Is there really a deep state?

[Broken Fence]

The Hebrew people had no one to represent them until Moses came along. Oppressed people are not represented. In this new world we the newly oppressed of this recently changed world will have no representation until Jesus comes along to set His people free. Face it, the ways of the last century or more are gone.


The problem is that your elected superiors work beneath those of the global deep state.

I had not thought of that.

 

[Tom 1]

I'm close friends with some of President Trump's former business partners. Without getting too specific, they worked with him on a handful of deals back in his Apprentice days. Relatively small deals to start with then bigger ones as time went by.

Independently of each other, they've all said variations of the same thing: honest, above-board, very lucrative deals, would do it again tomorrow if they could, etc.

Others of my friends were involved in Trump deals as contractors rather than direct partners. Same thing although they have more experience with him overall. Same thing. Good deals, never missed a chance to work with him when they could, honest, so on and so forth.

None of these people are what you used to be called Tea Party Patriots. They're all broadly East Coast liberals who had no reason to love or to hate Trump. If my friends would've had a negative experience with him, there wouldn't have been a reason to lie about how wonderful he is. Because I've heard them trash talk plenty of other prominent East Coast businessmen. But they all mostly enjoyed their dealings with Trump.

Honestly, their experiences with Trump count far more to me than some overpaid shill journalist on CNN or wherever repeating the words his paymasters have given him.

Fair enough, sounds like those went well. Multiple divorces, multiple defaulted loans, multiple infidelities, actual fraudulent institutions, a never-ending litany of lies about pretty much anything and everything (this is the guy who used to call up news agencies pretending to be someone else to bad mouth his wife at the time), close working ties with the mafia during the 80s - none of this is the invention of the press, it’s pure Donald. He does have smarts - he only stiffs the vulnerable and the weak, he has a good nose for when something might come back on him and then he plays it nice.

 

[timothyu]

The reason that no-one has ever beaten the Afghans on their own territory is that war is a way fo life for them

The invaders were too technologically superior to know how to fight against ancient tribal ways. Kind of like how the Swamp Fox and gang who went rogue and undercover, easily defeated the British who were used to marching in rows.

 

[Tom 1]

some overpaid shill journalist on CNN or wherever repeating the words his paymasters have given him.

Do you have any actual evidence for these accusations, I mean beyond just general impressions? The various actual behaviours, words actions etc that support suspicion of Trump are actual, concrete, real things that are a matter of public record. What supports the daily slander of the press? All I’ve seen so far are a handful - less than you need one hand to count - of retracted stories over a 4 year period and a load of vague and unsupported assertions.

 

[Tom 1]

The invaders were too technologically superior to know how to fight against ancient tribal ways. Kind of like how the Swamp Fox and gang who went rogue and undercover, easily defeated the British who were used to marching in rows.

Plenty of Afghani fighters have been defeated in direct engagements. But you can do that x100 and there will always be more of them.

 

[timothyu]

Plenty of Afghani fighters have been defeated in direct engagements. But you can do that x100 and there will always be more of them.

The same can be said of any enemy. Vietnam and Afghanistan were lost to guerrilla warfare.

 

[Tom 1]

Simply that the new government is not the same as the old government and to their advantage they were able to grow without the people recognizing the changes until now because they were taught to think in the old ways. Yet ironically these old ways may be the downfall of the new world order even thought they have spent decades trying to eliminate the old analog thinking out there, including allowing the analog generation to be wiped out by virus because they couldn't wait another 15 years for us to die out naturally. lol Greed on their part is an achilles heel.

I think you’re mistaking the actual mundane realities of the day to day world and the idiosyncrasies of human behaviour with the plot of a fantasy novel. Economic forces and so on shape major events but a great deal of what goes on in the world is just down to basic human behaviour, which is in fact far more interesting than bad fantasy writing.

 

[Tom 1]

The same can be said of any enemy. Vietnam and Afghanistan were lost to guerrilla warfare.

To a point maybe but the actual reason is that the people on the other side of the fight were prepared to keep it going indefinitely, regardless of what happened, whereas the various forces going in had the idea that if they killed enough of them they would eventually give up.

 

[Tom 1]

The problem is not the existence of the deep state. The problem arises when the operatives of the deep state take upon themselves to dictate policy against the wishes of their lawfully elected superiors, generally under the pretense that due to their education or history of employment that they "know better" than everybody else and are specially suited to make policy decisions. This is merely rationalization, however. What guides their decisions that they have acquired during their careers is not really knowledge and experience but merely the personal biases and prejudices that are encouraged in their professional and social circles.

Like what? Do you have any examples of that happening?

 

[timothyu]

Economic forces and so on shape major events but a great deal of what goes on in the world is just down to basic human behaviour, which is in fact far more interesting than bad fantasy writing.

Greed and self interest works on every level. That is basic human behaviour. But nationalistic thinking is so ingrained that people forget self interest can now operate on a global level.

 

[timothyu]

To a point maybe but the actual reason is that the people on the other side of the fight were prepared to keep it going indefinitely, regardless of what happened, whereas the various forces going in had the idea that if they killed enough of them they would eventually give up.

And yet ten years of Soviet power and 20 of American with all their technology and vastly outnumbering armies couldn't defeat a bunch of poorly armed guerrillas.

 

[Broken Fence]

Greed and self interest works on every level. That is basic human behaviour. But nationalistic thinking is so ingrained that people forget self interest can now operate on a global level.

That is a good point. Maybe I am naive but I have not ever seen things this bad. I am 48.

 

[timothyu]

That is a good point. Maybe I am naive but I have not ever seen things this bad. I am 48

Consider that in order to take over the world, it took over a hundred years of slow change to get to the point we are now so that no one would rebel before the time came they could be thwarted. Remember that the system is more important to the players than if they themselves see the day. They see it as a family enterprise to be carried on, the winners taking all. Even the billionaires are beholden to these who control the purse strings. The last 20 years has showed us the planners are not afraid to become more open with their deceptions in their giddiness as they see the end of their plans for a global system coming near. The last three months has been a pie in the face and yet many still don't recognize a test run if it hit them.

 

[Tom 1]

And yet ten years of Soviet power and 20 of American with all their technology and vastly outnumbering armies couldn't defeat a bunch of poorly armed guerrillas.

You can’t defeat an enemy who will never stop fighting. The only option would be to utterly eliminate that enemy, to wipe out every individual and everyone they know or who might be inspired to fight by their death, which, thankfully I would say in the grander scheme of things isn’t possible. Same basic reason you can’t make a kid eat broccoli every day if he really, really doesn’t want to.

 

[timothyu]

The only option would be to utterly eliminate that enemy, to wipe out every individual and everyone they know or who might be inspired to fight by their death, which, thankfully I would say in the grander scheme of things isn’t possible.

It is easier to have an endless supply when only a handful can successfully take on thousands. But this is all entirely off topic. That is what the global deep state likes. Distractions

 

[Tom 1]

a bunch of poorly armed guerrillas.

That doesn’t describe the Afghan fighter very well. They are life-long warriors, able to move on their own turf in ways a western soldier would never be able to. War is what they are about. If you think they are just a bunch of easily intimidated sheep herders you are making the same mistake everyone who has ever invaded Afghanistan did.

 

[timothyu]

That doesn’t describe the Afghan fighter very well. They are life-long warriors, able to move on their own turf in ways a western soldier would never be able to. War is what they are about. If you think they are just a bunch of easily intimidated sheep herders you are making the same mistake everyone who has ever invaded Afghanistan did.

As I said all along

 

[Tom 1]

It is easier to have an endless supply when only a handful can successfully take on thousands. But this is all entirely off topic. That is what the global deep state likes. Distractions

The world is far messier than you think, no-one is in charge of it all. People like Soros and so on have the ability to destabilise governments in susceptible countries for profit, but the basic mechanism for that is the same old same old - bribery, corruption, manipulation, back room deals - but that’s about the extent of it. It is only possible to believe the illuminati type fantasies if you have already retreated into a fantasy world of your own.

 

[Tom 1]

As I said all along

Your point is that old ways are better than modern ways, or something of that sort?

 

[timothyu]

People like Soros and so on have the ability to destabilise governments in susceptible countries for profit,

Like the US at present