Is it a myth that the Jews rejected Jesus?

RND

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I think you answered your question with your second question.

"The very humiliation that Christ bore was foretold in the Scriptures as a specification of His divine character and mission, and should have commended Him to every home and heart in the land. But to proud and unbelieving Jews His humiliation was an offense." {11MR 283.1}

Jesus was rejected then just as it is today, because of "pride" and "unbelief."

"It is a grievous sin in the sight of God for men to place themselves between the people and the message that He would have come to them as some of our brethren are now doing. There are some who, like the Jews, are doing their utmost to make the message of God of none effect. Let these doubting, questioning ones either receive the light of the truth for this time, or let them stand out of the way, that others may have an opportunity of receiving the truth, that the wrath of God may not come on them because they are bodies of darkness, when He desires them to be bodies of light." {11MR 286.2}
 
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moicherie

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I think you answered your question with your second question.

"The very humiliation that Christ bore was foretold in the Scriptures as a specification of His divine character and mission, and should have commended Him to every home and heart in the land. But to proud and unbelieving Jews His humiliation was an offense." {11MR 283.1}

Jesus was rejected then just as it is today, because of "pride" and "unbelief."

"It is a grievous sin in the sight of God for men to place themselves between the people and the message that He would have come to them as some of our brethren are now doing. There are some who, like the Jews, are doing their utmost to make the message of God of none effect. Let these doubting, questioning ones either receive the light of the truth for this time, or let them stand out of the way, that others may have an opportunity of receiving the truth, that the wrath of God may not come on them because they are bodies of darkness, when He desires them to be bodies of light." {11MR 286.2}
But not all Jews were proud and unbelieving, we judge a whole nation on the vocal ones?
 
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AndrewK788

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But not all Jews were proud and unbelieving, we judge a whole nation on the vocal ones?

I think the vocal ones represented the people. The Jewish leaders, the Pharisees and Saducees represented the Jewish nation. In the Bible we see the leaders were very careful in how they dealt with Jesus so they would not anger the crowds. It seems with that kind of sway over the leaders the Jewish people could have prevented his crucifixion but they were out there demanding it along with their leaders.

It is true that not all Jews wanted Christ crucified. But the voices of the Jewish nation did. It is also true that not all people on earth have turned away from God, and yet I don't think anyone would argue that this world has fallen to sin. Adam and Eve fell to sin and they were representative of the entire human race. The Jewish leaders were representative of the Jewish people. It seems the Jews could have rejected their leaders for Jesus if they had so chosen.

That is my opinion anyway. Comments?
 
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RND

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But not all Jews were proud and unbelieving, we judge a whole nation on the vocal ones?

Of course not, we're speaking in generalities here, not specifics. Would it be more proper to say "Jewish Leadership" or "Jewish Religious Leaders?" Without a doubt. But we must keep in mind that even the Bible speaks in such generalities.
 
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StormyOne

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maybe the question is not did the jews reject Jesus but did Jesus reject the jews?

Rom 11:1-36
So I ask, "Has God rejected his people Israel?" That's unthinkable! Consider this. I'm an Israelite myself, a descendant of Abraham from the tribe of Benjamin. (2) God has not rejected his people whom he knew long ago. Don't you know what Elijah says in the Scripture passage when he complains to God about Israel? He says, (3) "Lord, they've killed your prophets and torn down your altars. I'm the only one left, and they're trying to take my life." (4) But what was God's reply? God said, "I've kept 7,000 people for myself who have not knelt to worship Baal." (5) So, as there were then, there are now a few left that God has chosen by his kindness. (6) If they were chosen by God's kindness, they weren't chosen because of anything they did. Otherwise, God's kindness wouldn't be kindness. (7) So what does all this mean? It means that Israel has never achieved what it has been striving for. However, those whom God has chosen have achieved it. The minds of the rest of Israel were closed, (8) as Scripture says, "To this day God has given them a spirit of deep sleep. Their eyes don't see, and their ears don't hear!" (9) And David says, "Let the table set for them become a trap and a net, a snare and a punishment for them. (10) Let their vision become clouded so that they cannot see. Let them carry back-breaking burdens forever." (11) So I ask, "Has Israel stumbled so badly that it can't get up again?" That's unthinkable! By Israel's failure, salvation has come to people who are not Jewish to make the Jewish people jealous. (12) The fall of the Jewish people made the world spiritually rich. Their failure made people who are not Jewish spiritually rich. So the inclusion of Jewish people will make the world even richer. (13) Now, I speak to you who are not Jewish. As long as I am an apostle sent to people who are not Jewish, I bring honor to my ministry. (14) Perhaps I can make my people jealous and save some of them. (15) If Israel's rejection means that the world has been brought back to God, what does Israel's acceptance mean? It means that Israel has come back to life. (16) If the first handful of dough is holy, the whole batch of dough is holy. If the root is holy, the branches are holy. (17) But some of the olive branches have been broken off, and you, a wild olive branch, have been grafted in their place. You get your nourishment from the roots of the olive tree. (18) So don't brag about being better than the other branches. If you brag, remember that you don't support the root, the root supports you. (19) "Well," you say, "Branches were cut off so that I could be grafted onto the tree." (20) That's right! They were broken off because they didn't believe, but you remain on the tree because you do believe. Don't feel arrogant, but be afraid. (21) If God didn't spare the natural branches, he won't spare you, either. (22) Look at how kind and how severe God can be. He is severe to those who fell, but kind to you if you continue to hold on to his kindness. Otherwise, you, too, will be cut off from the tree. (23) If Jewish people do not continue in their unbelief, they will be grafted onto the tree again, because God is able to do that. (24) In spite of the fact that you have been cut from a wild olive tree, you have been grafted onto a cultivated one. So wouldn't it be easier for these natural branches to be grafted onto the olive tree they belong to? (25) Brothers and sisters, I want you to understand this mystery so that you won't become arrogant. The minds of some Israelites have become closed until all of God's non-Jewish people are included. (26) In this way Israel as a whole will be saved, as Scripture says, "The Savior will come from Zion. He will remove godlessness from Jacob. (27) My promise to them will be fulfilled when I take away their sins." (28) The Good News made the Jewish people enemies because of you. But by God's choice they are loved because of their ancestors. (29) God never changes his mind when he gives gifts or when he calls someone. (30) In the past, you disobeyed God. But now God has been merciful to you because of the disobedience of the Jewish people. (31) In the same way, the Jewish people have also disobeyed so that God may be merciful to them as he was to you. (32) God has placed all people into the prison of their own disobedience so that he could be merciful to all people. (33) God's riches, wisdom, and knowledge are so deep that it is impossible to explain his decisions or to understand his ways. (34) "Who knows how the Lord thinks? Who can become his adviser?" (35) Who gave the Lord something which the Lord must pay back? (36) Everything is from him and by him and for him. Glory belongs to him forever! Amen!
 
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AndrewK788

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Perhaps this goes a long ways in explaining why SDA's did nothing during the holocaust nor took any action in speaking out against Hitler's corrupt regime during that time.

God has not corporately rejected the Jews. We are all being grafted into the vine, Jew and Gentile alike.

Night, I agree with a lot of things you've said here but I did have one question. How can you mention the Holocaust as though it were common knowledge? I consider myself quite well-read in WWII history, including the Holocaust of the Jews. Though there definitely were thoughs who knew and did nothing, the general population of the world didn't have a clue of what was happening to the Jews until the war was well underway and these so-called 'labor' camps were discovered as what they truly were.

And speaking of criticizing corrupt regimes...Stalin's regime was responsible for just as many death's as Hitler. But as the saying goes, 'the victor writes history' we don't mention that ironic piece of history since the USSR was such a vital ally in overthrowing the Reich.

Sorry everyone if this was off-topic, but I'm trying to understand NE's grounds for criticising SDAs of the time when much of the world was oblivious.
 
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RND

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Once again Trad SDA arrogance rears its head and we have that wonderful idea making the rounds in Adventism called replacement theology, whereby God has completely rejected the Jewish nation and Adventists are now bestowed with the honor of being 'spiritual Israel'

Actually, this is not an exclusive teaching of the SdA church. There are many Christian denominations that believe what the Bible teaches about being adopted into the Seed of Abraham.

-the Jews apparently were incompetent slackers who could not keep the promises or the commandments of God, so now it is left to the superhuman SDA's to pick up the baton and fully suceed in sinless perfection where Israel failed!:

I must have missed this in my Bible.

Rom 2:28
For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29 But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.

Col 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond [nor] free: but Christ [is] all, and in all.

Gal 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

Rom 10:12
For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

God is Finished with the Jews and Israel? SDA's now Israel?

I don't think I have seen where anyone has made such an argument.

God has not corporately rejected the Jews. We are all being grafted into the vine, Jew and Gentile alike.

This is true! For those Jews that have not rejected Jesus Christ as Messiah (called typically Messianic Jews) God does not nor has not rejected them, nor will He. Nor does He do this to the gentiles (goyim) only.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

God is not now, nor has ever been in the business of playing favorites. Abraham was not a Jew. He was a Hebrew, of which the tribe of Juadah came forth. The promise is that we will be adopted as the Seed of Abraham, not into the seed of Judah.
 
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RND

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Night, I agree with a lot of things you've said here but I did have one question. How can you mention the Holocaust as though it were common knowledge? I consider myself quite well-read in WWII history, including the Holocaust of the Jews. Though there definitely were thoughs who knew and did nothing, the general population of the world didn't have a clue of what was happening to the Jews until the war was well underway and these so-called 'labor' camps were discovered as what they truly were.

And speaking of criticizing corrupt regimes...Stalin's regime was responsible for just as many death's as Hitler. But as the saying goes, 'the victor writes history' we don't mention that ironic piece of history since the USSR was such a vital ally in overthrowing the Reich.

Sorry everyone if this was off-topic, but I'm trying to understand NE's grounds for criticising SDAs of the time when much of the world was oblivious.

Wow! Are you sure you're only 19? Excellent.
 
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RND

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Perhaps this goes a long ways in explaining why SDA's did nothing during the holocaust nor took any action in speaking out against Hitler's corrupt regime during that time.

I wasn't born until 1962 and didn't join the SdA church until 2006. Should I be lumped in with the wrongdoings of other Adventist's that lived well before I did?

Should we condemn other denominations in a similar fashion? Should I condemn and disassociate with Roman Catholics of today because of the inquistions of yesterday? Would that be fair?

Aren't you in reality engaging in the same type of condemnation you apparently find distasteful in SdA's of the past?
 
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NightEternal

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I must have missed this in my Bible.

That's because it is not there. But make no mistake, the idea of SDA replacement theology is held buy some Trads. I have heard it with my own ears.

I don't think I have seen where anyone has made such an argument.

It's out there, believe me.
 
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AndrewK788

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Just presenting the facts of history. Do with it what you will.

Even the Adventist Review admits we dropped the ball back then. What's the problem?

Well I would say the Adventist Review is wrong as well. I don't have a problem though, except I believe the "facts of history" to be misinformed. If you would explain your belief and not simply say it's fact, I'm listening.
 
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OntheDL

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I must have missed this in my Bible.

That's because it is not there. But make no mistake, the idea of SDA replacement theology is held buy some Trads. I have heard it with my own ears.

What? Do you have this passage in your bible???

Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

To name one of few dozen verses.

Replacement theology? LOL Are you a messianic in disguise?
 
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RND

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Just presenting the facts of history. Do with it what you will.

Even the Adventist Review admits we dropped the ball back then. What's the problem?

In the article I read, which you were kind enough to post, it specifically mentioned German and Austrian Adventist's as being regretful and apologizing "any participation in or support of Nazi activities during the war." If God is big enough to accept their individual apology then shouldn't we?

The article also mentioned the great lengths and risks that other ""European Adventists" [that] took courageous stands to protect Jews, others went along in part because of concern for their families and churches." Again, do we lump everyone in the same boat?

Lastly, you failed to mention any of the great sacrifices and risks that North American, New Zealand, and Australian Adventists took during the war to help free those opposed by the Fascism of their day. Should we lump these heroic efforts into the same boat as well?

You seem competant enough to place "part" of the story on the forum. Are you honest enough to paint the whole picture?
 
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