Is it wrong to touch?

[praying]

and they don't want anyone else to see them, and they are drooling over pictures of men sodomizing each other, and it makes them apostate teachers, relaying the filth of their unchaste customs to others, they become a grave under peoples' feet waiting for another to fall in.

Drolling over pictures, men sodomizing each other, apostate teachers, unchaste customs, whoa where did all of that come from?

 

[Adelheide]

I'm very confused at this point, because I have tried both sides of this argument and both have their downfalls.

If I touch regularly, I wind up feeling guilty and I feel like I have sinned.

If I don't touch, then I wind up having wet dreams. The last wet dream I had was about a girl at my school who (in the dream) commited suicide before my eyes and in her dieing breath asked me to have sex with her, and I couldn't really stop myself.

Which is worse? Masturbating or dreaming of sex with a dead girl?

Either way I feel like a terrible person.

i think your sexual guilt has more to do with masturbation.

 

[Adelheide]

i personally feel my masturbation is a sin. I do relate to the idea of having sex with demons. That's how it felt to me when i did this. It did controle me....some times 4-5 times a day. Once i tried to stop masturbating there were demons....a spiritual force driving me insane about it. One time i can remember saying to myself..." i don't care if it's wrong...i want an [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]...i don't care if it's from the devil himself...i want it"

I think masturbation is a door. A door that can lead and open to very demonic things. A certain person my not have a problem with it...but the door to it becoming a problem is open and we are to run from these open doors.

 

[Adelheide]

sex is more of a spiritual thing that it is a physical thing. I've experiance godly sexual pleasure and satanic sinful pleasure. The physical things were the same...but the spirit was differant. The only time that a sexual act is of God is when it is ordained by God. For the person who took on the challange to not touch for 3 weeks...i challenge you not to touch for 5 years. If you think that's unreasonable.....then i think it has more controle over you than you think.

 

[Adelheide]

i too have very sinful sexual dreams some times. When waking i can't fall asleep because of the urge to touch......i believe that these dreams are brought on by demons...tempting you in any way they can. it isn't your fault that you have these dreams.....but through prayer and bible reading and purification you can eliminate the possibility of these demons coming into your dreams.

 

[amx]

i too have very sinful sexual dreams some times. When waking i can't fall asleep because of the urge to touch......i believe that these dreams are brought on by demons...tempting you in any way they can. it isn't your fault that you have these dreams.....but through prayer and bible reading and purification you can eliminate the possibility of these demons coming into your dreams.

Adelheide,
Have you considered it could be your age and chemistry. Testosterone, estrogen and adrogen can have a powerful effect. Your desires will calm with age. I hate to see you laden with such guilt and fear.

 

[Adelheide]

Adelheide,
Have you considered it could be your age and chemistry. Testosterone, estrogen and adrogen can have a powerful effect. Your desires will calm with age. I hate to see you laden with such guilt and fear.

no. it's not age. i've had these urges since i was a young girl. (as young as 6). It's always been a demonic presence with it. I also have the gift of discernment. Discernemt of the spirits. I'm sensative to these things. I think that is why it was such a strong battle for me. You can not confuse me of where it comes from. I know where it comes from. it is a fact for me. I know what i know and have seen and felt what i've seen.

I do not have guilt. i have victory in Christ. It takes a holy spirit to defeat a demonic spirit. If masturbation wasn't demonic then why should people who have a problem with it go to Christ for help with it.

 

[Adelheide]

perhaps some people should remember that satan most often decieves with moderation. Just because you don't do it all the time or it "doesn't have controle" over you....does NOT mean what it does to you spiritually. Just because you are touch moderatley does not minimize the severity of the act.

 

[Adelheide]

...does NOT mean it doesnt' affect you spiritually.

is what i meant to say.

 

[Aras]

perhaps some people should remember that satan most often decieves with moderation. Just because you don't do it all the time or it "doesn't have controle" over you....does NOT mean what it does to you spiritually. Just because you are touch moderatley does not minimize the severity of the act.

Why do you assume there is something spiritual at all about masturbation? In any case I have never felt guilt about masturbation nor sensed anything demonic about it, and as far as I can tell there is nothing in the Bible either.

Also, just going off topic for a second but can you just EDIT when you think of something else? Posting 4-5 posts in a row could be considered spamming and is definately a little annoying. Thank you.

 

[amx]

Adelheide,
I believe you and I respect what you are sensing. I have discerned a demonic presence before in certain situations and I can't imagine what it would be like to have that sense of forboding all the time. I'm glad you can find comfort and security in Christ.
Not everyone is wired as you are.

 

[Adelheide]

Why do you assume there is something spiritual at all about masturbation? In any case I have never felt guilt about masturbation nor sensed anything demonic about it, and as far as I can tell there is nothing in the Bible either.

Also, just going off topic for a second but can you just EDIT when you think of something else? Posting 4-5 posts in a row could be considered spamming and is definately a little annoying. Thank you.

sorry.... but people weren't replying and i kept thinking of things to say.

and i'm not assuming anything. What makes you think my experiances are unreal? Why are you assuming that i'm pushing what i've been through onto anyone else. I'm simply sharing my opinion and what i've been through.

 

[Adelheide]

Adelheide,
I believe you and I respect what you are sensing. I have discerned a demonic presence before in certain situations and I can't imagine what it would be like to have that sense of forboding all the time. I'm glad you can find comfort and security in Christ.
Not everyone is wired as you are.

thank you for acknowleging what i've been through.

 

[Bulldog]

Now, with the sin of Onan properly disposed of:

Yes masturbation is a sexual sin. ​

Ephesians 5:3 “But among you there must not be either sexual immorality, impurity of any kind, or greed, as these are not fitting for the saints.” (Net Bible)



Ephesians 5:3 But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; (KJV)



Ephesians 5:3 But immorality or any impurity or greed must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints; (NASB)



Ephesians 5:3 But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people. (NIV)



This is the major verse that says masturbation is a sin! I have given you four examples from four different translations. I like the way they all say it, but the NIV really puts it into words that mortal man can understand the best because that version says … “holy people.” I think if we’re saved then we become Holy. (Lets save this for another thread, ok guys, don’t jump on me for not posting a scripture reference about this here, I’m concentrating on sexual impurity here, thanks anyway for thinking about it though.).



For Jesus said in Matthew 5:26 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Do not commit adultery.’

27 “But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.” (NIV)



This says anything that gives you the hint of thinking of taking a woman (or man for that matter) to bed is a sin. What else is masturbation? You just don’t have that object of your sexual desire to consummate the act, so you improvise. You have sinned according to God’s law.



I want to let you know that you are not alone in this. Most men have done this. I’ll admit that I have. I knew that it was a sin. I was pointed to a book by God. I picked this book up several times in the Christian bookstore that I now frequent. Finally, while watching Charles Stanley one Sunday morning he was doing the a series on the “Landmines in the Path of the Believer” This one was the first one on pride. It caused me to go to his web site and do an expanded study of his word. The whole series was there and there is one on Landmines in the Path of the Believer: Part Four - Sexual Sins . I opened the link and started reading. There he reverences the same book that I’d picked up and put back down several times. “Every Man’s Battle” by Stephen Arterburn. I read this page with zeal. I went out and purchased the book, and read it in two and a half days. For you see I had the same problem you stated you have. I have learned thru proper scripture listed in the book, how to avoid any temptations in the modern world. I wish I had that book with me, but I left it at home, and I’m at work writing this to you.



1 Corinthians 6:13 “… The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.” This is very true. Learn how to not look at a woman for anything but a person, not as an object of sexual desire. Remember Matthew 5:26-27 once again. If you even look at a woman lustfully, then you are sinning. Don’t see a woman and take a ‘free peek’ down her blouse, it’s a sin. Don’t open a door for a woman so that you might watch her walk, that’s a sin. Open the door to be courteous, then look away. Look at the floor, look at the ceiling, don’t watch her ‘wiggle’. If the Coors twins come on during the NFL game you’re watching, don’t look, change the channel for 60 seconds. Don’t watch shows like “Desperate Housewife’s” that are full of sexual content, watch a religious station instead. Don’t pick up a Playboy, or any magazine similar to or worse than, for any reason. Avoid sexual web sites and binary newsgroups, as they will lead to eternal damnation.



Romans 13:13 “Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in orgies and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, not in dissension and jealousy.” (NIV) Yes, by all means live a pure life, it can be done. I’ve learned to not look at a woman in a lustful nature. I don’t pick up the newspaper’s Sunday morning papers ads any more, you’ll understand after you read the book (“Every Man’s Battle”) about this. Lets look at Galatians 5:19: Here Paul states what the sins are, you notice what’s first “The acts of the sinful nature are obvious, sexual immorality,…” and if you can 1 Thessalonians 5:22 “Avoid every kind of evil.” Then you can start on your way to redemption. God will help you through this problem. You can stop, you will stop, as I will pray for you. As stated in Titus 2: 11” For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. 12 It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age.”



Amen.



I hope this will help you,

Your brother in Christ,

Russ

This is pure question begging.

 

[Aras]

sorry.... but people weren't replying and i kept thinking of things to say.

and i'm not assuming anything. What makes you think my experiances are unreal? Why are you assuming that i'm pushing what i've been through onto anyone else. I'm simply sharing my opinion and what i've been through.

I apologise, I did not mean to diminish your personal experiences, that was never my intention.

 

[Adelheide]

This is pure question begging.

...some people are interested in defending what they think and feel is right rather than finding out the truth.

 

[Bulldog]

...some people are interested in defending what they think and feel is right rather than finding out the truth.

This is a response?

 

[Smurfe189]

i too have very sinful sexual dreams some times. When waking i can't fall asleep because of the urge to touch......i believe that these dreams are brought on by demons...tempting you in any way they can. it isn't your fault that you have these dreams.....but through prayer and bible reading and purification you can eliminate the possibility of these demons coming into your dreams.

Somehow I can't see how any sort of human effort can purify me. It is God's grace that saves, not my own self-discipline. I don't understand how you can say "demons" bring on erotic dreams, and by purification, prayer and Bible reading I can somehow rid myself of them.

I believe wholely in what the Bible says, and I believe that's all we have on this earth to go by. I'm not really here browsing this forum to hear human opinion, I want God's opinion.

Seeing as how the Bible does not provide a cut in stone definition of right and wrong with masturbation, I think I'm going to pray about it and see what God will bring to my mind. Right now, especially at my young age, I think it's more important master the flesh instead of giving in to it. As long as the urge doesn't get out of control, I don't really see a problem with it, because I don't see how God would want us to restrain ourselves only to have naughty dreams instead.

 

[slavetoChrist]

The Bible does not say "do not touch" .. however, I believe it does give clear guidelines to what we are to do with our bodies. We are supposed to present out bodies as a living sacrifice to God. Our bodies are not ours. We are supposed to use them for the glory of God... and masturbation does not. So I think the assumption is clear that masturbation is not godly. However, I do not believe that struggling with sin and temptation makes you a sinner, nor incapable of being used by God. God can use us in spite of our weakness.


As far as having sexual dreams... that's a really hard one. But I do not think it does justice to simply say that it's "demons" that do it because we all play a role in what happens in our life. I wouldn't look to the dreams as the problem... merely the expression of another.

What goes on in your mind during the day? What fantasies or sexual daydreams do you allow to play in your mind? What kind of movies do you watch? What kind of music do you listen to? I would first examine your heart and mind DURING the day before I attempt to go through trying to get rid of the dreams. The dreams will go away when you surrender your mind to Christ, focusing on spiritual things. This is done in the physical by avoiding anything that causes you to think lustful thoughts and not dwell on them when you do get them.

 

[micknick]

those arguing for masturbation keep saying that because the Bible is clear on other sexual activities masturbation must be OK. this is the biggest load of rubbish i have ever heard. yes some sins are spelled out but others aren't- pedophilia is completely ignored in the Bible but do you assume that to be acceptable also? the Bible clearly states that we should resist the desires of the flesh, not submit to them. this canvases all sexual activity outside marital relations