• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Is it immoral to help a disabled widow by cutting her grass on the Sabbath?

Is it immoral to help a disabled widow by cutting her grass on the Sabbath?


  • Total voters
    7

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
10,077
3,424
✟979,141.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
We are all smart enough to substitute cutting grass with any number of things. The point is not the act, so let's not scrutinize grass-cutting, the point is a motivation to help someone in need. Christ tells us it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath but some wish to debate that this goodness has limits on the Sabbath. I for one would gladly lend a helping hand, be it cutting grass, lifting boxes, or some other act aimed at being helpful and showing love especially when someone has a clear need. The opposite focus of avoiding help seems counter-gospel. Some would call help immoral if done on the Sabbath which I find a bit bizarre. So please, if you call this immoral make sure you let people know so we can understand your perspective.
 

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
13,168
5,309
European Union
✟218,189.00
Country
Czech Republic
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
We have Saturdays, not Sabbaths. Sabbath is a Jewish thing.

No, its not immoral to do good/useful work on Saturdays or on any other day.

It may be unhealthy if somebody works too much and does not take vacations/days off, but its not immoral, per se.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
53,163
11,811
Georgia
✟1,075,552.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
We are all smart enough to substitute cutting grass with any number of things. The point is not the act, so let's not scrutinize grass-cutting, the point is a motivation to help someone in need. Christ tells us it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath but some wish to debate that this goodness has limits on the Sabbath. I for one would gladly lend a helping hand, be it cutting grass, lifting boxes, or some other act aimed at being helpful and showing love especially when someone has a clear need. The opposite focus of avoiding help seems counter-gospel. Some would call help immoral if done on the Sabbath which I find a bit bizarre. So please, if you call this immoral make sure you let people know so we can understand your perspective.
Cutting grass is not a life or death issue. If it was done 24 hours later no one dies.
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Site Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
53,163
11,811
Georgia
✟1,075,552.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
We have Saturdays, not Sabbaths. Sabbath is a Jewish thing.
Is 56:6-8 -- gentiles specifically singled out for Sabbath keeping
Is 66:23 -- ALL mankind to keep Sabbath for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth
Acts 13 - Gentiles ask for more Gospel preaching to be scheduled for NEXT Sabbath
Acts 18:4 -- EVERY Sabbath - Gospel preaching to both gentiles and Jews.

James 2 - He who breaks one of the commandments is guilty of breaking all
Eph 6:2 the ten commandments are such that "'Honor your father and mother' is the first commandment with a promise"
 
Upvote 0

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
13,168
5,309
European Union
✟218,189.00
Country
Czech Republic
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Is 56:6-8 -- gentiles specifically singled out for Sabbath keeping
Is 66:23 -- ALL mankind to keep Sabbath for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth
Acts 13 - Gentiles ask for more Gospel preaching to be scheduled for NEXT Sabbath
Acts 18:4 -- EVERY Sabbath - Gospel preaching to both gentiles and Jews.

James 2 - He who breaks one of the commandments is guilty of breaking all
Eph 6:2 the ten commandments are such that "'Honor your father and mother' is the first commandment with a promise"
81f6Its3LsL._SL1500_.jpg


Or, if you wish the European/ISO standard version:

Days-of-the-week-poster.jpg

 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Gary K

an old small town kid
Aug 23, 2002
4,660
1,016
Visit site
✟111,932.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
81f6Its3LsL._SL1500_.jpg


Or, if you wish the European/ISO standard version:

Days-of-the-week-poster.jpg

So human beings have the right to change the days of the week that God Himself set up? The weekly order has never changed.
 
Upvote 0

godisagardener

Romans 10:6-9, Ephesians 2:8-10
Jul 7, 2022
695
421
North Texas
✟110,833.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Whether or not the Sabbath is a Jewish thing or not, it was set aside in the Old Testament Law as a day of rest from the burdens the people carried. It was impossible for any person to keep the Law entirely, as hundreds of laws continued to be added. No one could or can be saved by trying to keep the Law.

Read Galatians 3:23-25.

As Christians, we do not have a Sabbath. We (for the most part) have Sunday as our day of worship. There's certainly controversy in that, but that's another story. Jesus is our Sabbath. He is our rest. Every day, seven days a week. We as Christians are not judged by whether we keep the Sabbath as the Jews kept the Sabbath.

Read Colossians 2:16.

It's not immoral to cut grass or provide other assistance to someone on Sunday, which I gather you're referring to as the Sabbath. There are many, many good Christians who have to work at jobs on Sundays. Is that immoral? I don't believe so.
 
Upvote 0

Gary K

an old small town kid
Aug 23, 2002
4,660
1,016
Visit site
✟111,932.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Whether or not the Sabbath is a Jewish thing or not, it was set aside in the Old Testament Law as a day of rest from the burdens the people carried. It was impossible for any person to keep the Law entirely, as hundreds of laws continued to be added. No one could or can be saved by trying to keep the Law.

Read Galatians 3:23-25.

As Christians, we do not have a Sabbath. We (for the most part) have Sunday as our day of worship. There's certainly controversy in that, but that's another story. Jesus is our Sabbath. He is our rest. Every day, seven days a week. We as Christians are not judged by whether we keep the Sabbath as the Jews kept the Sabbath.

Read Colossians 2:16.

It's not immoral to cut grass or provide other assistance to someone on Sunday, which I gather you're referring to as the Sabbath. There are many, many good Christians who have to work at jobs on Sundays. Is that immoral? I don't believe so.
Where is your evidence from scripture of the hundreds of laws that were added? I certainly don't see them.
 
Upvote 0

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
13,168
5,309
European Union
✟218,189.00
Country
Czech Republic
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
So human beings have the right to change the days of the week that God Himself set up? The weekly order has never changed.
God did not set up any names for week days or any calendar.
 
Upvote 0

Gary K

an old small town kid
Aug 23, 2002
4,660
1,016
Visit site
✟111,932.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
God did not set up any names for week days or any calendar.
No He didn't, but He set up the days of the week at creation. It has been known ever since that the day we call Sunday was the first day of the week and the day we call Saturday was the seventh day of the week. By the way all of our names of the days of the week came from the names of pagan gods.
 
Upvote 0

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
13,168
5,309
European Union
✟218,189.00
Country
Czech Republic
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
No He didn't, but He set up the days of the week at creation. It has been known ever since that the day we call Sunday was the first day of the week and the day we call Saturday was the seventh day of the week. By the way all of our names of the days of the week came from the names of pagan gods.
Jewish week order is not a set up week order for the humanity. Do not mix them together.
 
Upvote 0

Gary K

an old small town kid
Aug 23, 2002
4,660
1,016
Visit site
✟111,932.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Jewish week order is not a set up week order for the humanity. Do not mix them together.
How is that? God set things up, not the Jews. They didn't exist as a people until millenia after creation.
 
Upvote 0

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
13,168
5,309
European Union
✟218,189.00
Country
Czech Republic
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
How is that? God set things up, not the Jews. They didn't exist as a people until millenia after creation.
And the book of Genesis with the creation story or the book of Exodus with the slavery story did not exist until Jews wrote it.
 
Upvote 0

Freth

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 11, 2020
1,622
1,971
Midwest, USA
✟529,146.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Single
The Sabbath Commandment

Exodus 20:8-11
  • Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
  • Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
  • Why?
  • For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
Immoral?

immoral: not conforming to accepted standards of morality.
morality: principles concerning the distinction between right and wrong or good and bad behavior.

Nehemiah 9:13-15 Thou camest down also upon mount Sinai, and spakest with them from heaven, and gavest them right judgments, and true laws, good statutes and commandments: And madest known unto them thy holy sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the hand of Moses thy servant: And gavest them bread from heaven for their hunger, and broughtest forth water for them out of the rock for their thirst, and promisedst them that they should go in to possess the land which thou hadst sworn to give them.

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.

To Mow or Not To Mow

As BobRyan already stated, mowing the lawn can be done any of the six work days of the week, it doesn't have to be done on Sabbath.

Sabbath for the Jews?

Regarding the Sabbath being for the Jews specifically...

If the Sabbath is only for the Jews, then...
  • The other nine commandments are only for the Jews.
  • There is no standard of Christian character.
  • You would have to rely solely on the ministry of Jesus.
  • But... If you rely solely on the ministry of Jesus...
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus taught the Ten Commandments during His ministry.
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus taught from what we now call the Old Testament.
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus hung the law and the prophets on love, forever binding them, not separating them.
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus said specifically that not one jot or tittle will pass from the law until all be fulfilled (all is not fulfilled).
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus went to the synagogue every Sabbath to read, as was His custom.
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus observed the Sabbath even in death.
    • You would have to ignore the writings of the apostles that specifically call for commandment keeping for both Jew and Gentile.
    • You would have to ignore that Jesus called for commandment keeping in the Revelation of Jesus Christ, post-crucifixion, from heaven.
    • You would have to ignore that the patience of the saints is keeping the commandments of God and faith of Jesus (also found in the Revelation of Jesus Christ).
That's a lot of ignoring a Christian would have to do, just to avoid the Sabbath commandment.

Build Your House on the Rock

Matthew 7 and the parable of the house built on the rock vs the house built on sand.

13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
  • What is doing the will of the Father, if not observing the Ten Commandments?
  • Jesus did the will of the Father. They are one and the same.
24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
  • Hear and do = house built upon a rock.
  • Hear and not do = house built upon sand.
  • The house built on sand will not stand the weather.
The Commandments Are the Standard

Jesus:

Matthew 5:19 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Gary K

an old small town kid
Aug 23, 2002
4,660
1,016
Visit site
✟111,932.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
And the book of Genesis with the creation story or the book of Exodus with the slavery story did not exist until Jews wrote it.
So? The world accepted the order of the days of the week up until the EU decided to change the order. That's very recent in the world's time line.
 
Upvote 0

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
13,168
5,309
European Union
✟218,189.00
Country
Czech Republic
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
So? The world accepted the order of the days of the week up until the EU decided to change the order. That's very recent in the world's time line.
Not true. The "world" has never had some unified week names or order. Thats actually why the ISO standard was created, to clean the mess a bit.

And deeper in history, there were many kinds of weeks in various nations and tribes.
 
Upvote 0

DamianWarS

Follower of Isa Al Masih
Site Supporter
May 15, 2008
10,077
3,424
✟979,141.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Immoral?

immoral: not conforming to accepted standards of morality.
morality: principles concerning the distinction between right and wrong or good and bad behavior.
I'll have to infer by this you think it's immoral. By your own posted definition morality is based on distinctions of good and bad behavior. In Mat 12 Christ shows us we may break our Sabbath rest to do good. This sort of puts to question how we frame the Sabbath in terms of morality if we are told we may break the Sabbath to do moral acts. Either the Sabbath law doesn't fit moral conventions or there is a higher charge of goodness that allows us to break Sabbath rest in order to do that goodness.
 
Upvote 0

Gary K

an old small town kid
Aug 23, 2002
4,660
1,016
Visit site
✟111,932.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Not true. The "world" has never had some unified week names or order. Thats actually why the ISO standard was created, to clean the mess a bit.

And deeper in history, there were many kinds of weeks in various nations and tribes.
While what you say may be true, I don't know as I've never researched it. I do know that the weekly order has never changed until the EU took it upon itself to do it. The Jews have kept very accurate records of the weekly order since their existence as a people and that starts after the flood, The pagan cult that Nimrod started kept the same weekly order so we know Noah and his family brought it through the flood with them.
 
Upvote 0

godisagardener

Romans 10:6-9, Ephesians 2:8-10
Jul 7, 2022
695
421
North Texas
✟110,833.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Where is your evidence from scripture of the hundreds of laws that were added? I certainly don't see them.

Not everything concerning Jewish law is in scripture. Much of it is found in Jewish history and literature.

A Living Library of Torah

The Mishnah and the Talmud are interesting reading. It's really a very educational site overall regarding Jewish legal, ceremonial, etc. history.
 
Upvote 0