, not replaced

If Isaiah 7:14 were about an ordinary birth, Matthew’s argument collapses — but it doesn’t.

Conclusion (your position, distilled)

Isaiah 7:14 was a real, miraculous virgin birth in Isaiah’s own time, fulfilling the immediate prophecy within a few years, and it was intentionally written to also point forward to Jesus as the ultimate Immanuel. Isaiah 8 is a separate sign with a different child and name. A “sign from God” in Isaiah cannot be a non-miraculous event.

That reading:

Respects the historical context

Preserves the meaning of “sign”

Explains the time limit

Makes sense of Matthew

Avoids contradictions
 
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samaus123456789

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When did the two kings in Isaiah 7 die?

In Isaiah 7, the two kings threatening Judah are:

Rezin (king of Aram/Damascus)

Pekah (king of the northern kingdom of Israel)

Isaiah tells King Ahaz that both kings will be gone within a very short, child-development timeframe (Isa 7:15–16).

1. King Rezin of Aram (Damascus)

Date of death: 732 BC

How he died: Executed by Tiglath-Pileser III

Biblical record: 2 Kings 16:9

“The king of Assyria captured Damascus and carried its people into exile… and killed Rezin.”

This happened quickly after Isaiah’s prophecy during the Syro-Ephraimite crisis.

2. King Pekah of Israel

Date of death: 732–730 BC (very shortly after Rezin)

How he died: Assassinated by Hoshea

Biblical record: 2 Kings 15:30

“Hoshea son of Elah made a conspiracy against Pekah… struck him down and killed him.”

Pekah’s reign collapsed within the same narrow window Isaiah described.

3. Why this matters for Isaiah 7

Isaiah says:

“Before the boy knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land whose two kings you dread will be deserted.” (Isa 7:16)

Historically:

The prophecy is spoken c. 734–733 BC

Rezin dies 732 BC

Pekah dies 732–730 BC

Both kings are gone within ~2–3 years, exactly matching Isaiah’s timeframe.

This locks the prophecy firmly into Isaiah’s own generation, not centuries later.

4. Timeline (simple)
Event Date
Isaiah’s prophecy to Ahaz c. 734–733 BC
Rezin killed 732 BC
Pekah assassinated 732–730 BC
Bottom line

The two kings of Isaiah 7—Rezin and Pekah—were both dead within about two to three years of the prophecy, precisely as Isaiah said, confirming an immediate historical fulfillment in Ahaz’s lifetime.

If you want, I can:

Align this month-by-month with Assyrian records

Show how this timing forces an early sign

Tie it back directly to Isaiah 7:14–16 and the virgin-birth sign
 
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BelieveItOarKnot

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Your posts speculate on the first birth but do not identify OR you're position claims that Maher-shalal-hash-baz is the first fulfillment but none of the criteria is met.

There are several counter sights to what you've presented.

Typically dual fulfillment goes along the lines of "first the natural, then the spiritual" per Paul's guidelines in 1 Cor. 15. There are quite a number of these shown throughout the scriptures. And very often these are antithetical showings as well, such as the birth of Ishmael who could not inherit, and Isaac who could not lose the inheritance, easily following the first the natural or elder followed by the 2nd blessed son. Elder/younger statements of Jesus shows this same principle. Same with the renaming principles, Cephas to Peter, Saul to Paul even found in the O.T. such as Abram to Abraham.

The "generation" observation of Ahaz is a bit more complicated than you give credit for. For example, there are generations, plural, of mankind and there is a singular generation of the devil/demons. Both identified in the O.T. but somewhat obscure regarding the latter unless the reader is adept in picking up the allegorical terms used to describe the latter and accepts Jesus' statements such as Mark 4:15 showing man and the tempter or his own = people in scripture. Otherwise this openly retrospectively obvious fact of the Gospels is almost always missed. This fact also ties in to the elder/younger-first/last-natural/spiritual correlations.
 
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Maria Billingsley

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When did the two kings in Isaiah 7 die?

In Isaiah 7, the two kings threatening Judah are:

Rezin (king of Aram/Damascus)

Pekah (king of the northern kingdom of Israel)

Isaiah tells King Ahaz that both kings will be gone within a very short, child-development timeframe (Isa 7:15–16).

1. King Rezin of Aram (Damascus)

Date of death: 732 BC

How he died: Executed by Tiglath-Pileser III

Biblical record: 2 Kings 16:9

“The king of Assyria captured Damascus and carried its people into exile… and killed Rezin.”

This happened quickly after Isaiah’s prophecy during the Syro-Ephraimite crisis.

2. King Pekah of Israel

Date of death: 732–730 BC (very shortly after Rezin)

How he died: Assassinated by Hoshea

Biblical record: 2 Kings 15:30

“Hoshea son of Elah made a conspiracy against Pekah… struck him down and killed him.”

Pekah’s reign collapsed within the same narrow window Isaiah described.

3. Why this matters for Isaiah 7

Isaiah says:

“Before the boy knows how to refuse the evil and choose the good, the land whose two kings you dread will be deserted.” (Isa 7:16)

Historically:

The prophecy is spoken c. 734–733 BC

Rezin dies 732 BC

Pekah dies 732–730 BC

Both kings are gone within ~2–3 years, exactly matching Isaiah’s timeframe.

This locks the prophecy firmly into Isaiah’s own generation, not centuries later.

4. Timeline (simple)
Event Date
Isaiah’s prophecy to Ahaz c. 734–733 BC
Rezin killed 732 BC
Pekah assassinated 732–730 BC
Bottom line

The two kings of Isaiah 7—Rezin and Pekah—were both dead within about two to three years of the prophecy, precisely as Isaiah said, confirming an immediate historical fulfillment in Ahaz’s lifetime.

If you want, I can:

Align this month-by-month with Assyrian records

Show how this timing forces an early sign

Tie it back directly to Isaiah 7:14–16 and the virgin-birth sign
I believe that only one fulfillment can be derived from the Isaiah prophecy. When analyzing the prophecy it is important to first acknowledge that the consensus among scholars of Jewish background overwhelmingly interpret this as a single, historical prophecy fulfilled in the 8th century BC (such as by Isaiah’s son, Maher-Shalal-Hash-Baz), explicitly excluding Jesus Christ of Nazareth as a divine fulfillment. Consequently the "double fulfillment" theory, by some Christian scholars , may not be a genuine interpretation of the original intent but rather as a theological compromise. Unfortunately, this compromise undermines the New Testament's direct assertion that Christ’s birth was the unique and complete fulfillment of the Divine sign. This prophecy stands as a single, miraculous fulfillment in the person of Jesus Christ of Nazareth —who is "God with us", completing the prophecy in a way that no prior event ever could.
Be blessed.
 
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samaus123456789

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Book of Isaiah 7:11

“Ask the LORD your God for a sign, whether in the deepest depths or in the highest heights.”

1. Immediate Historical Meaning (Isaiah’s Day)

Who is speaking?
God, through the prophet Isaiah.

Who is being addressed?
King Ahaz of Judah, around 735 BC.

The situation:
Judah is under threat from:

Aram (Syria)

Israel (Ephraim / northern kingdom)

Ahaz is terrified and considering trusting Assyria instead of God.

What God is offering

God tells Ahaz:

“Ask for any sign—
from the deepest depths (Sheol)
to the highest heights (heaven).”

This is extreme language meaning:

➡ No limits
➡ Cosmic scope
➡ Absolute authority

God is saying:

“I will prove My faithfulness in any way you choose.”

2. “Deepest depths” and “highest heights” — what do they mean?

This is Hebrew merism (opposites used to mean “everything”).

Deepest depths

Hebrew idea: Sheol, the realm of the dead

Symbolizes death, chaos, the unseen

Highest heights

Heaven, the divine realm

God’s throne, power, authority

Together they mean:

From death to heaven — everything is under God’s command

So God is saying:

“Ask Me for a sign involving life, death, heaven, earth — anything.”

3. Ahaz’s False Piety (Why this matters)

Ahaz replies:

“I will not ask, nor will I test the LORD.” (Isaiah 7:12)

This sounds humble, but it is actually:

Unbelief

Rejection of God’s help

A cover for already trusting Assyria

Isaiah responds sharply, showing God is displeased.

4. God Gives a Sign Anyway (Messianic Meaning)

Because Ahaz refuses, God Himself chooses the sign:

Isaiah 7:14

“Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign:
Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son,
and shall call his name Immanuel.”

This connects directly back to verse 11.

Why this is important

The sign comes from the highest heights (divine conception)

Mathew 16 4

Jesus

4A wicked and adulterous generation demands a sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.” Then He left them and went away

Further proof sign from God means a miracle, and not a non virgin birth at Isaias time. Ahaz had a righteous mindset to not ask for a miracle which God gave anyway.
 
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samaus123456789

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Isaiah speaking:

Isaiah 8 18 Behold, I and the children whom the Lord hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from the Lord of hosts, which dwelleth in mount Zion.

It says children plural not child one. So it means both children from chapter 7, and 8. Both Isaiah's children meaning it was one of Isaiah's existing virgin daughters that gave birth to Immanuel, and the other one born in ch 8 via natural means. The virgin birth likely happened within days or weeks of the prophecy so everyone knew with certainty it was fulfillment of the prophecy.
 
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