Is This True?

[Kyran]

"there is another universal and truly catholic organization, the Seventh-day Adventist Church." (Neal C. Wilson, General Conference President of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, in Adventist Review, March 5, 1981, p 3).

cath·o·lic
adj.

1. Of broad or liberal scope; comprehensive: “The 100-odd pages of formulas and constants are surely the most catholic to be found” (Scientific American).
2. Including or concerning all humankind; universal: “what was of catholic rather than national interest” (J.A. Froude).

Alas there are no electronic editions of the Adventist Review from that far back so unless you can find a paper copy we can see the context.

"Although it is true that there was a period in the life of the Seventh-day Adventist Church when the denomination took a distinctly anti-Roman Catholic viewpoint...that attitude on the church's part was nothing more than a manifestation of widespread anti-popery among conservative Protestant denominations in the early part of this century and the latter part of the last, and which has now been consigned to the historical trash heap so far as the Seventh-day Adventist Church is concerned." (Neal C. Wilson, past president of the Seventh-day Adventist General Conference, Court Transcript of United States vs the Seventh-day Adventist Church, Equal Employment Opportunity Commission vs the Pacific Press Publishing Association and the General Conference, Reply Brief for Defendants, p 4, Civil Case #74-2025 CBR, presided over by Judge Charles B. Renfrew, U.S. District Court, San Francisco, California, 1974-1975.)

I'm more worried about the second quote, which once again might not be in the context.

However, if they are in context that must mean Neal was a .

 

[visionary]

Neal Wilson was very positive about the Seventh-day Adventist General Conference and its organization. " there is another universal and truly catholic organization, the Seventh-day Adventist church." Adventist Review, MArch 5th 1981, p 3.9

I drew a line when Neal Wilson stated in court that "Those who work for the Seventh-day Adventist Chuurch respond to a religious vocation in exactly the same sense as does a cloistered nun." EEOC vs PPPA CIv. #74-2025 p 90.1

and "The General Conference Committee is the highest authority in the Seventh-day Adventist Church. All other organizations and instituations that carry the name Seventh-day Adventist have a subsidiary role to the General Conference..." "The primary reason for the conflict is that these workers in the church have been unwilling to recognise and accept the authority of the church...' It is also necessary for the church to establish its authority in the community of believers." EEOC vs PPPA civ #74-2025 CBR

Excuse me, did some man try to lord over the believers? "... the General Conference is the highest authority among us under God..." Adventist Review, April 27, 1980 p 19

EGW was not impressed with this attitude when it showed its ugly head back in her day.... "The voice from Battle Creek (GC headquarters) which has been regarded as authority... is no longer the voice of God." Letter 4, 1896

So what is wrong with the GC headquarters? Try attitude and deeds.

"In the restructuring plan, the delegates also handed over their power to the conference executive committee to elect the leaders of the various areas of church ministries and directors of other departments." Recorder June 15, 1986 p 5.5

So the leaders dictate who gets to be leaders of the people, is that bad? "Delegates... handed over to the conference executive committee sweeping powers..." Recorder May 5, 1986 p 4.1...

So how bad can that be? "... the General Conference of the Church, the only body having authority to alter the structure of the church either in doctrine or organization" EEOC vs PPPA Civ #74-2025 CBR p 17 Did Neal Wilson just testify in court that they can change the doctrines? Yes he did, so how does that affect the believers?

"Only a committee appointed by the General COnference can interpret prophecy" Adventist Review June 5, 1986 p 2.8

Are they serious about this? "No doctrinal truth or prophectic interpretation ever came to this people initially through the Spirit of Prophecy... not in a single case" Ministry Magazine Feb 1957 p 11.

So does that mean this is taught in sabbath school? " It is the responsibility to study the scriptures for ourselves, to ask for the guidance of the Holy Spirit, to submit our understanding to those in the church who are able to judge our findings, and then to abide by the decisions of the church.." Adult Sabbath School Quarterly for 1987 Lesson 13, March 28 p 92.5 and in the teachers edition on p 153.3

These are but examples of documents coming from headquaters that went against what the Word of God and the Holy Spirit was speaking to my heart, and I could no longer abide with such nonsense coming from those so called in authority, it is papacy retoric all over again.

The ministers of the church are taught that they are to act as the mediators between God and man. " what a tremendous responsisbility to act as mediators between GOd and man!" Ministry Magazine Dec 1961

" That these men should stand in a sacred place to be as the coice of God to the people, as we once believed the General Conference to be, that is past." General Conference Bulletin of 1901 p 25.4 EGW

"The General Conference, then, is the Seventh-day Adventist Church... The embodiment of the Remnant Church as a Christian Denomination, in a unified worldwide organization to which all baptised Seventh-day Adventists owe spiritual allegiance..." EEOC vs PPPA CIv #74-2025 CBR p 17.5 Excuse me, but I owe my spiritual allegiance to God only..

"Church standards will be emphasized in the next few years, because 'we are at the crossroads in this church'... whether we will uphold the standards of Scripture and Spirit of Prophecy. We in the Northwest are going to hold to the standards of the church." Adventist Review, Aug 1, 1985 p 14.8

It was at that point that I left the Seventh-day Adventist church, left the northwest division. They (GC Conference) had sold the soul of faith, turned out the lights, and walked after the world for acceptance and Celebration.

 

[Sophia7]

Neal Wilson was very positive about the Seventh-day Adventist General Conference and its organization. " there is another universal and truly catholic organization, the Seventh-day Adventist church." Adventist Review, MArch 5th 1981, p 3.9

I drew a line when Neal Wilson stated in court that "Those who work for the Seventh-day Adventist Chuurch respond to a religious vocation in exactly the same sense as does a cloistered nun." EEOC vs PPPA CIv. #74-2025 p 90.1

and "The General Conference Committee is the highest authority in the Seventh-day Adventist Church. All other organizations and instituations that carry the name Seventh-day Adventist have a subsidiary role to the General Conference..." "The primary reason for the conflict is that these workers in the church have been unwilling to recognise and accept the authority of the church...' It is also necessary for the church to establish its authority in the community of believers." EEOC vs PPPA civ #74-2025 CBR

Excuse me, did some man try to lord over the believers? "... the General Conference is the highest authority among us under God..." Adventist Review, April 27, 1980 p 19

EGW was not impressed with this attitude when it showed its ugly head back in her day.... "The voice from Battle Creek (GC headquarters) which has been regarded as authority... is no longer the voice of God." Letter 4, 1896

So what is wrong with the GC headquarters? Try attitude and deeds.

"In the restructuring plan, the delegates also handed over their power to the conference executive committee to elect the leaders of the various areas of church ministries and directors of other departments." Recorder June 15, 1986 p 5.5

So the leaders dictate who gets to be leaders of the people, is that bad? "Delegates... handed over to the conference executive committee sweeping powers..." Recorder May 5, 1986 p 4.1...

So how bad can that be? "... the General Conference of the Church, the only body having authority to alter the structure of the church either in doctrine or organization" EEOC vs PPPA Civ #74-2025 CBR p 17 Did Neal Wilson just testify in court that they can change the doctrines? Yes he did, so how does that affect the believers?

"Only a committee appointed by the General COnference can interpret prophecy" Adventist Review June 5, 1986 p 2.8

Are they serious about this? "No doctrinal truth or prophectic interpretation ever came to this people initially through the Spirit of Prophecy... not in a single case" Ministry Magazine Feb 1957 p 11.

So does that mean this is taught in sabbath school? " It is the responsibility to study the scriptures for ourselves, to ask for the guidance of the Holy Spirit, to submit our understanding to those in the church who are able to judge our findings, and then to abide by the decisions of the church.." Adult Sabbath School Quarterly for 1987 Lesson 13, March 28 p 92.5 and in the teachers edition on p 153.3

These are but examples of documents coming from headquaters that went against what the Word of God and the Holy Spirit was speaking to my heart, and I could no longer abide with such nonsense coming from those so called in authority, it is papacy retoric all over again.

The ministers of the church are taught that they are to act as the mediators between God and man. " what a tremendous responsisbility to act as mediators between GOd and man!" Ministry Magazine Dec 1961

" That these men should stand in a sacred place to be as the coice of God to the people, as we once believed the General Conference to be, that is past." General Conference Bulletin of 1901 p 25.4 EGW

"The General Conference, then, is the Seventh-day Adventist Church... The embodiment of the Remnant Church as a Christian Denomination, in a unified worldwide organization to which all baptised Seventh-day Adventists owe spiritual allegiance..." EEOC vs PPPA CIv #74-2025 CBR p 17.5 Excuse me, but I owe my spiritual allegiance to God only..

"Church standards will be emphasized in the next few years, because 'we are at the crossroads in this church'... whether we will uphold the standards of Scripture and Spirit of Prophecy. We in the Northwest are going to hold to the standards of the church." Adventist Review, Aug 1, 1985 p 14.8

It was at that point that I left the Seventh-day Adventist church, left the northwest division. They (GC Conference) had sold the soul of faith, turned out the lights, and walked after the world for acceptance and Celebration.

Adventist pastors are not taught that they are the mediators between God and men. They are not taught that they are like cloistered nuns. They are not taught to lord their authority over people like priests. They are not taught that they have to subject themselves to the authority of the church rather than to the authority of God. Those words were spoken or written by misguided individuals, and why the church printed them I have no idea. Just because these statements came from people in high positions of leadership doesn't make them true or worthy of repeating in our official publications. To be honest, I disagree with a lot of what I read in the Adventist Review, and I think that a lot of the stuff they print is just fluff.

In any case, people who have spiritual discernment and are following God's leading will see through these false views of authority. If that has led you to leave the Adventist Church because you believe that God is guiding you in another direction, fine. Personally, I believe that God is leading me to stay in the church and work for Him to improve it. Some of the church leadership in Ellen White's day had false views of authority as well, and she reprimanded them for it. However, she did not tell them to scrap the whole church because of the erroneous beliefs of a few men.

 

[visionary]

Personally, I believe that God is leading me to stay in the church and work for Him to improve it.

I think you should do as the Lord leads until guided to do otherwise. May the Lord continue to bless you in your ministry. Conintue to follow the Lord. I just don't want anyone here blindly following leadership that is believes that the statements coming out of general conference is gospel.

 

[smooze]

Our Bodies Our The Temple Of The Lord,but, alas we fall short of absolute perfection . A building is just man cashing in on the franchise that is christianity. GOD bless you all. I don't think the alternative is very friendly.

 

[OntheDL]

....

I think this ex-Jesuit you talk about is Alberto Rivera. I first read about him in Chick Publications. It's in tracts, some may not take it seriously. But for myself, much of what he said had been comfirmed by other sources.

Anyways, if I may give you a word of advice...Ellen White predicted the latter falling away from truth and all the apostasy. She also said there will be a great division among the church at the end. However she cautioned against reforming outside the church. That's leaving the church and forming your own group. There are many inherent danger in doing so. I see you use the SOP, so research more on this topic on your own.

 

[Cliff2]

I think this ex-Jesuit you talk about is Alberto Rivera. I first read about him in Chick Publications. It's in tracts, some may not take it seriously. But for myself, much of what he said had been comfirmed by other sources.

Anyways, if I may give you a word of advice...Ellen White predicted the latter falling away from truth and all the apostasy. She also said there will be a great division among the church at the end. However she cautioned against reforming outside the church. That's leaving the church and forming your own group. There are many inherent danger in doing so. I see you use the SOP, so research more on this topic on your own.

No where does EGW suggest that another group/organization should be started up even though she cautions about the lack of spirituality in the Church.

In fact she says it should not happen.

 

[OntheDL]

No where does EGW suggest that another group/organization should be started up even though she cautions about the lack of spirituality in the Church.

In fact she says it should not happen.

That's exactly what I said, no?

 

[visionary]

Awww.... back to caught with no further advice from EGW on what to do with the downard spiral in the leadership while singing the song, "stay in the boat, it will make to shore." I personally believe that the Lord will guide you and if it takes walking on water to be where He is then so be it.