• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
  • We hope the site problems here are now solved, however, if you still have any issues, please start a ticket in Contact Us

  • The rule regarding AI content has been updated. The rule now rules as follows:

    Be sure to credit AI when copying and pasting AI sources. Link to the site of the AI search, just like linking to an article.

Is this a silly question?

Status
Not open for further replies.

DaveKerwin

Represent the Most High
May 31, 2002
4,633
132
44
Detroit, MI
Visit site
✟28,531.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
How about this, someone support FeelGood's accusation about me being a legalist. If I am a legalist, then I promise never to post again on this website and submit you all to my legalistic views. Ok, let's hear it.

FeelGood, you are true to your name, you do what makes you feel good. You are so well educated in feel good theology that you are now Doctor Feel Good.

Am I the only one who has the guts to stand up against false teaching!!!!??? Cmon all you lurkers, have a voice! No one has the guts to be real here. I am not going to be party to pattingy people on the back just because they have an opinion. God is clear on the issue in his word, yoking with unbelivers is wrong. We cannot spin around that. Feelgood, you are wrong. And for the record, I was not raised in the church, I was saved later in life. What I believe is a result of reading God's word.

So let's hear it, someone confirm that I am a legalist. I'm waiting.
 
Upvote 0

SirKenin

Contributor
Jun 26, 2003
6,518
526
from the deepest inner mind to the outer limits
✟9,370.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Dave, no offense, but I think you're taking this the wrong way. Don't try to draw on public support to prove me wrong. That approach won't work. You have to realize that I don't care what others think. That's just the way I am, I'm afraid. I care about the facts. I'm trying to encourage you (and any other interested parties) to look at the facts as well. Think outside the bun. That's what this is about. Not rallying around the DaveKerwin flag.

It really is a breath of fresh air when you can free yourself of right-wing fundamentalist dogma and live life the way God intended you to live it. The Word of God was not meant to be a burden, it was meant to set you free. Trust me. I've walked that path (and quite a path it's been so far). I've got a long way to go, but I've never been more content and at peace in any other time of my life. I feel confident that I am headed in the right direction. It's up to you whether or not you want to follow. It won't hurt my feelings one way or the other.
 
Upvote 0

SirKenin

Contributor
Jun 26, 2003
6,518
526
from the deepest inner mind to the outer limits
✟9,370.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Ok, I lied. I will post one more.. lol. This one states it in a more interesting manner, so I thought it was worth including.

http://newsletters.cephasministry.com/catholic_unequally_yoked.html

[size=+2]UNEQUALLY YOKED[/size]




Scripture states very clearly how God ordained the foundation and structure of his church according to his will and purpose. For three hundred years from its birth in Jerusalem, the church remained in its original state, continuing as God had commanded, as follows.


Acts Chapter 4.v.32-35. And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul; neither said any of them that aught of those things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things in common.V.33. And with great power gave the Apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.V.34-35 Neither was there any among them that lacked: for as many as were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the prices of the things that were sold, and laid them down at the Apostles feet: and distribution was made unto every man according as he had need.

First. They were of one heart, and one soul. They walked in obedience to the word of God, which says. "Be ye of one mind." Second. They had all things in common, and because of this. Neither was there any among them that lacked. They shared all things with one another. Rich or poor all were equal. Paul himself emphasised this important part of the churches structure many years later in the following scripture.

2: Cor.8.13-15. For I mean not that other men be eased, and ye burdened, But by an equality, that now at this time your abundance may be a supply for their want, that their abundance also may be a supply for your want, that there may be equality. As it is written, He that had gathered much had nothing over, and he that gathered little had no lack.

There can be absolutely no doubt that this was Gods will and command for his true Church, with both the scriptures, and history bearing it out.

Note in verse 33 of Acts, that there was an anointing of great power among them. And because of the powerful presence of God in their midst their faith was strong. Why? Because they were following God in Spirit and in truth, as the surrounding scriptures state. This was the Church triumphant and although they suffered persecution, the brethren daily experienced the working of the gifts of the spirit, and great power was given them by God to overcome the adversary. These were not people built in some special mould. They were ordinary and often ignorant people full of the knowledge and love of God. I ask, where is the Church that measures up to this today? What happened to change it all?

After three hundred years of a Church walking in the way described in Acts something occurred that was to change it completely. Suddenly, instead of being rejected by the pagan world, it was accepted. This occurred a little under seventeen hundred years ago, in the year 312AD, when the Emperor Constantine decided to make Christianity the state religion, for which he was lauded as a champion of the faith.

Contrary to the opinions of many. I believe that his motives were suspect for a number of reasons. Firstly. He was not a Christian; therefore he would only seek the things of the flesh, and not the spirit. Secondly. He never discontinued the practice of following the Roman gods, remaining superstitious; he created Sunday as a public holiday in reverence to the sun god. Thirdly and most importantly, being in the flesh a great statesman. He saw this move as being beneficial to the Roman Empire, which was his larger interest, having fought to obtain it. He knew at this point that Rome was disintegrating, and under threat of complete collapse. This then for Emperor Constantine was a strategy to save Rome, and it did indeed extend the life of the Empire.

This marriage of the Church and the state appeared to have benefits to the Church. Financially it gained greatly when it was bought in line with the pagan priests of Rome, and exempted from payment of Tax. In the main Persecution for the Church ceased, and it's power and wealth increased with its acceptance by the pagan society. Sunday was declared a public holiday, reserved as a day of worship. What a turnabout this was for the humble persecuted Church that was, but there was a price to pay for all these benefits.

The Church on accepting this elevation gradually became spiritually barren. Why did this happen? The Church had broken the command of God and become unequally yoked together with unbelievers, which thing God forbids, and so the scriptures state.

"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers, for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? And what communion hath light with darkness? And what concord hath Christ with Belial? Or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? For ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, and will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty."2.Cor:6.14-18.

This blending together of the Church and paganism, which have no part with one another, corrupted the truth that was from the beginning concerning the foundation and building of it. No longer would it be separated from the world, but would move from its heavenly course to an earthly one. In the process it gained worldly wealth, power and acclaim, but at what cost. The Church, taken over by Rome from this point of time became completely out of joint from its original state. It was no longer a free agent in fact it was bought into bondage, its leaders doing the bidding of the Emperor Constantine, who demanded obedience from them even if it interfered with church affairs, they would have to compromise.

Because the Church was now unequally yoked, instead of a body of committed believers it had those who were not even religious in its midst, but being half pagan were self-centered rather than giving, and so in the centuries that followed the true paths to dwell in were obliterated by the continual corruption of the truth. And consequently the foundational directives such as described in Acts. 2 and 4, and 2 Corinthians, are no longer adhered to. The Church lost its spiritual power and witness in exchange for temporal power and privilege.

It started as we have seen on being taken over by the temporal power of Rome, and although many sects have since that time splintered away from it, none left it completely. Why? When it came to relinquishing any temporal power and advantage, such as tax exemption, and going back to the basics of the original Church where the money was distributed to all in the Body who had need, so that there was equality, and not wealth to the organisation, without exception all have held back from performing these things, and for that the Church has and still is paying the price.

That the Church is unequally yoked it is obvious. It needs to get back the spiritual power and faith that it had, and stand once more as a witness to the world. The road to this is to cast off the temporal powers bestowed on it, and give back to Caesar that which is Caesars. To come out of this world, and stop running the Church like a corporate body, and in the process making merchandise of Gods people, just as Jesus prophesied. The true Church has need of none of these things. Just as it spread through the world, and gained strength without all of these props in the beginning, and will do so again, because God is greater than man and never did need any favours from him, and will owe no man anything." Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit saith the Lord of hosts." Zechariah.4: 7.

The Lord is returning for his Church without spot or blemish. It is time to awaken from our slumber, and to get out of the world and back to the word, commencing by building the old waste places, raising up the foundations of many generations. Repairing the breach, and restoring the paths to dwell in. (Source: http://www.big.net.au./~leon)


 
Upvote 0

katelyn

Senior Veteran
Oct 6, 2003
2,309
105
44
✟32,945.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I agree with what has been said in this thread about God leading us and opening and shutting doors. The problem is when you are mainly relying on that to decide what decisions you make. Thanks to our free will, we can open and close doors, too. How are we supposed to tell the difference between a door we opened and a door God opened? It's not going to be our feelings - we're almost certainly going to feel good about a door we personally opened, or we wouldn't have opened it in the first place. No, the way to discern is by reading the Bible. And I'm sorry, but I don't see how taking the chapters surrounding the "unequally yoked" verses changes the meaning there.
 
Upvote 0

SirKenin

Contributor
Jun 26, 2003
6,518
526
from the deepest inner mind to the outer limits
✟9,370.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
katelyn said:
I agree with what has been said in this thread about God leading us and opening and shutting doors. The problem is when you are mainly relying on that to decide what decisions you make. Thanks to our free will, we can open and close doors, too. How are we supposed to tell the difference between a door we opened and a door God opened? It's not going to be our feelings - we're almost certainly going to feel good about a door we personally opened, or we wouldn't have opened it in the first place. No, the way to discern is by reading the Bible.
We are told in the Bible to trust our heads, not our hearts. And yes, the Bible will tell us if we are headed in the right direction IF we interpret it correctly.

And I'm sorry, but I don't see how taking the chapters surrounding the "unequally yoked" verses changes the meaning there.
Did you read the articles I reprinted? It explains it all in elaborate detail. There are two key things to know about that passage.

1) If Paul was talking about marriage, he would have specified marriage, using the same language he did in 1 Cor 7. Both these passages were letters to the Corinthians, both written in Greek. The context and the translation of the original Greek tells us that he was talking about the church not joining forces with pagans. Idolaters.

2) If marriage to an unbeliever was a sin and in fact what he was talking about in 2 Corinthians, he would have demanded the dissolution of the marriage, but he instead said that you are not to divorce the unbeliever. Otherwise he would have been contradicting himself.
 
Upvote 0

katelyn

Senior Veteran
Oct 6, 2003
2,309
105
44
✟32,945.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
drfeelgood said:
Did you read the articles I reprinted? It explains it all in elaborate detail. There are two key things to know about that passage.

1) If Paul was talking about marriage, he would have specified marriage, using the same language he did in 1 Cor 7. Both these passages were letters to the Corinthians, both written in Greek. The context and the translation of the original Greek tells us that he was talking about the church not joining forces with pagans. Idolaters.

2) If marriage to an unbeliever was a sin and in fact what he was talking about in 2 Corinthians, he would have demanded the dissolution of the marriage, but he instead said that you are not to divorce the unbeliever. Otherwise he would have been contradicting himself.
1. Just because he wasn't just referring to marriage doesn't mean that it doesn't apply. Marriage is the most intimate yoking you can possibly have and I do think it applies.

2. Those verses were to people who were already married to unbelievers. Those verses don't imply that a believer should knowingly marry an unbeliever.
 
Upvote 0

SirKenin

Contributor
Jun 26, 2003
6,518
526
from the deepest inner mind to the outer limits
✟9,370.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
katelyn said:
1. Just because he wasn't just referring to marriage doesn't mean that it doesn't apply. Marriage is the most intimate yoking you can possibly have and I do think it applies.
You and several other fundies. It's not that he wasn't just referring to marriage. He wasn't referring to marriage at all. The facts don't support that conclusion. The Greek words for marriage (gameo) and unequally yoked (heterozugeo) are two completely different words, not even close in meaning.

2. Those verses were to people who were already married to unbelievers. Those verses don't imply that a believer should knowingly marry an unbeliever.
No, I did not say they said anything about giving the go ahead to marry an unbeliever. I'm saying that we can draw the conclusion from the passage that being married to an unbeliever is not a sin. Paul would not have commanded the Corinthians to live in sin. Rather, he said they must not divorce. There is no law that you must not marry an unbeliever.
 
Upvote 0

DaveKerwin

Represent the Most High
May 31, 2002
4,633
132
44
Detroit, MI
Visit site
✟28,531.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
drfeelgood said:
Dave, no offense, but I think you're taking this the wrong way. Don't try to draw on public support to prove me wrong. That approach won't work. You have to realize that I don't care what others think. That's just the way I am, I'm afraid. I care about the facts. I'm trying to encourage you (and any other interested parties) to look at the facts as well. Think outside the bun. That's what this is about. Not rallying around the DaveKerwin flag.

It really is a breath of fresh air when you can free yourself of right-wing fundamentalist dogma and live life the way God intended you to live it. The Word of God was not meant to be a burden, it was meant to set you free. Trust me. I've walked that path (and quite a path it's been so far). I've got a long way to go, but I've never been more content and at peace in any other time of my life. I feel confident that I am headed in the right direction. It's up to you whether or not you want to follow. It won't hurt my feelings one way or the other.
I want someone to confirm your accusation of my apparent "fundamentalist dogma." If someone wants to agree with you, then I will save you all from my dogma from now on. So let's hear it, someone chime in if you agree with DrFG.

Seriously, if I am just some pharisee, then I don't need to be here. I am dead serious, I will save you all from the fundamentalism, if that is indeed what I am about. So let's hear it.
 
Upvote 0

DaveKerwin

Represent the Most High
May 31, 2002
4,633
132
44
Detroit, MI
Visit site
✟28,531.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I think I am gonna start a new church called "Your Way Community Church." We will pick and choose what we want to believe based upon intellectual justifications of the scripture. If one guy wants to yoke himself with an unbeliever, then he simply makes it work in his head, with some random commentary writeen by infallable man, then he is all set. Then another person will want to justify being homosexual, and they will say how their verses don't apply to them. Then I will have a couple different wives. All I have to do is say how Solomon had so many, and I will be fine. Your Way Community Church will be so awesome. We will have the perks of being a Christian, but also the perks of following our own self interests. Perfect bedmates if you ask me! This is gonna be so awesome, I can't wait! I don't care what God thinks, its all about me in this life!
 
Upvote 0

SirKenin

Contributor
Jun 26, 2003
6,518
526
from the deepest inner mind to the outer limits
✟9,370.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
DaveKerwin said:
If one guy wants to yoke himself with an unbeliever, then he simply makes it work in his head, with some random commentary writeen by infallable man, then he is all set.
How are you any better or any less fallible than the numerous resources I have provided? What makes your interpretation, with absolutely no facts, schooling or life experience to back you up, any more correct? Consistently you have insisted that you are correct, with absolutely nothing to back you. You have belittled every resource, almost as though your knowledge is superior. You have waved them off as being fallible and knowing nothing. You get irate when someone questions your bold statements.

We should be challenging each other, but rather than coming back with facts, you reiterate the same verse and insist that your out-of-context Bible Bullets are the definitive answer. Whether someone happens to agree with your opinion is immaterial, really (it just means they were trained in the same school of thought as you). Come to think of it, whether someone states they agree with mine or not is also immaterial. lol.

Besides, these two posts are a little immature, don't you think? Chasing me around the forums doesn't help either. You don't suppose we can get this back on track, do you?
 
Upvote 0

katelyn

Senior Veteran
Oct 6, 2003
2,309
105
44
✟32,945.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
drfeelgood said:
You and several other fundies. It's not that he wasn't just referring to marriage. He wasn't referring to marriage at all. The facts don't support that conclusion. The Greek words for marriage (gameo) and unequally yoked (heterozugeo) are two completely different words, not even close in meaning.
Okay, so he was referring to a generic yoking to unbelievers. Doesn't marriage still fall under that? What makes marriage the exception that it is an okay form of unequal yoking?

No, I did not say they said anything about giving the go ahead to marry an unbeliever. I'm saying that we can draw the conclusion from the passage that being married to an unbeliever is not a sin. Paul would not have commanded the Corinthians to live in sin. Rather, he said they must not divorce. There is no law that you must not marry an unbeliever.
I didn't say being married to an unbeliever is a sin. But, if you know the Bible advises against being unequally yoked and you do it anyway, might that be a sin?
 
Upvote 0

katelyn

Senior Veteran
Oct 6, 2003
2,309
105
44
✟32,945.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Warrior Poet said:
Yes or no looking for an answer from Dave and one from The Doc.

Warrior Poet
Okay, thanks for answering my question, not to mention being considerate of the OP'ers feelings. :rolleyes: If you guys want to fight over who is the best, why not take it elsewhere, so at least this thread won't get shut down?
 
Upvote 0

Warrior Poet

A Legendary Outlaw
Jun 25, 2003
2,052
116
44
Sunny SoCal, In a city named after a fruit. Cake.
✟32,965.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Others
Anyway.....
waiting on daves response...

Thanks Doc and this holds plenty of relevancy to a question asked earlier thank you very much.

Like it shouldnt have been shut down already for being off topic :rolleyes:

Warrio Poet
 
Upvote 0

SirKenin

Contributor
Jun 26, 2003
6,518
526
from the deepest inner mind to the outer limits
✟9,370.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
katelyn said:
Okay, so he was referring to a generic yoking to unbelievers. Doesn't marriage still fall under that? What makes marriage the exception that it is an okay form of unequal yoking?
No, it wasn't a generic yoking of unbelievers, either, according to the facts that I have ascertained. :) It was the joining forces of the church in Corinth with the pagans. The last paper that I reprinted in this thread explains it in great detail.

http://www.christianforums.com/showthread.php?p=1729723&postcount=43

I didn't say being married to an unbeliever is a sin. But, if you know the Bible advises against being unequally yoked and you do it anyway, might that be a sin?
This point would be moot, as long as my first point holds true.
 
Upvote 0

katelyn

Senior Veteran
Oct 6, 2003
2,309
105
44
✟32,945.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Warrior Poet said:
Like it shouldnt have been shut down already for being off topic :rolleyes:
I agree that it was already getting way off track. I'm not blaming you for that, and I know I get sidetracked too, but I feel bad about it and was hoping for it to not get any worse!
 
Upvote 0

DaveKerwin

Represent the Most High
May 31, 2002
4,633
132
44
Detroit, MI
Visit site
✟28,531.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
drfeelgood said:
How are you any better or any less fallible than the numerous resources I have provided? What makes your interpretation, with absolutely no facts, schooling or life experience to back you up, any more correct? Consistently you have insisted that you are correct, with absolutely nothing to back you. You have belittled every resource, almost as though your knowledge is superior. You have waved them off as being fallible and knowing nothing. You get irate when someone questions your bold statements. You don't suppose we can get this back on track, do you?
That is exactly my point. You read a commentary and take it an the infallable word of God. If I am more correct than what you have quoted, it is only because I do not water down scripture. God tells us as it is, and I believe what God says. Now, in terms of not responding, I have a life outside of the internet and I can't spend an hour reading a long article, if you care to sum it up in a few sentences, I am glad to read and respond. When I glanced them over, I saw nothing worth responding to. I have read one of your long posts before, and I complimented you on at least making an argument that follows, but I did not agree with your premises.

Warrior Poet, absolutely, a real seven days. The is the same God who first created the world out of nothing. The same God who does everything supernatural, made the world in a literal seven days. I believe what the Bible says. And if that makes me guilty, then so be it. For a guy who does not like lables, you easily place them on me. Call me the literalist, the pharisee, the legalist, whatever you want. I am willing to be called names in order to stand against false teachings. God made the world in seven days. Jesus really did raise from the dead, etc. Based on your question, I take it you do not believe in the supernatural?

To get back on track, the bible says not to be yoked with unbelievers, we cannot dismiss this simply because we wanna hook up with hell-bound hotties.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.