Is Word Of Faith true?

[joevberry3]

Is WOF true? Lets not talk about particular preachers of WOF, but lets remain on the topic of rather or not WOF is true or not.

God Bless,
Joe

www.arkwebshost.com/biblestudies/joevberry3/

 

[flyfishing]

Is WOF true? Lets not talk about particular preachers of WOF, but lets remain on the topic of rather or not WOF is true or not.

God Bless,
Joe

www.arkwebshost.com/biblestudies/joevberry3/

Edited for accusatory actions and questioning other members faith.

 

[TheScottsMen]

Yes... We recognize the soverignity of GOD and his PROMISES.

 

[TheScottsMen]

FlyFishing: your response sounds like something right off the AG website With that in mind, I'm guessing your Assembly of God Pentecostal?

 

[TheScottsMen]

From the AG WEBSITE - Comments by me.
http://ag.org/top/beliefs/christian_doctrines/gendoct_03_faith_prayer.cfm

In our day, however, some have extended this truth from "believing in faith" to "claiming in faith." In such cases human desire is imposed upon the sovereign will and purposes of God. In the Assemblies of God we believe to make such demands on God is contrary to the spirit of Scripture.

##To make such demands? If someone promised you a million dollars and you signed a contract and that person turned around and said ,"Nope - now you can't have it", the person who was made the promise would fight to the last being for that promise. Yet when people come to the promises of God, they simply Give up and say its God will they do not receive what God has promised##

This imbalance in applying faith grows out of an effort to see and experience the supernatural. As an example, people who are ill or in need require healing or some form of provision in their life. In an act of faith, they petition God through prayer to answer their needs. Time passes. With no immediate answer in sight they grow weary of waiting and demand answers. In response, isolated Bible verses are used to support their insistence that God must perform according to their demands. Sadly, what begins as a sincere longing to see God work degenerates into a spirit of insistence. Ultimately, this attitude prevents a trusting rest in God's care and His provision.

#God must not perform according to their demands! God is acting according to what he said! God didn't give us a promise so it would look good on paper, he had someone write it because it was true and he wanted us to know it. Faith is substance of things not seen. We are to believe we receive right when we pray. How can we be so bold? Because God promised it! God doesn't break his promises. Man does. Unbelief robs us.#

Sometimes when prayers aren't answered as one requests, other zealous believers comment, "You didn't’t have enough faith," or "You need to increase your faith." But to make such statements is as futile as to say "Stop being sick." This gives emphasis on faith in faith itself rather than faith in God. He and He alone is to be the object and focus of our faith

#Yup, God promises something, then turns around and says, nah, you really can't have it, it only works for some people. I mean, I promised it for everyone, but not for you... This isn't my God. God doesn't contradict himself like man#

How do we stay on the cutting edge of faith while still avoiding the extreme? The answer is paradoxical–the willingness to trust and believe while also experiencing a spirit of acceptance to God’s sovereign purposes. In other words, we pray in faith but are content to leave the results with God.

#Cutting edge of faith? Please! Their answer is to believe in only what they see happen, if they can't see it, oh well, God said something he didn't mean#

The danger of missing the essential faith balance in one’s prayer petitions, therefore, is twofold: 1) That we shrink back from believing God for the supernatural–that full expectation that He is going to act; and 2) that we cross over the line and become god-players–the imposing of our agenda on God. All Christians must find a balance between aggressive faith and obedient compliance to His will. To this balance the Scriptures give strong testimony."

#unbelief again and again#

Gods soverignity affirms His will (Word), it does not contradict it.

 

[flyfishing]

FlyFishing: your response sounds like something right off the AG website With that in mind, I'm guessing your Assembly of God Pentecostal?

I was!!! Now just a servant of the Word.. The issues i have with wof are genuinely motivated by love for THe body and tHE LORDS REUTATION..

Today my body fights the flu, but my spirit rejoices in salvation..

 

[TheScottsMen]

I was!!! Now just a servant of the Word.. The issues i have with wof are genuinely motivated by love for THe body and tHE LORDS REUTATION..

And we all await that. Sooner hopefully then later

 

[Theophilus7]

Is WOF true? Lets not talk about particular preachers of WOF, but lets remain on the topic of rather or not WOF is true or not.

This is a difficult question to answer for a number of reasons. Are you asking about a particular teaching or emphasis? The Word of Faith movement has a number of distinctives.

In my opinion, (for what it's worth), there is usually some basic truth in most of the Word of Faith doctrines. Where there is a problem, it is usually to do with 1) how that truth has been emphasised and 2) mistaken ideas that have clustered around it.

A couple of examples:

1) I believe, as WoF teaches, that healing is actually available for us today, not just at the resurrection. However, I would argue that Word of faith theology suffers from 'over-realised eschatology' on this point. It exaggerates how much healing the body of Christ as a whole can expect to experience through their faith.

2) I believe, as WoF teaches, that God blesses His people with material as well as spiritual blessings. God does make people rich. However, I also believe that hardship may also be part of God's discipline. Prosperity is not constantly available to be 'claimed'.

I'm out of time. All for now.

 

[joevberry3]

I also believe WOF to be 100% true. I know some Preachers go overboard with it. But the general Doctrine is true.
God Bless,
Joe

 

[SavedByGrace3]

A man says:
Today I am sick so that my spirit can rejoice

Your spirit could rejoice in salvation without your body being sick. Your temple is sick, and you think this is a good thing? Why are you fighting this with your flesh?

Today, because you fail to discern the Lord's body, you are sickly. You are effectually trampling the body and suffering of Jesus under your feet as if it was worthless.

He took upon Himself our weaknesses, and bore our sicknesses, but you deny His pains on your behalf. You throw it back in His face, and in so doing shame Him by continuing to endure those very things He has redeemed you from.

By His stripes you were healed... but you refuse the offer, counting it as a nothing. Instead you desire to glory in the suffering of your own flesh. Thinking that you can add to the work of Christ. In so doing you declare that Jesus and His passion was not enough, that He in fact failed to do what He came to do. You insist that He needs some of your help in finishing your sanctification and redemption. "No thanks Jesus, I trust myself and my own efforts.... not you!"

Today, you have fallen short of the promises of God, and have missed it because of non-belief. All the promises of God have been made yes and amen in Jesus. In a religious show, you seek to perfect yourself with fleshy works of suffering. You are not being spiritual. You are only putting on a religious show brought about due to ignorance. God is not looking down from heaven and saying "look at my servant to is sick for my glory", if anything He is looking down and wondering why you are being sick for nothing? Jesus is not being pleased with your show of pseudo spirituality... He is wondering why you think He failed and why you think you have to add to the sufferings He endured on your behalf. God is not pleased by what you are doing because you are not acting in faith... you must have faith to please Him.


Today, because of a hardened heart of unbelief, you are falling short of the rest of God. You are following the example of those who fell in the wilderness who stubbornly refused to believe the promises.

It is not like you are trying to believe and attempting to fight the good fight of faith. It is not like you are accepting the work of Christ but are just falling short because of the weakness we are all subject to. You are rejecting the passion of Christ which redeemed you from these things. You are willingly and pointedly rejecting the direct statements of scripture that declare that Jesus has done everything needed to accomplish your salvation, redemption, sanctification, and the overcoming of the world for each of us. You refuse these things and insist on works of your own, whether they be dead works of the law or fleshy works of suffering. Jesus did it all. He suffered once and for all. There is nothing left to do to prefect you; other than for you to stop working yourself and begin to believe the promises of God.

Today you are suffering for nothing. Your spiritual growth is not being enhanced one iota. You are losing rewards. You are not pleasing God, and you are attempting to convince others to also reject the finished work of Christ in redemption!

Repent of this hardened heart of unbelief, and the Lord will forgive and heal.

You are just being sick for nothing.

Am I being hard? It is only because I detest seeing my Lord and savior so treated. It hate it when people proudly assert that they have to add to the horrific suffering Jesus endured on our behalf. I am disgusted at the religiousity of people who claim to love Him but then toss His passion back into His face as if it were meaningless and usedless. If you have seen the movie "The Passion" you will know of what I speak. His suffering on the cross was partially endured so that we would be redeemed from the curse. For us to take sides with the curse and be proud of being sick is just as if we nailed those spikes in ourselves. If you look at the cross and the terrible suffering His body endured there and fail to discern what it was for... then you will be sick, weakly, and even die young. Not because you are a sinner or "enduring till the end"... but just out of ignorance. In some cases it is beyond ignorance.... it is out and out stubborn, religious, hard heartedness against the gospel and the Word of God.

Repent! Believe!

 

[TheScottsMen]

Your spirit could rejoice in salvation without your body being sick. Your temple is sick, and you think this is a good thing? Why are you fighting this with your flesh?

Today, because you fail to discern the Lord's body, you are sickly. You are effectually trampling the body and suffering of Jesus under your feet as if it was worthless.

He took upon Himself our weaknesses, and bore our sicknesses, but you deny His pains on your behalf. You throw it back in His face, and in so doing shame Him by continuing to endure those very things He has redeemed you from.

By His stripes you were healed... but you refuse the offer, counting it as a nothing. Instead you desire to glory in the suffering of your own flesh. Thinking that you can add to the work of Christ. In so doing you declare that Jesus and His passion was not enough, that He in fact failed to do what He came to do. You insist that He needs some of your help in finishing your sanctification and redemption. "No thanks Jesus, I trust myself and my own efforts.... not you!"

Today, you have fallen short of the promises of God, and have missed it because of non-belief. All the promises of God have been made yes and amen in Jesus. In a religious show, you seek to perfect yourself with fleshy works of suffering. You are not being spiritual. You are only putting on a religious show brought about due to ignorance. God is not looking down from heaven and saying "look at my servant to is sick for my glory", if anything He is looking down and wondering why you are being sick for nothing? Jesus is not being pleased with your show of pseudo spirituality... He is wondering why you think He failed and why you think your can add to the sufferings He endured on your behalf. God is not pleased by what you are doing because you are not acting in faith... you must have faith to please Him.


Today, because of a hardened heart of unbelief, you are falling short of the rest of God. You are following the example of those who fell in the wilderness who stubbornly refused to believe the promises.

It is not like you are trying to believe and attempting to fight the good fight of faith. It is not like you are accepting the work of Christ but are just falling short because of the weakness we are all subject to. You are rejecting the passion of Christ which redeemed you from these things. You are willingly and pointedly rejecting the direct statements of scripture that declare that Jesus has done everything needed to accomplish your salvation, redemption, sanctification, and the overcoming of the world for each of us. You refuse these things and insist on works of your own, whether they be dead works of the law or fleshy works of suffering. Jesus did it all. He suffered once and for all. There is nothing left to do to prefect you; other than for you to stop working yourself and begin believe the promises of God.

Today you are suffering for nothing. Your spiritual growth is not being enhanced one iota. You are losing rewards. You are not pleasing God, and you are attempting to convince others to also reject the finished work of Christ in redemption!

Repent of this hardened heart of unbelief, and the Lord will forgive and heal.

You are just being sick for nothing.

Am I being hard? It is only because I detest seeing my Lord and savior so treated. It hate it when people proudly assert that they have to add to the horrific suffering Jesus endured on our behalf. I am disgusted at the religiousity of people who claim to love Him but then toss His passion back into His face as if it were meaningless and usedless. If you have seen the movie "The Passion" you will know of what I speak. His suffering on the cross was partially endured so that we would be redeemed from the curse. For us to take sides with the curse and be proud of being sick is just as if we nailed those spikes in ourselves. If you look at the cross and the terrible suffering His body endured there and fail to discern what it was for... then you will be sick, weakly, and even die young. Not because you are a sinner or "enduring till the end"... but just out of ignorance. In some cases it is beyond ignorance.... it is out and out stubborn, religious, hard heartedness against the gospel and the Word of God.

Repent! Believe!

I agree. No glory in sickness, poverty, depression, and all the rest. Christ took these for me, I have no need or want for them. God the Father did not send his Son to take all of these so years later I could say I'm being stricken for these things for the glory of God! That would make God double minded! Men are double minded and try to make God just that!

 

[RubyRose]

Your spirit could rejoice in salvation without your body being sick. Your temple is sick, and you think this is a good thing? Why are you fighting this with your flesh?


Today, because of a hardened heart of unbelief, you are falling short of the rest of God. You are following the example of those who fell in the wilderness who stubbornly refused to believe the promises.

Amen!

 

[flyfishing]

This is a difficult question to answer for a number of reasons. Are you asking about a particular teaching or emphasis? The Word of Faith movement has a number of distinctives.

In my opinion, (for what it's worth), there is usually some basic truth in most of the Word of Faith doctrines. Where there is a problem, it is usually to do with 1) how that truth has been emphasised and 2) mistaken ideas that have clustered around it.

A couple of examples:

1) I believe, as WoF teaches, that healing is actually available for us today, not just at the resurrection. However, I would argue that Word of faith theology suffers from 'over-realised eschatology' on this point. It exaggerates how much healing the body of Christ as a whole can expect to experience through their faith.

2) I believe, as WoF teaches, that God blesses His people with material as well as spiritual blessings. God does make people rich. However, I also believe that hardship may also be part of God's discipline. Prosperity is not constantly available to be 'claimed'.

I'm out of time. All for now.

Amen!!!


WHAT BOTHERS ME ESPECIALLY IS 'THE DOCTRINES" EMPHASIS ON CONDENMNATION..

Btw i am feeling much better.. No need to repent though..

I made a goal of mine never to condemn a person because of thier lack of faith when they dont recieve healing.. It is my lack of faith because if i believed he would answer my prayer... But preachers of this doctrine set themselves as "little gods" and those who are not healed as inferior and immature,lack of faith etc..

Wof faith preachers have so much faith.. Yet how many are healed???? Show me thy faith by thy works.. Some even dare to name themselves apostles, i read the book of acts and the gospels 'everyone that touched was healed",the shadow of peter was healing whoever touched ...

 

[RubyRose]

Amen!!!


WHAT BOTHERS ME ESPECIALLY IS 'THE DOCTRINES" EMPHASIS ON CONDENMNATION..

I made a goal of mine never to condemn a person because of thier lack of faith when they dont recieve healing..

It is not condemnation to agree with the Word that says: "My people perish for lack of knowledge." If it is pointed out to people that sickness is under the curse, and Jesus hung on a cross to redeem us from the curse, it is not condemnation. It is to increase their knowledge so the don't perish unnecessarily.

 

[RubyRose]

Wof faith preachers have so much faith.. Yet how many are healed???? Show me thy faith by thy works.. Some even dare to name themselves apostles, i read the book of acts and the gospels 'everyone that touched was healed", the shadow of peter was healing whoever touched ...

At least they are trying!! I would rather go out and lay hands on sick and expect them to recover, because the Word says so, than to criticize when it doesn't happen 100% of the time! Why some receive healing and some don't is not up to me.....it is between God and that person. But, I will continue to believe the Word that says sickness is under the curse....and we are redeemed from the curse!

 

[TheScottsMen]

Lets see..

"And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, if ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place, and it shall remove, and nothing shall be impossible unto you" Matt 17:20

"And Jesus answering saith unto them, have faith in God. For verily I say unto you, that whosever shall say unto this mountain, be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and SHALL NOT DOUBT IN HIS HEART, BUT SHALL BELIEVE THAT THSOE THINGS WHICH HE SAITH SHALL COME TO PASS, HE SHALL HAVE WHATSOEVER HE SAITH." Mark 11:22

"And, behold, a woman, whcih was diseased with an issue of blood twelve years, came behind him (Jesus), and touched the hem of his garment: For she said within herself, if I may but touch his garment, I shall be whole. But Jesus turned him about, and when he say her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; THY FAITH HATH MADE THEE WHOLE"

Show me anywhere in the NT where people had enough faith and were not healed. I will show you where they lacked faith and were not healed.

 

[TheScottsMen]

At least they are trying!! I would rather go out and lay hands on sick and expect them to recover, because the Word says so, than to criticize when it doesn't happen 100% of the time! Why some receive healing and some don't is not up to me.....it is between God and that person. But, I will continue to believe the Word that says sickness is under the curse....and we are redeemed from the curse!

Amen!

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Wof faith preachers have so much faith.. Yet how many are healed???? Show me thy faith by thy works.. Some even dare to name themselves apostles, i read the book of acts and the gospels 'everyone that touched was healed",the shadow of peter was healing whoever touched ...

It never ceases to amaze me. You really have no idea what we teach. This is all a lie of the devil designed to play upon your fears, religious indignation, and religious pride. Before you launch into these rediculous tirades, you should at least take the time to find out what it is that you are ranting about. It would be funny if not so tragic. So many people are suffering and need the healing that God has provided in the gospel.... and all you can do is go on and on about "wof preachers".
I do fail at times. But I strive with every breath and thought to never never deny Him, His sacrifice, and His word. Something that you seem to do as a doctrinal position!

 

[enoch son]

I believer there is a higher state of faith then WOF. That is the FAITH OF CHRIST, WHICH WE HAVE AND IS PERFECT! How can I make something that is perfect more perfect? I think wof should be, teach us how to listern my Lord, so that I will move in your perfect WILL. And I go to a wof chruch.

 

[Ecclesiastes]

Yes, It is 100% True.

Wof faith preachers have so much faith.. Yet how many are healed???? Show me thy faith by thy works.. Some even dare to name themselves apostles, i read the book of acts and the gospels 'everyone that touched was healed",the shadow of peter was healing whoever touched ...

A Whole Lot are Healed. There are millions of testimonies to this. But you are accussing the WOF teachers, who call themselves Apostles (And they do fit this category of ministry). At least they are pursuing God to get to the point where the first 12 Apostles were. And I have heard stories that are almost identitical to Biblical circumstances of healing. The WOF teachers are continually increasing in the anointing and power of God and there will be even more healed. At elast they are willing to obey the full Word of God and not afraid to step out in faith. It is the anointing that removes burdens and destroys yokes. And they are increasing in that anointing, and gues what....

THE BEST IS YET TO COME!