Is King Charles the Antichrist ?

[tailgator]

So now we have had one poster saying it's the EU, another saying it's the UN, and now you saying it's ten Muslim leaders. I say that we are not told in the bible who precisely it is.

Let me ask you a simple question.

Where on the breadth of the earth are these resurected saints located after their resurection?

Read carefully,

Revelation 20
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.






What region on the breadth of the earth ,are those resurected saints when this happens???

 

[David Lamb]

David, the beast person will be the eighth king of a series of kings, Revelation 17:10-11.

Revelation 17:
10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.
12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.

1-5, Five had fallen at the time of John.
6, One is, at the time of John
7. One yet to come, future of John's time
Who when he comes must continue a short space (42 months as the beast-king's rule).
8. the beast-king (having been one of the seven)

1. Julius Caesar
2. Augustus Caesar
3. Tiberius
4. Caligula
5. Claudius

6. Nero

7. the end times little horn person (descended from that blood line of Julio-Claudians or maybe he will adopt the Caesar title once he becomes the beast-king.)

8. the end times little horn person once he enters the beast-king stage of his development.

The Roman Empire manifested in the end times is the EU. The ten kings are a group of ten leaders of the EU.

I don't view the EU as a modern manifestation of the Roman Empire. We in the UK voted to leave the EU. Nations could not choose to leave the Roman Empire. I still don't see how you can be so certain that the beast is the EU.

 

[Douggg]

In Mathew 10,Jesus followers are hated ,beaten in the synagogues and betrayed to death by their families.

You say Jesus followers were killed while Jesus was preaching in Israel.Which followers of Jesus were put to death while Jesus was preaching the gospel?
I would like a list of names.

Mathew 10
17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;

18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles.

19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak.

20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

21 And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.

22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.



I'm waiting for that list of names of the disciples who were betrayed to death by their families while Jesus was preaching the gospel.

Matthew 10:14-21, Jesus is telling about what will eventually happen to the cities that reject the disciples preaching that the kingdom of heaven is hand. And Jesus is telling the disciples how the disciples will would eventually be treated by men for Jesus's name sake in Matthew 10:22.

In Matthew 10:23, Jesus said, when they do encounter persecution in a city, flee, i.e. don't stick around, and go to another city in Israel. And informs them before they have completely preached to all of the cities of Israel, He Himself will come to cities in Israel, to preach and teach to them himself - as it says in Matthew 11:1

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

Read through Matthew 11-21. Those chapters are about Jesus traveling through Israel to preach to cities and areas. In Matthew 21, Jesus arrives to preach in Jerusalem.

I'm waiting for that list of names of the disciples who were betrayed to death by their families while Jesus was preaching the gospel.

There is not a list. You do know that there were 70 other disciples, in addition to the 12 disciples, that Jesus sent to every city and place in Israel, where Jesus himself would come to preach and teach ?

Luke 10:1 After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.

 

[Douggg]

I don't view the EU as a modern manifestation of the Roman Empire. We in the UK voted to leave the EU. Nations could not choose to leave the Roman Empire. I still don't see how you can be so certain that the beast is the EU.

David, I don't see that as a disqualification that the EU is the Roman Empire manifested in the end times.

The beast-king's kingdom and that of the ten horn kings is the EU.

In Revelation 17:17, the ten horn kings hand their kingdom over to beast person. What kingdom do you think is the kingdom of the ten horn kings ?

16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the harlot, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

 

[tailgator]

Matthew 10:14-21, Jesus is telling about what will eventually happen to the cities that reject the disciples preaching that the kingdom of heaven is hand. And Jesus is telling the disciples how the disciples will would eventually be treated by men for Jesus's name sake in Matthew 10:22.

In Matthew 10:23, Jesus said, when they do encounter persecution in a city, flee, i.e. don't stick around, and go to another city in Israel. And informs them before they have completely preached to all of the cities of Israel, He Himself will come to cities in Israel, to preach and teach to them himself - as it says in Matthew 11:1

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

Read through Matthew 11-21. Those chapters are about Jesus traveling through Israel to preach to cities and areas. In Matthew 21, Jesus arrives to preach in Jerusalem.



There is not a list. You do know that there were 70 other disciples, in addition to the 12 disciples, that Jesus sent to every city and place in Israel, where Jesus himself would come to preach and teach ?

Luke 10:1 After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.

Jesus did not say he will come and preach when he comes.
He only said he will come at the time of the end .


Mathew 10
22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.






Now you say none of the 12 disciples in Mathew 10 were killed.Isnt that something.

 

[tailgator]

Matthew 10:14-21, Jesus is telling about what will eventually happen to the cities that reject the disciples preaching that the kingdom of heaven is hand. And Jesus is telling the disciples how the disciples will would eventually be treated by men for Jesus's name sake in Matthew 10:22.

In Matthew 10:23, Jesus said, when they do encounter persecution in a city, flee, i.e. don't stick around, and go to another city in Israel. And informs them before they have completely preached to all of the cities of Israel, He Himself will come to cities in Israel, to preach and teach to them himself - as it says in Matthew 11:1

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

Read through Matthew 11-21. Those chapters are about Jesus traveling through Israel to preach to cities and areas. In Matthew 21, Jesus arrives to preach in Jerusalem.



There is not a list. You do know that there were 70 other disciples, in addition to the 12 disciples, that Jesus sent to every city and place in Israel, where Jesus himself would come to preach and teach ?

Luke 10:1 After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come.

Since you believe the disciples of Jesus are not persecuted in Israel before Jesus comes,Why do you suppose they are beaten in the synagogues before he comes?

Mark 13
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.


Mathew 10
17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;

18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles.

 

[Douggg]

Since you believe the disciples of Jesus are not persecuted in Israel before Jesus comes,Why do you suppose they are beaten in the synagogues before he comes?

Mark 13
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.


Mathew 10
17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues;

18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles.

The pharisees and sadducees religious leaders of that time were self serving.

 

[Douggg]

Jesus did not say he will come and preach when he comes.
He only said he will come at the time of the end .

Mathew 10
22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

"time of the end" is not used in Matthew 10:22. The disciples in Matthew 10 and Luke 9-10, Jesus sent out to the cities and areas in Israel to prepare them to hear Jesus when he himself would soon come to preach in those areas in Israel.

Read through Matthew 11-21. Those chapters are about Jesus preaching and teaching in the areas in Israel. Matthew 21 is when Jesus begins to preach and teach in Jerusalem.

.

 

[tailgator]

The pharisees and sadducees religious leaders of that time were self serving.

So you believe the tribulation and in the Olivet discourse is about the Pharisees and Sadducees of 2000 years ago.

Fiqures.

 

[tailgator]

"time of the end" is not used in Matthew 10:22. The disciples in Matthew 10 and Luke 9-10, Jesus sent out to the cities and areas in Israel to prepare them to hear Jesus when he himself would soon come to preach in those areas in Israel.

Read through Matthew 11-21. Those chapters are about Jesus preaching and teaching in the areas in Israel. Matthew 21 is when Jesus begins to preach and teach in Jerusalem.

.

Jesus never said he will come to preach in Mathew 10.

He only says ,he that endures till the end will be saved and that they will be persecuted in all of Israel cities till he comes


Now your claim is that no christians will be persecuted in the cities of Israel before jesus comes.
As I understand prophecy,the christians in Israel are imprisoned ,persecuted and killed in all the cities of israel before the end when Jesus comes

Daniel 11:33-35
Wise leaders will give instruction to many, but these teachers will die by fire and sword, or they will be jailed and robbed.
During these persecutions, little help will arrive, and many who join them will not be sincere.
And some of the wise will fall victim to persecution. In this way, they will be refined and cleansed and made pure until the time of the end, for the appointed time is still to come.


These Christians being persecuted until the end in Daniel 11:33:35 are not in Europe.Daniel is writing about his own people (Israeli christians)being persecuted and cleansed.

 

[Douggg]

So you believe the tribulation and in the Olivet discourse is about the Pharisees and Sadducees of 2000 years ago.

Fiqures.

No, you are putting words in my mouth.

Jesus never said he will come to preach in Mathew 10.

Look at the start of the next chapter, Matthew 11.

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

 

[tailgator]

No, you are putting words in my mouth.

Look at the start of the next chapter, Matthew 11.

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

I quoted the tribulation in mark 13

Mark 13 is the Olivet discourse.

You said they were Pharisees and Sadducees of that time .Your words.

 

[tailgator]

No, you are putting words in my mouth.

Look at the start of the next chapter, Matthew 11.

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

I recon that would make the Pharisees and Sadducees who beat the christians in the synagogues during the tribulation in the Olivet discourse at least 2000 years old.

They sure have long lives

 

[Douggg]

I recon that would make the Pharisees and Sadducees who beat the christians in the synagogues during the tribulation in the Olivet discourse at least 2000 years old.

They sure have long lives

Matthew 10-11 is not the Olivet discourse.

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

 

[tailgator]

Matthew 10-11 is not the Olivet discourse.

Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities.

I quoted mark 13 (the Olivet discourse)which says the same thing as Mathew 10.Almost word for word.

Mark 13
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.

10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.

11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.




So why are Christians being beaten in the synagogues during the tribulation ,if those loving Jews don't persecute christians as you claim?

 

[tailgator]

As the little horn attempts to change laws in Israel,persecution on Christians rise.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/report-shows-rise-in-attacks-on-christians-in-israel-but-a-willingness-to-tackle-issue/amp/

But there are some people on this board who say christians in Israel will see no persecution.They claim persecution of christians in Israel is a thing of the past.

 

[Douggg]

I quoted mark 13 (the Olivet discourse)which says the same thing as Mathew 10.Almost word for word.

Mark 13
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.

10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.

11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

So why are Christians being beaten in the synagogues during the tribulation ,if those loving Jews don't persecute christians as you claim?

Mark 13:1 And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
2 And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,


Mark 13 is Mark's account of the Olivet discourse. Matthew 10 is not the Olivet discourse. You are getting everything mixed up. Matthew 10:23 the Son of man be come is not talking about Jesus's future return to earth. Matthew 10:23 is talking about Jesus coming to the different areas of Israel to preach and teach, as it says in Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities. <<<<< read it.... what does it say?

 

[tailgator]

Mark 13:1 And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!
2 And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives over against the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,


Mark 13 is Mark's account of the Olivet discourse. Matthew 10 is not the Olivet discourse. You are getting everything mixed up. Matthew 10:23 the Son of man be come is not talking about Jesus's future return to earth. Matthew 10:23 is talking about Jesus coming to the different areas of Israel to preach and teach, as it says in Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities. <<<<< read it.... what does it say?


View attachment 362793

No I'm not getting mixed up.
Mark 13 is the Olivet discourse when Jesus talks about the christians suffering tribulation being beaten in the synagogues.

You saying christians will not be beaten in the synagogues Doug?

You believe Jesus is wrong concerning the tribulation?Or you believe mark 13 is wrong?


I'm quoting mark 13 here Doug,can't you tell?

Mark 13
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.

10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.

11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

 

[Douggg]

No I'm not getting mixed up.
Mark 13 is the Olivet discourse when Jesus talks about the christians suffering tribulation being beaten in the synagogues.

You saying christians will not be beaten in the synagogues Doug?

You believe Jesus is wrong concerning the tribulation?Or you believe mark 13 is wrong?


I'm quoting mark 13 here Doug,can't you tell?

Mark 13
9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.

10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.

11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.

13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

The Olivet discourse verses address 3 periods - near term, long term, end times.

 

[Douggg]

I quoted mark 13 (the Olivet discourse)which says the same thing as Mathew 10.Almost word for word.

You are not understanding that in Matthew 10:23, "till the Son of man be come" is not referring to Jesus's return, but his coming into the cities and areas of Israel to preach and teach - as is written in Matthew 11:1 And it came to pass, when Jesus had made an end of commanding his twelve disciples, he departed thence to teach and to preach in their cities. <<<<< read it.... what does it say?

Parts of the Olivet discourse of Mark 13 are "near term", i.e. up to the destruction of the temple in 70ad. Those are the verses that match with Matthew 10:16-22.

But the long term and end times verses of Mark 13 do match with the verses in Matthew 10. The disciples lived 2000 years ago, not in the end times, when Jesus will return.