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I have something to throw into the mix here, that reverts back to the OP and the thread title. I don't think there can be any debate the the english word "atheist" merely refers to a lack of belief in God or gods. Where the confusion comes in is that it is by necessity a part of an individual's world view. If people were more clear about addressing that when it is their true concern it would help. (Flushing out unstated objections isn't just for salesmen, I guess?)
Either way, atheists have as much faith as anybody else. The difference is the object of their faith.
I have something to throw into the mix here, that reverts back to the OP and the thread title. I don't think there can be any debate the the english word "atheist" merely refers to a lack of belief in God or gods. Where the confusion comes in is that it is by necessity a part of an individual's world view. If people were more clear about addressing that when it is their true concern it would help. (Flushing out unstated objections isn't just for salesmen, I guess?)
Either way, atheists have as much faith as anybody else. The difference is the object of their faith.
Name it.
That's like saying not believing in Santa Claus is a faith.
Non belief in a (potentially?) mythical person/creature such as Jesus or Bigfoot does not take faith.
Cars that can be shown to exist, right?
Just checking.
Not at all. Nice side step of what was actually said though.
Absolutely correct! However, to form a world view, and to act in this world, indeed requires faith. Its just that you're not accustomed to using that term, nor even thinking in those terms. If you were to compare these details from your own life to those of a believer's, I think you'd see the similarities. And they wouldn't even surprise you, other than the usage of that one word, that is.
Example: do you drive a car?
Not at all. Nice side step of what was actually said though.
Absolutely correct! However, to form a world view, and to act in this world, indeed requires faith. Its just that you're not accustomed to using that term, nor even thinking in those terms. If you were to compare these details from your own life to those of a believer's, I think you'd see the similarities. And they wouldn't even surprise you, other than the usage of that one word, that is.
Example: do you drive a car?
Faith (if we're talking biblically) is best defined as a type of trust; belief despite lack of evidence sounds very post-Enlightenment.
And yeah, you do need faith (trust) that your car will work. What distinguishes this faith from religious faith is that the former has some degree of inductive cogency behind it; but just because you car has started up a hundred times doesn't mean the hundred and first will be a win as well. So even though, in a sense, it takes a lot less faith to believe that your car will start (given induction), it's still faith.
Faith is everywhere. It's all a question of breadth and depth of faith, not whether we do or don't have faith in just about everything. You can accuse religious folks of having too much faith (too little induction, deduction, or empirical support), but you can't distinguish their faith from some sort of secular nonexistent faith.
Not at all. Nice side step of what was actually said though.
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Cars that can be shown to exist, right?
Just checking.
I have zero "faith" my car will start in the morning. Experience has taught me that it is highly likely it will, but on occasion it won't.
No, I don´t. It either will work or it won´t, and I am aware of these options.And yeah, you do need faith (trust) that your car will work.
That´s exactly one of the reasons why I don´t have faith that my car will work.What distinguishes this faith from religious faith is that the former has some degree of inductive cogency behind it; but just because you car has started up a hundred times doesn't mean the hundred and first will be a win as well.
Experience that isn't "encoded" as trust, confidence, or faith is useless for the situation you're describing. You do have faith, just not the religious type.
Well, I just said that I don´t think one way or the other. I think "it will work or it won´t". I am aware that I take chances and risks, but then again usually I have a planB.Do you think that whether or not you think your car works has any influence on your behavior?
My point is, morals only exist via value judgments. Now if you disagree, can you give an example of a moral situation existing without a value judgment taking place?But they don't only exist in your head. They exist in intentional actions and their consequences. Yes, they involve human thought, but they aren't merely in one's head.
eudaimonia,
Mark
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